SDHC substitute for SxS cards

Steven Thomas · October 1st, 2008, 06:09 PM

If it helps,
I've been using the Kensington and 16GB Extreme III 30MB/s and 4GB Ultra II 15MB/s for over two weeks and have not had one error in any HQ modes.

I'm looking forward to checking out the 32GB Ultra II 15MB/s.

Alex Raskin · October 1st, 2008, 06:16 PM

Steven, I'm wondering how long does it take you to offload one full 16Gb card to a PC with Kensington adapter - did you ever time it?

Steven Thomas · October 1st, 2008, 07:17 PM

I use a SDHC card reader to offload to the PC. I do not have an expresscard reader for the Kensington. The Sony SxS reader will not work with the Kensington. The Sony SxS reader is PCIe based and the Kensington is USB based.

Using a PC SDHC reader, you can expect the offload to be "almost" twice as slow opposed to the offload from the SxS reader (Sony).

I'm not really worried about this 2X transfer rate knowing that I can buy almost a DOZEN 16GB Ultra II SDHC cards for the cost of ONE 16GB SxS.

I can take my time off loading at a convenient time.

Alex Raskin · October 1st, 2008, 07:38 PM

I got 42min offload time* for a 58min footage from my adapter/card combo into PC.

Just wondering if that is normal.

On comparison, how long does it take to offload a full 16Gb SxS card, do you know?

--------
* using Shotput software, saving to 2 locations simultaneously - one local drive, another over the network. This obviously slowed things down a bit vs. offloading to just just one local drive, I suppose; but still, I thought it'd be a bit faster.

Les Nagy · October 1st, 2008, 08:23 PM

I ordered a Kensington 7-in-1 from NCIX here in Canada. The part number here is K33407CA. I have a Sandisk 2 gig Ultra II. It did not work. My EX3 comes up with an "Unknown Media" error.

So I put the Kensington in my Dell Vostro 1500 and it was recognized as a USB device. Is this what others have had the Kensington recognized as when it was installing? Read and write speed with the 2 gig Ultra II was around 9.5 mBps.

Read speed with the Sony 8 gig SxS on the Vostro was around 78 mBps and write speed was around 55 mBps.

I guess I have to try a later model Sandisk Ultra II to see if it gets recognized.

Steven Thomas · October 1st, 2008, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Raskin

I got 42min offload time* for a 58min footage from my adapter/card combo into PC.

Just wondering if that is normal.

Alex, download the Crystal Disk Mark utility I posted reference to and check your data write and read using the Kensington/SDHC combo.

Based on your numbers, it only appears around a 6MB/s or so transfer to you PC. This is horrible. It's not far from real time.
The EX capturing HQ to the Kensington/SDHC combo is hanging around an average of 4.6MB/s data write.

So, Unless there's something odd about the Kensington/SDHC card in your PC's expresscard reader, do not use it to transfer footage to your PC.

If your using SanDisk Extreme III 30MB/s cards, they can transfer to the PC at 19MB/s.
Also, the SanDisk Ultra II 15MB/s transfer to the PC at 15MB/s.

So, you can cut your transfer time by almost 3X (using the Extreme III 30MB/s) by using a simple SDHC reader. Even the Ultra II 15MB/s SDHC cards are over 2X what your doing now using the simple SDHC reader.

Erik Phairas · October 1st, 2008, 08:30 PM

Sounds like it is worth it to get the extreme III. I am leaning towards that, but I go back and forth on the subject.

Steven Thomas · October 1st, 2008, 08:52 PM

The Ultra II with the Kensington is so close to the Extreme III and cost half as less.
It makes sense to go with the Ultra II 15MB/s SDHC cards.

Alex Raskin · October 1st, 2008, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Thomas

Alex, download the Crystal Disk Mark utility I posted reference to and check your data write and read using the Kensington/SDHC combo

Mine is actually Cables Unlimited Card Reader IOC-9750 adapter + Sandisk Extreme III 30MB/s card combo.

(I do not have SDHC reader. Tried to use my Nikon D80 as SDHC reader via its USB port, but it appears to be too slow for that purpose.)

Crystal Mark readings of my adapter/card combo (5 tests):
Read Seq: 19.38; 512K: 19.17; 4K: 3.706 MB/s
Write: Seq: 15.80; 512K: 3.344; 4K: 0.033 MB/s

On comparison, SxS Sandisk card, 16Gb, rendered:
Read Seq: 99.53; 512K: 96.14; 4K: 9.84 MB/s
Write: Seq: 79.19; 512K: 7.297; 4K: 0.057 MB/s

And my laptop's C drive rendered:
Read Seq: 26.79; 512K: 15.37; 4K: 0.276 MB/s
Write: Seq: 25.48; 512K: 16.04; 4K: 0.584 MB/s

Also, I made a point of testing SxS card with exactly the same footage, exactly the same way (Shotput to 2 locations), that took 42min to offload from my el cheapo IOC/Sandisk III combo.

SxS took 37min.

So I gather, the limiting factor in my particular setup is not really the card/adapter combo but the fact that I'm offloading to 2 locations simultaneously, one being over the network.

SxS is only 12% faster in this scenario.

Erik Phairas · October 1st, 2008, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Thomas

The Ultra II with the Kensington is so close to the Extreme III and cost half as less.
It makes sense to go with the Ultra II 15MB/s SDHC cards.

Yea I think I am going to buy them in town so I can return them quickly if I get an error. My only concern is I will be using at least the 16gb carbs... you never know.

Steven Thomas · October 2nd, 2008, 06:10 AM

Erik,
Using the Kensington, you should not have an error with the 16GB Extreme III 30MB/s, or the 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s. Both of these cards have been tested by several with NO errors.

I've been using the Extreme III and Ultra II for three weeks with NO errors.

Ola Christoffersson · October 2nd, 2008, 06:17 AM

Yesterday I recieved my first 16 GB Ultra II after successfully testing the 8 GB Extreme III for more than a week.
I have since run into all kinds of strange errors and using the card is out of the question. Now - I thought this card was tested and cleared so I am hoping that I got a defective card. This is what is happening. I will do more tests as soon as I have the time.

At first the camera did not see the card at all. I tried formating it in the camera but it only went up to 76% and then gave me an error saying that it could not format the card. I then managed to format it in my laptop and after that the camera saw the card and I could record on it.
Next time I turned on the camera the slot where the card was did not report the card as mounted. I switched to playback mode and got the error message "media needs to be restored". However I never got the option to restore it.

Since then it has been working on and off. Recording seems to work well but when switching to playback mode I get media error or no clips. Sometimes my laptop also has problems seeing the card. I don't know if this is due to a corrupted file structure after having it in the camera or that this indicates a faulty card.

To sum it all up - the card is far from reliable and does not behave the slightest like my ExtremeIII 8 GB card which has been working flawlessly. Also the fact that I cannot restore the card and that the camera refuses to format the card are problems I don't recognize from this thread. Since I have been recording long clips without media errors it does not seem to have to do with the speed of the card. It is more like problems with the file structure or something similar.

What are your thoughts on this? Faulty card? How can I test it to be sure?

Paul Kellett · October 2nd, 2008, 06:30 AM

Definately sounds like a dodgy card to me.
My missus bought a memory card once,sandisk, for her mobile phone, off ebay, supposedly from a proper ebay shop.
When she took pictures (recorded) fine, no problems, but when she viewed the pics after, every pic was corrupt.
When i put this card into my desktop pc's card reader to view the pics, the desktop pc instantly crashed ! I kid you not, just instantly shut down, black screen the lot. I tried the card in another pc and that also shut down, so that was definately a dodgy card, which is why i don't buy cards from ebay or online anymore.
However i have found one ebay shop which happens to be about 1 mile from my house so i went to the shop/warehouse and bought some cards, over the counter, they all work with my EX1. Transcend 8GB and 16GB. No problems.

Paul.

Steven Thomas · October 2nd, 2008, 06:32 AM

Where did you order it?

It's been known that there are fake Ultra II SDHC cards out there, so be careful.
Also, is it the Ultra II 15MB/s version?

Check this out:
SanDisk Ultra II fakes - Google Search

You are the first to report an issue. It may be defective, or you bought a fake.

Alex Raskin · October 2nd, 2008, 07:01 AM

If Brian Rhodes is reading this... you may want to add this combo to the list of Working ones for EX1:

Cables Unlimited Card Reader IOC-9750 adapter + Sandisk Extreme III 30MB/s

Two days of testing, feels solid, no errors ever. Even did interval recording etc.
Note: switching camera from Camera to Media mode, sometimes card may not be seen. Camera says "no card". Simply pop the adapter out, then re-insert it back in; this always works and the card will become visible.

October 2nd, 2008, 06:17 AM	#432
Ola Christoffersson Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Posts: 462	Big problems with 16 GB UltraII Yesterday I recieved my first 16 GB Ultra II after successfully testing the 8 GB Extreme III for more than a week. I have since run into all kinds of strange errors and using the card is out of the question. Now - I thought this card was tested and cleared so I am hoping that I got a defective card. This is what is happening. I will do more tests as soon as I have the time. At first the camera did not see the card at all. I tried formating it in the camera but it only went up to 76% and then gave me an error saying that it could not format the card. I then managed to format it in my laptop and after that the camera saw the card and I could record on it. Next time I turned on the camera the slot where the card was did not report the card as mounted. I switched to playback mode and got the error message "media needs to be restored". However I never got the option to restore it. Since then it has been working on and off. Recording seems to work well but when switching to playback mode I get media error or no clips. Sometimes my laptop also has problems seeing the card. I don't know if this is due to a corrupted file structure after having it in the camera or that this indicates a faulty card. To sum it all up - the card is far from reliable and does not behave the slightest like my ExtremeIII 8 GB card which has been working flawlessly. Also the fact that I cannot restore the card and that the camera refuses to format the card are problems I don't recognize from this thread. Since I have been recording long clips without media errors it does not seem to have to do with the speed of the card. It is more like problems with the file structure or something similar. What are your thoughts on this? Faulty card? How can I test it to be sure?

October 2nd, 2008, 06:30 AM	#433
Paul Kellett Trustee Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Bristol UK Posts: 1,273	Definately sounds like a dodgy card to me. My missus bought a memory card once,sandisk, for her mobile phone, off ebay, supposedly from a proper ebay shop. When she took pictures (recorded) fine, no problems, but when she viewed the pics after, every pic was corrupt. When i put this card into my desktop pc's card reader to view the pics, the desktop pc instantly crashed ! I kid you not, just instantly shut down, black screen the lot. I tried the card in another pc and that also shut down, so that was definately a dodgy card, which is why i don't buy cards from ebay or online anymore. However i have found one ebay shop which happens to be about 1 mile from my house so i went to the shop/warehouse and bought some cards, over the counter, they all work with my EX1. Transcend 8GB and 16GB. No problems. Paul. __________________ Round 2 GH5,FZ2000

October 1st, 2008, 06:09 PM	#421
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	If it helps, I've been using the Kensington and 16GB Extreme III 30MB/s and 4GB Ultra II 15MB/s for over two weeks and have not had one error in any HQ modes. I'm looking forward to checking out the 32GB Ultra II 15MB/s.

October 1st, 2008, 06:16 PM	#422
Alex Raskin Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,435	Steven, I'm wondering how long does it take you to offload one full 16Gb card to a PC with Kensington adapter - did you ever time it?

October 1st, 2008, 07:17 PM	#423
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	I use a SDHC card reader to offload to the PC. I do not have an expresscard reader for the Kensington. The Sony SxS reader will not work with the Kensington. The Sony SxS reader is PCIe based and the Kensington is USB based. Using a PC SDHC reader, you can expect the offload to be "almost" twice as slow opposed to the offload from the SxS reader (Sony). I'm not really worried about this 2X transfer rate knowing that I can buy almost a DOZEN 16GB Ultra II SDHC cards for the cost of ONE 16GB SxS. I can take my time off loading at a convenient time.

October 1st, 2008, 07:38 PM	#424
Alex Raskin Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,435	I got 42min offload time* for a 58min footage from my adapter/card combo into PC. Just wondering if that is normal. On comparison, how long does it take to offload a full 16Gb SxS card, do you know? -------- * using Shotput software, saving to 2 locations simultaneously - one local drive, another over the network. This obviously slowed things down a bit vs. offloading to just just one local drive, I suppose; but still, I thought it'd be a bit faster.

October 1st, 2008, 08:23 PM	#425
Les Nagy Major Player Join Date: May 2006 Location: A Canadian in Canada, and sometimes Chile Posts: 265	I ordered a Kensington 7-in-1 from NCIX here in Canada. The part number here is K33407CA. I have a Sandisk 2 gig Ultra II. It did not work. My EX3 comes up with an "Unknown Media" error. So I put the Kensington in my Dell Vostro 1500 and it was recognized as a USB device. Is this what others have had the Kensington recognized as when it was installing? Read and write speed with the 2 gig Ultra II was around 9.5 mBps. Read speed with the Sony 8 gig SxS on the Vostro was around 78 mBps and write speed was around 55 mBps. I guess I have to try a later model Sandisk Ultra II to see if it gets recognized.

October 1st, 2008, 08:30 PM	#427
Erik Phairas Major Player Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 628	Sounds like it is worth it to get the extreme III. I am leaning towards that, but I go back and forth on the subject.

October 1st, 2008, 08:52 PM	#428
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	The Ultra II with the Kensington is so close to the Extreme III and cost half as less. It makes sense to go with the Ultra II 15MB/s SDHC cards.

October 2nd, 2008, 06:10 AM	#431
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	Erik, Using the Kensington, you should not have an error with the 16GB Extreme III 30MB/s, or the 16GB Ultra II 15MB/s. Both of these cards have been tested by several with NO errors. I've been using the Extreme III and Ultra II for three weeks with NO errors.

October 2nd, 2008, 06:32 AM	#434
Steven Thomas Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Gilbert, AZ Posts: 1,896	Where did you order it? It's been known that there are fake Ultra II SDHC cards out there, so be careful. Also, is it the Ultra II 15MB/s version? Check this out: SanDisk Ultra II fakes - Google Search You are the first to report an issue. It may be defective, or you bought a fake.

October 2nd, 2008, 07:01 AM	#435
Alex Raskin Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,435	If Brian Rhodes is reading this... you may want to add this combo to the list of Working ones for EX1: Cables Unlimited Card Reader IOC-9750 adapter + Sandisk Extreme III 30MB/s Two days of testing, feels solid, no errors ever. Even did interval recording etc. Note: switching camera from Camera to Media mode, sometimes card may not be seen. Camera says "no card". Simply pop the adapter out, then re-insert it back in; this always works and the card will become visible.