EX3 and 35 mm still telephoto lenses

Ben Ruffell · September 7th, 2008, 01:58 PM

Is Sony going to release an Alpha adaptor? To allow their Zeiss stills lenses on the EX3 directly?

Alkim Un · September 7th, 2008, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Davies

It will be interesting if the nanoflash makes this a serious professional wildlife camera.

only if EX3 gives 720 60p over HDSDI ?

alkim.

Sassi Haham · September 7th, 2008, 07:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Davies

It will be interesting if the nanoflash makes this a serious professional wildlife camera.

I wonder how a flying bird will look with 50Mbs/100Mbs ?
But those data rates are not supposed to cure wobble.
I expect to see some wobble when using very long lens (600mm) on less than perfect conditions, and while tightly tracking an animal/bird (not a constant speed pan).
Sassi

Ofer Levy · September 7th, 2008, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sassi Haham

I wonder how a flying bird will look with 50Mbs/100Mbs ?
But those data rates are not supposed to cure wobble.
I expect to see some wobble when using very long lens (600mm) on less than perfect conditions, and while tightly tracking an animal/bird (not a constant speed pan).
Sassi

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Andrew Davies · September 8th, 2008, 04:20 AM

Sassi, are you refering to wobble from compression artifacts or physical wobble from tripod panning?

Sassi Haham · September 8th, 2008, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Davies

Sassi, are you referring to wobble from compression artifacts or physical wobble from tripod panning?

Sorry for not being clear. I am referring to one of the rolling shutter effects.
I think that even with higher data rates that the XDR will introduce,
Some of the pans will show CMOS wobble.
Sassi

Andrew Davies · September 8th, 2008, 06:52 AM

So, it would appear this rolling shutter problem is a deal breaker for the EX3 as far as fast moving wildlife is concerned?

Steve Phillipps · September 8th, 2008, 06:57 AM

Well I thought there was some sort of issue when I tried an EX1, but many other people have said that it's nonsense. To repeat what I saw, when filming flying birds the background had a horrible judder to it. I then tried some slow pans as a test and saw the same sort of juddery motion, even in interlaced. And this wouldn't be a codec issue as you could see it in the viewfinder, ie before compression. But after a lot of debate I did start to wonder if I was mad!
Steve

Sassi Haham · September 8th, 2008, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrew Davies

So, it would appear this rolling shutter problem is a deal breaker for the EX3 as far as fast moving wildlife is concerned?

I hope this is not the case.
What I would like to see is a direct comparison of object tracking footage between
100Mbs CMOS (EX3) against 100Mbs CCD (xlh1), when the XDR/NANO will be available.
Steve
Read this CMOS Rolling Shutter

Steve Phillipps · September 8th, 2008, 08:54 AM

Thanks Sassi, yes I read that ages ago, and I tended to think that was the reason I had motion problem when I tested the EX1, but other definitely have different ideas! I really don't know. One thing I still believe is that there is a reason why the EX cameras are so incredibly cheap compared to their spec, and the RED too. There has to be a reason why you're getting a full raster 1920x1080 camera with 720 built in, and a lens for £6000, while you're paying £25,000 for a Sony 790 that's 1440x1080, only 25P/50i, and no lens.
Steve

Andrew Davies · September 8th, 2008, 09:06 AM

Hi Steve

What is your preferred camera for wildlife. I think you've worked on Iolo's series?

Thanks

Andy

Steve Phillipps · September 8th, 2008, 09:34 AM

Well it WAS Super 16, but that seems to be a thing of the past now!
Varicam is the standard really, more recently HDX900 and the HPX2100 and now I suppose the new 2700. Thing is, for wildlife you have to have slomo really, you just miss it so much if you're after a high quality look.
At the moment I've got a Sony F355 just for personal use really, and maybe getting a PDW700 as it has good chips plus will soon have 720/50P so ticks a lot of boxes, plus I do like the disc system.
Steve

Chris Barcellos · September 8th, 2008, 10:27 AM

Out of curiosity, when you are talking about wobble, do you find that occurs more pronounced at higher shutter speeds ?

My observation from use of a 35mm adapter (with the lowly HV20) is that the "jello" wobble effect seems to increase with shutter speeds. The vibrating adapter I used was introducing the effect at 1/48, and would increase as I took it to 1/60 and to 1/120 and higher.

September 8th, 2008, 06:52 AM	#22
Andrew Davies Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Wales Posts: 104	So, it would appear this rolling shutter problem is a deal breaker for the EX3 as far as fast moving wildlife is concerned? Last edited by Andrew Davies; September 8th, 2008 at 07:45 AM.

September 8th, 2008, 10:27 AM	#28
Chris Barcellos Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Elk Grove CA Posts: 6,838	Out of curiosity, when you are talking about wobble, do you find that occurs more pronounced at higher shutter speeds ? My observation from use of a 35mm adapter (with the lowly HV20) is that the "jello" wobble effect seems to increase with shutter speeds. The vibrating adapter I used was introducing the effect at 1/48, and would increase as I took it to 1/60 and to 1/120 and higher. __________________ Chris J. Barcellos

September 7th, 2008, 01:58 PM	#16
Ben Ruffell Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Queenstown, New Zealand Posts: 117	Is Sony going to release an Alpha adaptor? To allow their Zeiss stills lenses on the EX3 directly?

September 8th, 2008, 04:20 AM	#20
Andrew Davies Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Wales Posts: 104	Sassi, are you refering to wobble from compression artifacts or physical wobble from tripod panning?

September 8th, 2008, 06:57 AM	#23
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	Well I thought there was some sort of issue when I tried an EX1, but many other people have said that it's nonsense. To repeat what I saw, when filming flying birds the background had a horrible judder to it. I then tried some slow pans as a test and saw the same sort of juddery motion, even in interlaced. And this wouldn't be a codec issue as you could see it in the viewfinder, ie before compression. But after a lot of debate I did start to wonder if I was mad! Steve

September 8th, 2008, 08:54 AM	#25
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	Thanks Sassi, yes I read that ages ago, and I tended to think that was the reason I had motion problem when I tested the EX1, but other definitely have different ideas! I really don't know. One thing I still believe is that there is a reason why the EX cameras are so incredibly cheap compared to their spec, and the RED too. There has to be a reason why you're getting a full raster 1920x1080 camera with 720 built in, and a lens for £6000, while you're paying £25,000 for a Sony 790 that's 1440x1080, only 25P/50i, and no lens. Steve

September 8th, 2008, 09:06 AM	#26
Andrew Davies Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Wales Posts: 104	Hi Steve What is your preferred camera for wildlife. I think you've worked on Iolo's series? Thanks Andy

September 8th, 2008, 09:34 AM	#27
Steve Phillipps Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Wales Posts: 2,130	Well it WAS Super 16, but that seems to be a thing of the past now! Varicam is the standard really, more recently HDX900 and the HPX2100 and now I suppose the new 2700. Thing is, for wildlife you have to have slomo really, you just miss it so much if you're after a high quality look. At the moment I've got a Sony F355 just for personal use really, and maybe getting a PDW700 as it has good chips plus will soon have 720/50P so ticks a lot of boxes, plus I do like the disc system. Steve