To ProRes or not to ProRes at DVinfo.net

Forrest Burger · December 14th, 2007, 02:22 AM

What are the thoughts here? Will you edit in XDCAM HD, which is 8bit or go to ProRes HQ, which is 10bit? What workflow are you thinking about? Currently I digitize my V1U footage thru HDMI to ProRes HQ with good results, and grade from there.

Forrest

Paul Curtis · December 14th, 2007, 03:14 AM

I would add that if you're on a PC then i'd highly recommend looking at Prospect HD (10bit) from cineform. I don't think its realistically possible to edit .mp4, at least not in any sane workflow. I've not used ProRes but assume it's the same sort of thing.

No, i don't work for 'em but have used aspect and now prospect i don't know how i could work without them.

cheers
paul

Alister Chapman · December 14th, 2007, 03:49 AM

I always work with Pro-Res unless I plan on mastering to XDCAM MXF's in which case I use XDCAM 35Mb VBR to keep encoding passes as low as possible.

Pro-res is very robust and faster to render than MPEG. It takes a fair bit more disk space but 2 or 3 sata drives in a raid configuration will handle it with ease. If you are doing a lot of grading you can certainly see an improvement by using pro-res, but you do need to consider what you are going to do with your material at the end of the edit.

If you are going to output to HDCAM tape or similar then Pro-res works well, if your outputting HD MPEG then the advantage is minimal.

Laurence Kingston · December 14th, 2007, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Curtis

I would add that if you're on a PC then i'd highly recommend looking at Prospect HD (10bit) from cineform. I don't think its realistically possible to edit .mp4, at least not in any sane workflow. I've not used ProRes but assume it's the same sort of thing.

No, i don't work for 'em but have used aspect and now prospect i don't know how i could work without them.

cheers
paul

I can tell you're not a Sony Vegas user ;)

Dave Elston · December 14th, 2007, 11:32 AM

Hi Laurence,

I've been considering making the jump from PPro to Vegas but have been waiting to hear which of these is going to make the best match with the EX1. I have to say I'm a little reticent of continuing along Adobes seemingly perpetual ($$$) upgrade path that they pride themsleves on, but I'll save that rant for another thread.

Are you willing to comment any further on your experience with Vegas, and have you been able to test it's performance with the EX1 footage that has been made available here (ie, raw mp4 clips) ?

Thanks,
Dave.

Alister Chapman · December 14th, 2007, 12:12 PM

Forest: Your workflow is not going to produce the best possible quality. First you are decoding from MPEG to baseband then sending that over HDMI which has restricted bandwidth before re encoding to proRes. If it's top quality your after import the HDV over firewire then edit HDV with the sequence settings set to render to Pro-Res. That way any un treated material will remain in it's native state (The best quality you can ever get) while any renders will be encoded to Pro-Res. Your plan adds at least 2 stages of decoding/encoding that just aren't necessary.

Forrest Burger · December 14th, 2007, 01:30 PM

Thanks, Alister. A couple of questions, though. What about color correction and adding filters?

I'm presently working on a doc I shot in Japan with an FX1 at 1080i 60, and the video is sitting on my drives as HDV and my FCP render settings at ProRes. I want to add some Nattress film look filters to it, and do color correction. So, pretty much every shot will get treated.

My Raid 0 array can handle 8bit uncompressed HD, and after completing the edit I could re-capture to that. I have a BMD Multibridge Pro 2 with HDMI in/out and HD-SDI in/out. Right now it's a "pet" project, so I'm trying to avoid renting a Sony HVR-1500 HDV deck w/HD-SDI.

At present the deliverable is just DVD for review.

Any more suggestions?

Forrest

December 14th, 2007, 02:22 AM	#1
Forrest Burger Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Vancouver, WA Posts: 86	To ProRes or not to ProRes What are the thoughts here? Will you edit in XDCAM HD, which is 8bit or go to ProRes HQ, which is 10bit? What workflow are you thinking about? Currently I digitize my V1U footage thru HDMI to ProRes HQ with good results, and grade from there. Forrest

December 14th, 2007, 03:49 AM	#3
Alister Chapman Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire, UK Posts: 4,957	I always work with Pro-Res unless I plan on mastering to XDCAM MXF's in which case I use XDCAM 35Mb VBR to keep encoding passes as low as possible. Pro-res is very robust and faster to render than MPEG. It takes a fair bit more disk space but 2 or 3 sata drives in a raid configuration will handle it with ease. If you are doing a lot of grading you can certainly see an improvement by using pro-res, but you do need to consider what you are going to do with your material at the end of the edit. If you are going to output to HDCAM tape or similar then Pro-res works well, if your outputting HD MPEG then the advantage is minimal. __________________ Alister Chapman, Film-Maker/Stormchaser http://www.xdcam-user.com/alisters-blog/ My XDCAM site and blog. http://www.hurricane-rig.com

December 14th, 2007, 11:32 AM	#5
Dave Elston Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: UK 50i/25p Land Posts: 103	Hi Laurence, I've been considering making the jump from PPro to Vegas but have been waiting to hear which of these is going to make the best match with the EX1. I have to say I'm a little reticent of continuing along Adobes seemingly perpetual ($$$) upgrade path that they pride themsleves on, but I'll save that rant for another thread. Are you willing to comment any further on your experience with Vegas, and have you been able to test it's performance with the EX1 footage that has been made available here (ie, raw mp4 clips) ? Thanks, Dave. __________________ Play to Learn, Learn to Earn, Earn to Play... Dave - Broader Pictures

December 14th, 2007, 12:12 PM	#6
Alister Chapman Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Bracknell, Berkshire, UK Posts: 4,957	Forest: Your workflow is not going to produce the best possible quality. First you are decoding from MPEG to baseband then sending that over HDMI which has restricted bandwidth before re encoding to proRes. If it's top quality your after import the HDV over firewire then edit HDV with the sequence settings set to render to Pro-Res. That way any un treated material will remain in it's native state (The best quality you can ever get) while any renders will be encoded to Pro-Res. Your plan adds at least 2 stages of decoding/encoding that just aren't necessary. __________________ Alister Chapman, Film-Maker/Stormchaser http://www.xdcam-user.com/alisters-blog/ My XDCAM site and blog. http://www.hurricane-rig.com

December 14th, 2007, 03:14 AM	#2
Paul Curtis Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: canterbury Posts: 411	I would add that if you're on a PC then i'd highly recommend looking at Prospect HD (10bit) from cineform. I don't think its realistically possible to edit .mp4, at least not in any sane workflow. I've not used ProRes but assume it's the same sort of thing. No, i don't work for 'em but have used aspect and now prospect i don't know how i could work without them. cheers paul

December 14th, 2007, 01:30 PM	#7
Forrest Burger Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Vancouver, WA Posts: 86	Thanks, Alister. A couple of questions, though. What about color correction and adding filters? I'm presently working on a doc I shot in Japan with an FX1 at 1080i 60, and the video is sitting on my drives as HDV and my FCP render settings at ProRes. I want to add some Nattress film look filters to it, and do color correction. So, pretty much every shot will get treated. My Raid 0 array can handle 8bit uncompressed HD, and after completing the edit I could re-capture to that. I have a BMD Multibridge Pro 2 with HDMI in/out and HD-SDI in/out. Right now it's a "pet" project, so I'm trying to avoid renting a Sony HVR-1500 HDV deck w/HD-SDI. At present the deliverable is just DVD for review. Any more suggestions? Forrest