Vignette problem

Tom Hardwick · March 21st, 2008, 08:12 AM

My forum buddy Mark Weiss has just posted this:

''BTW, mine just came back from repair with a firmware upgrade that fixed the
backfocus problems. Camera is tack sharp with ND on or off, now.''

I'm assuming that tests to see if the NDs affect the focus have to be done up close and at wide-open aperture, right? Or is back focus different from this, and errors are visible at any focal length, focused distance and aperture setting?

tom.

Gerald Loidl · March 21st, 2008, 08:22 AM

Wide open aperture is a must for this test.
with ND on - Zoom in and focus on an object thats far away, close to the infinity mark. (trees are a good subject to check the focus)
Zoom out and voilá - soft image.
Best to watch it on a big monitor, but my problem can also be seen on the LCD. When I turn the focus ring to the 0.8m mark the image becomes sharper at wide open zoom.
This test can be done in under one minute.
You should also shoot a static scene with ND off and ND on and make a split screen composition in your NLE. One guy who thought his camera was perfectly fixed was very surprised by the difference between ND on and ND off... I´m convinced there is still a difference and an issue.
I do not want to bash this camera - it would be such a great camera if it would not have the backfocus issue.

Sean Donnelly · March 21st, 2008, 04:21 PM

Just swapped out my EX1 today for a SN in the 2500's, and the vignetting is better. I haven't noticed any back focus problems, although it does have the 1.03 FW. I heard from the dealer today that Sony is low on supply right now, and a new batch will be delivered sometime next month. Monday morning I'm going to call Sony and see if I can switch mine out once the new batch arrives if they are in fact any better. I should say, it is very minor, and it certainly isn't going to stop me from shooting with an otherwise amazing camera.

-Sean

Chuck Wall · March 23rd, 2008, 07:30 PM

Well I found have the backfocus issue as well and my cam was already back for the vignette fix in January. When the cam returned I gave it a quick look and the vignetting was better although not gone. I figured I would leave well enough alone since it was better. The camera was not use until last week on guess what? an outdoor shoot, and what do you think was discovered when ND was added...

This is maddening since it was already back once for 2 weeks, and from what I read in this thread it may go back and still not be right when returned.

Ill post what response I get from sony...

Chuck

Dennis Joseph · March 24th, 2008, 08:14 AM

With details off I would expect the image to be more soft when you zoom out. I'm assuming you guys are testing with details on?

Gerald Loidl · March 24th, 2008, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dennis Joseph

With details off I would expect the image to be more soft when you zoom out. I'm assuming you guys are testing with details on?

I did the test with both settings, and both are soft...

Chuck Wall · March 24th, 2008, 10:20 AM

I will check but I believe detail was on and set to 0

Sony wants me to email them stills showing the focus problem.

Chuck

Gerald Loidl · March 24th, 2008, 11:12 AM

even with detail off there should not be any difference with ND on or off at the backfocus

Dennis Joseph · March 24th, 2008, 11:20 AM

I don't know if anyone has asked this question or if it makes sense but has anyone tried "peaking" when zooming out during ND 1 and ND 2?

Would it still show peaking even if it was out of focus or would it go off?

Don Greening · March 24th, 2008, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bill Heslip

One interesting new development concerns the iris. After shooting all afternoon in manual, I powered the camera up to find the iris would not move, as if auto-iris had taken control. OK, must have bumped it. Nope. Everything was still set to manual, but it would not budge. Re-set power again and all was well. I'm willing to chalk it up to user error somehow, but this was not the first time it has happened.

Bill, just so you know, it wasn't operator error on your part because the exact same thing happened to me a while back. I thought I had pushed the magic button by mistake (auto-everything) but this was not the case. The camera had a death grip on the iris and wasn't about to relinquish control until I powered it off and then on again.

So now we know we're not BOTH going crazy and that it has to be a software thing that hopefully will be addressed in a future firmware upgrade.

- Don

ps - actually, I'm still crazy but you're ok :)

William Urschel · March 24th, 2008, 06:38 PM

My EX-1 (Serial #103707) just finally put up on the big 1080p screen was OK as far as vignetting, but displayed egregious problems with backfocus. No matter how set (Clear, ND 1 or 2), and focused sharply while zoomed out at about 85 feet, when pulled back to wide just turned the tree limbs at 85 feet to total MUSH. I fooled myself into thinking it was ok when viewed on the Sony's LCD screen, and the peaking indicated that everything was in focus. Don't be fooled: examine it as a normally large image!

I contacted Max today at B&H about the faulty unit, and B&H is taking it back and will have a replacement on my doorstep tomorrow, all at their expense, coming and going. What service!

This is the first new camera from Sony that I have had ANY difficulty with since 1991. Given the experience with many of you here, I decided not to attempt the Auto FB or to even look to see what software version was installed. And certainly at this point, I wasn't ready to send the camera back to Sony for an attempted repair, again given the adverse experience of so many of you.

If the camera arriving tomorrow also appears faulty, I won't burden B&H again. They have certainly done more than their part! At that point I'll try the Auto FB, and if that fails, contact Sony, and go back to the FX-1 (boo-hoo) for the duration.

What a shame, with an otherwise largely stunning camera. And thanks to you all for your informative posts, plus, minus, and instructional.

The only remaining issue, one way or the other, will be attempting to straighten out the issue of the original carton I'm sending back to B&H, which unfortunately has the serial number info cut out - I had already sent in a claim for the "free" battery, quite mistakenly expecting that having ordered a later delivered unit, that it would be in acceptable operating condition.

Sean Donnelly · March 24th, 2008, 07:26 PM

Funny you mention that William, I had already registered with them for the free sxs card when I decided to exchange my first one.

-Sean

William Urschel · March 24th, 2008, 10:40 PM

So Sean, were you able to effect the camera exchange with the box serial number cut off? And as far as you know, what does this do to your "free" card?

David Lorente · March 25th, 2008, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don Greening

Bill, just so you know, it wasn't operator error on your part because the exact same thing happened to me a while back. I thought I had pushed the magic button by mistake (auto-everything) but this was not the case. The camera had a death grip on the iris and wasn't about to relinquish control until I powered it off and then on again.

I've had that issue myself for a couple of times... And it is not the camera going to Auto Iris mode, because it won't react to changes in illumination, it just gets "stuck". I think it was after powering up the camera, the iris goes from the Close position to where it was when powering down, but after that, instead of releasing the power to the iris motor drive, it remains activated and doesn't move neither towards the open nor the close positions.

Sebastien Thomas · March 25th, 2008, 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Lorente

I've had that issue myself for a couple of times... And it is not the camera going to Auto Iris mode, because it won't react to changes in illumination, it just gets "stuck". I think it was after powering up the camera, the iris goes from the Close position to where it was when powering down, but after that, instead of releasing the power to the iris motor drive, it remains activated and doesn't move neither towards the open nor the close positions.

I also had this stuck iri twice. A stop/start of the camera did the trick.
But what is the point with the vignetting issue ? :)

March 21st, 2008, 08:12 AM	#646
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	My forum buddy Mark Weiss has just posted this: ''BTW, mine just came back from repair with a firmware upgrade that fixed the backfocus problems. Camera is tack sharp with ND on or off, now.'' I'm assuming that tests to see if the NDs affect the focus have to be done up close and at wide-open aperture, right? Or is back focus different from this, and errors are visible at any focal length, focused distance and aperture setting? tom.

March 21st, 2008, 08:22 AM	#647
Gerald Loidl Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Austria Posts: 122	Wide open aperture is a must for this test. with ND on - Zoom in and focus on an object thats far away, close to the infinity mark. (trees are a good subject to check the focus) Zoom out and voilá - soft image. Best to watch it on a big monitor, but my problem can also be seen on the LCD. When I turn the focus ring to the 0.8m mark the image becomes sharper at wide open zoom. This test can be done in under one minute. You should also shoot a static scene with ND off and ND on and make a split screen composition in your NLE. One guy who thought his camera was perfectly fixed was very surprised by the difference between ND on and ND off... I´m convinced there is still a difference and an issue. I do not want to bash this camera - it would be such a great camera if it would not have the backfocus issue.

March 21st, 2008, 04:21 PM	#648
Sean Donnelly Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: New York, NY Posts: 188	Just swapped out my EX1 today for a SN in the 2500's, and the vignetting is better. I haven't noticed any back focus problems, although it does have the 1.03 FW. I heard from the dealer today that Sony is low on supply right now, and a new batch will be delivered sometime next month. Monday morning I'm going to call Sony and see if I can switch mine out once the new batch arrives if they are in fact any better. I should say, it is very minor, and it certainly isn't going to stop me from shooting with an otherwise amazing camera. -Sean

March 23rd, 2008, 07:30 PM	#649
Chuck Wall Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 111	Well I found have the backfocus issue as well and my cam was already back for the vignette fix in January. When the cam returned I gave it a quick look and the vignetting was better although not gone. I figured I would leave well enough alone since it was better. The camera was not use until last week on guess what? an outdoor shoot, and what do you think was discovered when ND was added... This is maddening since it was already back once for 2 weeks, and from what I read in this thread it may go back and still not be right when returned. Ill post what response I get from sony... Chuck

March 24th, 2008, 08:14 AM	#650
Dennis Joseph Major Player Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 206	With details off I would expect the image to be more soft when you zoom out. I'm assuming you guys are testing with details on?

March 24th, 2008, 10:20 AM	#652
Chuck Wall Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Pittsburgh Posts: 111	I will check but I believe detail was on and set to 0 Sony wants me to email them stills showing the focus problem. Chuck

March 24th, 2008, 11:12 AM	#653
Gerald Loidl Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Austria Posts: 122	even with detail off there should not be any difference with ND on or off at the backfocus

March 24th, 2008, 11:20 AM	#654
Dennis Joseph Major Player Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 206	I don't know if anyone has asked this question or if it makes sense but has anyone tried "peaking" when zooming out during ND 1 and ND 2? Would it still show peaking even if it was out of focus or would it go off?

March 24th, 2008, 06:38 PM	#656
William Urschel Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bee Cave, Texas Posts: 151	My EX-1 (Serial #103707) just finally put up on the big 1080p screen was OK as far as vignetting, but displayed egregious problems with backfocus. No matter how set (Clear, ND 1 or 2), and focused sharply while zoomed out at about 85 feet, when pulled back to wide just turned the tree limbs at 85 feet to total MUSH. I fooled myself into thinking it was ok when viewed on the Sony's LCD screen, and the peaking indicated that everything was in focus. Don't be fooled: examine it as a normally large image! I contacted Max today at B&H about the faulty unit, and B&H is taking it back and will have a replacement on my doorstep tomorrow, all at their expense, coming and going. What service! This is the first new camera from Sony that I have had ANY difficulty with since 1991. Given the experience with many of you here, I decided not to attempt the Auto FB or to even look to see what software version was installed. And certainly at this point, I wasn't ready to send the camera back to Sony for an attempted repair, again given the adverse experience of so many of you. If the camera arriving tomorrow also appears faulty, I won't burden B&H again. They have certainly done more than their part! At that point I'll try the Auto FB, and if that fails, contact Sony, and go back to the FX-1 (boo-hoo) for the duration. What a shame, with an otherwise largely stunning camera. And thanks to you all for your informative posts, plus, minus, and instructional. The only remaining issue, one way or the other, will be attempting to straighten out the issue of the original carton I'm sending back to B&H, which unfortunately has the serial number info cut out - I had already sent in a claim for the "free" battery, quite mistakenly expecting that having ordered a later delivered unit, that it would be in acceptable operating condition.

March 24th, 2008, 07:26 PM	#657
Sean Donnelly Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: New York, NY Posts: 188	Funny you mention that William, I had already registered with them for the free sxs card when I decided to exchange my first one. -Sean

March 24th, 2008, 10:40 PM	#658
William Urschel Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Bee Cave, Texas Posts: 151	So Sean, were you able to effect the camera exchange with the box serial number cut off? And as far as you know, what does this do to your "free" card?