Archiving EX footage ? at DVinfo.net

Thierry Humeau · September 7th, 2007, 02:37 PM

Although, SxS memory will be drastically less expensive than P2, a full 32GB load should be around $400 to $450. That is still a bit pricey for archiving purposes. For people already owning XDCAM HD gear, it would be great if Sony would add a feature in the PDZ-1 transfer software, that would allow cloning SxS memory cards to XDCAM HD discs. Especially with the upcoming U1 USB drive, that would be a very convenient and cost effective way to archive footage. I cannot think of any other low cost, reliable and practicle way to archive XDCAM EX footage except may be use blue ray DVDs.

Thierry.

Javor Divjak · September 7th, 2007, 03:04 PM

Sorry, but they are going to be a lot more expensive than that. This is from the Sony website: "The 8GB SBP-8 will be priced around €400 and the 16GB SBP-16 around €700." That translates to $550 and $960 for a single card. Archiving footage on a SxS card would cost a fortune and is out of the question.

Chris Hurd · September 7th, 2007, 03:12 PM

Just like P2, these cards are not meant to be used for archival purposes. These are not "write once" cards... they are meant to be wiped clean and re-used over and over again. Just like P2.

Stu Holmes · September 7th, 2007, 03:16 PM

NIgel Cooper talks a little about archivign in his article here:
http://www.dvuser.co.uk/content.php?CID=171

the PDW-U1 drive comes out later this year and it can write to "Professional Disks" that have a 50-yr archival span (approx..) and are really very secure. 23Gb disks available.

The drive might be fairly expensive, but bound to be less expensive in the USA and also prices should fall a little. Looks like the best solution i'd think.

James Huenergardt · September 7th, 2007, 03:33 PM

A major downside to archiving using XDCam disks is that it downsamples from 1920 to 1440 before it writes so you will lose quality.

Maybe Sony will have a different software solution once the camera is out give the fact that the sensor is 1920.

Stu Holmes · September 7th, 2007, 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javor Divjak

Sorry, but they are going to be a lot more expensive than that. This is from the Sony website: "The 8GB SBP-8 will be priced around €400 and the 16GB SBP-16 around €700." That translates to $550 and $960 for a single card. Archiving footage on a SxS card would cost a fortune and is out of the question.

In my opinion, I think it's likely that a US streetprice for a SxS 16Gb card will be somewhere in the region of US$600.

Peter Corbett · September 7th, 2007, 11:01 PM

I would use 35gb Iomega REV disks. The are fast and cheap ($25 for newies on ebay) and will perfectly fit two 16gb SiS cards.

Guy Barwood · September 8th, 2007, 02:32 AM

Not a bad idea. As they don't contain any electronic parts (just platters) they are not suseptible to mechanical failure, just like XDCAM disks. But unlike XDCAM they are a pure file system that you just copy files to.

Thierry Humeau · September 8th, 2007, 07:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Javor Divjak

Sorry, but they are going to be a lot more expensive than that. This is from the Sony website: "The 8GB SBP-8 will be priced around €400 and the 16GB SBP-16 around €700." That translates to $550 and $960 for a single card. Archiving footage on a SxS card would cost a fortune and is out of the question.

You are right about this. I was researching prices on the web but did not know that the camera uses SxS Pro memory which is apparently quite more expensive.

Thierry.

Ray Bell · September 8th, 2007, 07:31 AM

Sony most likely will be suggesting blu-ray for archival...

the dual layer Blu-ray disks are 50gb and a read write isn't too expensive now and prices are dropping...

I found some 25gb read writes the other day for $12, snagged a few of them.

Thierry Humeau · September 8th, 2007, 07:35 AM

How fast can you write to blu-ray?

Thierry.

Greg Boston · September 8th, 2007, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ray Bell

Sony most likely will be suggesting blu-ray for archival...

Sony suggests Professional Disc for archival. Much more robust than straight blu-ray discs.

-gb-

Thierry Humeau · September 8th, 2007, 09:27 AM

So, would you just copy to ProDisc via HD-SDI or is there a way to do "file copy" like it is now possible when using the PDZ-1 utility connected to two XDCAM decks or cameras? The problem with a straight copy to HD-SDI is that you would loose all clip info and wil not be able to re-import them when using the clip-reimport feature in applications such as AVID or Vegas.

Thierry.

Greg Boston · September 8th, 2007, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thierry Humeau

So, would you just copy to ProDisc via HD-SDI or is there a way to do "file copy" like it is now possible when using the PDZ-1 utility connected to two XDCAM decks or cameras? The problem with a straight copy to HD-SDI is that you would loose all clip info and wil not be able to re-import them when using the clip-reimport feature in applications such as AVID or Vegas.

Thierry.

File copy would be the way to do it. HDSDI takes all file based options off the table as you know. HDSDI is mainly intended to facilitate access to the live uncompressed data coming from the camera head.

-gb-

George Johnston · September 8th, 2007, 02:14 PM

Sony are not the only company producing this card and it seems to me that like any format the more people using it the cheaper it will become. As you know the Express card has been adopted by Apple, Sony etc. So we have an army of laptop users to start the Express card ball rolling and when we get an influx of Sony XDCAM EX users buying the cards albeit Sony cards at first this will drive prices down and the best of all Panasonic have now reduced P2 cards and will be running scared of this new technology plus the sexy look of the EX camera so I can predict a P2 v EX card/equipment war. Why do you have a problem with archiving anyway hard drive space is now so low that you can keep all your footage on external drives, I have been doing this for the last 7 years and the only drives to give me problems have been Lacie drives running at FW800. I no longer use FW800. Lets be honest the XDCAM technology is relatively new and is no more robust than an well named/made external drive in fact the external drive has been proved to work far longer than Sony's optical version...50 years is someone's pipe dream...XDCAM will be like Betamax is now in 50 years time.

September 7th, 2007, 02:37 PM	#1
Thierry Humeau Telecam Films Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Washington DC Posts: 723	Archiving EX footage ? Although, SxS memory will be drastically less expensive than P2, a full 32GB load should be around $400 to $450. That is still a bit pricey for archiving purposes. For people already owning XDCAM HD gear, it would be great if Sony would add a feature in the PDZ-1 transfer software, that would allow cloning SxS memory cards to XDCAM HD discs. Especially with the upcoming U1 USB drive, that would be a very convenient and cost effective way to archive footage. I cannot think of any other low cost, reliable and practicle way to archive XDCAM EX footage except may be use blue ray DVDs. Thierry. __________________ Thierry Humeau, DoP Télécam Films www.telecamfilms.com

September 7th, 2007, 03:12 PM	#3
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Just like P2, these cards are not meant to be used for archival purposes. These are not "write once" cards... they are meant to be wiped clean and re-used over and over again. Just like P2. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

September 8th, 2007, 07:35 AM	#11
Thierry Humeau Telecam Films Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Washington DC Posts: 723	How fast can you write to blu-ray? Thierry. __________________ Thierry Humeau, DoP Télécam Films www.telecamfilms.com

September 8th, 2007, 09:27 AM	#13
Thierry Humeau Telecam Films Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Washington DC Posts: 723	So, would you just copy to ProDisc via HD-SDI or is there a way to do "file copy" like it is now possible when using the PDZ-1 utility connected to two XDCAM decks or cameras? The problem with a straight copy to HD-SDI is that you would loose all clip info and wil not be able to re-import them when using the clip-reimport feature in applications such as AVID or Vegas. Thierry. __________________ Thierry Humeau, DoP Télécam Films www.telecamfilms.com

September 8th, 2007, 02:14 PM	#15
George Johnston Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Scotland Posts: 54	SxS = Express Card Sony are not the only company producing this card and it seems to me that like any format the more people using it the cheaper it will become. As you know the Express card has been adopted by Apple, Sony etc. So we have an army of laptop users to start the Express card ball rolling and when we get an influx of Sony XDCAM EX users buying the cards albeit Sony cards at first this will drive prices down and the best of all Panasonic have now reduced P2 cards and will be running scared of this new technology plus the sexy look of the EX camera so I can predict a P2 v EX card/equipment war. Why do you have a problem with archiving anyway hard drive space is now so low that you can keep all your footage on external drives, I have been doing this for the last 7 years and the only drives to give me problems have been Lacie drives running at FW800. I no longer use FW800. Lets be honest the XDCAM technology is relatively new and is no more robust than an well named/made external drive in fact the external drive has been proved to work far longer than Sony's optical version...50 years is someone's pipe dream...XDCAM will be like Betamax is now in 50 years time.

September 7th, 2007, 03:04 PM	#2
Javor Divjak New Boot Join Date: May 2006 Location: Zagreb Croatia Posts: 5	Sorry, but they are going to be a lot more expensive than that. This is from the Sony website: "The 8GB SBP-8 will be priced around €400 and the 16GB SBP-16 around €700." That translates to $550 and $960 for a single card. Archiving footage on a SxS card would cost a fortune and is out of the question.

September 7th, 2007, 03:16 PM	#4
Stu Holmes Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Europe Posts: 844	NIgel Cooper talks a little about archivign in his article here: http://www.dvuser.co.uk/content.php?CID=171 the PDW-U1 drive comes out later this year and it can write to "Professional Disks" that have a 50-yr archival span (approx..) and are really very secure. 23Gb disks available. The drive might be fairly expensive, but bound to be less expensive in the USA and also prices should fall a little. Looks like the best solution i'd think.

September 7th, 2007, 03:33 PM	#5
James Huenergardt Major Player Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Chehalis, WA Posts: 513	A major downside to archiving using XDCam disks is that it downsamples from 1920 to 1440 before it writes so you will lose quality. Maybe Sony will have a different software solution once the camera is out give the fact that the sensor is 1920.

September 7th, 2007, 11:01 PM	#7
Peter Corbett Major Player Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Victoria Australia Posts: 246	I would use 35gb Iomega REV disks. The are fast and cheap ($25 for newies on ebay) and will perfectly fit two 16gb SiS cards.

September 8th, 2007, 02:32 AM	#8
Guy Barwood Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 423	Not a bad idea. As they don't contain any electronic parts (just platters) they are not suseptible to mechanical failure, just like XDCAM disks. But unlike XDCAM they are a pure file system that you just copy files to.

September 8th, 2007, 07:31 AM	#10
Ray Bell Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 1,414	Sony most likely will be suggesting blu-ray for archival... the dual layer Blu-ray disks are 50gb and a read write isn't too expensive now and prices are dropping... I found some 25gb read writes the other day for $12, snagged a few of them.