SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced at DVinfo.net

Rob Katz · September 12th, 2017, 10:39 AM

https://www.sony.com/electronics/cyb...ras/dsc-rx10m4

be well.

rob
smalltalk.productions

Rob Cantwell · September 13th, 2017, 05:23 AM

looks good, copies of the mark III should come down in price!

Dave Blackhurst · September 13th, 2017, 07:09 PM

RX10M2 is still a pretty decent camera too, hasn't come down too much in price, M3's are showing up around the $1K point...

Looks like they added a touchscreen for the first time in the RX cameras, and the upgraded AF system tweaked a little further over the RX100M5, other than that, if you don't need the focus speed/tracking or touchscreen (or the 600mm lens), the earlier versions still are pretty "state of the art", the incremental innovations are not "that" exciting, IMO...

I'm still waiting for 4k/60p, but the RX's still produce some amazing results for the price if you know how to operate 'em.

Eugen Brinzoiu · September 14th, 2017, 12:44 AM

Still missing ND filters...

Cliff Totten · September 14th, 2017, 05:24 AM

Have they finally removed the 29 minute recording limit?

I'm betting the app hack won't work on the IV like it does on all the other RX's.

Dave Blackhurst · September 15th, 2017, 08:44 PM

Unless they change the underlying "OS", which is unlikely given the evolutionary vs. revolutionary nature of the camera, the hack will more likely than not work, if the 29 minute clip limit is still there. The hack works on the RX100M5, which is just an earlier iteration of this sensor/chipset in a smaller package.

It's also likely that the hack could be modified should it be needed, hackers are resourceful like that.

Donald McPherson · September 16th, 2017, 03:42 AM

Blame us in Europe for the 29 minute stop. It becomes a video camera after 29 minutes and subject to some sort of TAX.

Dave Blackhurst · September 17th, 2017, 01:23 PM

Watched a review where the 29 minute clip limit was mentioned, so it's probably still there (bleah), but the odds are good that the hack will either work fine, or can be modified to work, IMO.

Otherwise, from the review, I likes what I sees... and I see a lot of Mk3's hitting ebay cheap, if you don't need the spiffy new features.

I've been using a RX100 series (1-5!) for a while, and it's been great, as well as the RX10 series - they do what they do, and they do it well, this looks like a good extension of the line, I just hope there will be a firmware upgrade to allow 4K/60p!

Brian Tori · December 18th, 2017, 09:16 AM

Still have my original RX10 and no plans to upgrade for a few reasons. Don't need 4K. The constant aperture lens is great. And lastly, the built-in ND filters are a must for me.

Nigel Barker · May 31st, 2018, 09:33 AM

It's really odd that Sony don't seem to retire any of these cameras. The RX10, RX10M2 & RX10M3 are still for sale new alongside the latest RX10M4. Panasonic don't still sell the GH2, GH3 & GH4 alongside the GH5

Nigel Barker · June 4th, 2018, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Barker

It's really odd that Sony don't seem to retire any of these cameras. The RX10, RX10M2 & RX10M3 are still for sale new alongside the latest RX10M4. Panasonic don't still sell the GH2, GH3 & GH4 alongside the GH5

Maybe it's just a thing with cameras with 1" sensors as I just noticed that Panasonic still sell the FZ1000 as well as the newer FZ2000.

Dave Blackhurst · June 6th, 2018, 04:50 AM

The original RX10 is getting pretty dated, but is still a decent camera that can be had at cheap prices relative to what the camera is capable of. No 4K may not matter to some people, and it's a very good stills camera.

The M2 retained the lens design, and upgraded the sensor and firmware enough that it actually is still fairly "state of the art", and if you are happy with 28-200mm, it's smaller and lighter with constant f-stop through the range, still a good camera for many purposes, and is quite similar in both tech and menus with the M3, which was mostly a lens with a lot more range on a larger heavier body. An M2 and M3 work well together, or for what each does well individually.

The M4 actually takes away the ability to hack the firmware (guess Sony didn't like people playing with the "brains"), retains the M3 larger range lens, and picked up a few sensor improvements, and a bigger price tag. Not a huge compelling upgrade if you have the M2 or M3 and it's doing the job.

The same sort of thing applies in the RX100 series (now on M5, with rumors of an M6 around the corner).

Incremental improvements, minor changes (some good, others not so much), but as a practical matter other than the first gen 1"class sensor starting to really show it's age, the RX's have established and maintained one of the few camera niches to survive the cell phone invasion, and still offer pretty decent bang for the buck. Not everyone needs "this year's model", and if last years is very close in quality (probably un-noticeable to all but a well trained eye), and cheaper, it will still sell.

To be quite realistic, with the collapse of the small camera market due to cell phones diminishing the need for most people to even have a dedicated camera we simply won't see sales in sufficient quantities to get manufacturers to push the envelope or speed up the product release cycle the way it used to be... This presumes the consumer doesn't care TOO much about image quality, but face it, since half the time they shoot in "portrait", "image quality" is not probably high on the list...),

Noa Put · June 6th, 2018, 05:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Barker

Maybe it's just a thing with cameras with 1" sensors as I just noticed that Panasonic still sell the FZ1000 as well as the newer FZ2000.

I think it has more to do with the volume they are selling, since the rx-line and panasonics fz line are more consumer oriented they are likely to outsell camera's like a gh3/4/5 by a big margin, even if they are previous versions, not all consumers need or want the latest technology and they are happy with a mark 1 or 2 if they can save some money. The gh-line are more used by semi professionals and they will buy the latest model, I think for Panasonic there is no profit to keep producing the gh3/4

Mark Rosenzweig · June 6th, 2018, 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noa Put

I think it has more to do with the volume they are selling, since the rx-line and panasonics fz line are more consumer oriented they are likely to outsell camera's like a gh3/4/5 by a big margin, even if they are previous versions, not all consumers need or want the latest technology and they are happy with a mark 1 or 2 if they can save some money. The gh-line are more used by semi professionals and they will buy the latest model, I think for Panasonic there is no profit to keep producing the gh3/4

There is another difference. I think it is fair to say that the GH5 is superior to the GH4 in every way. But the newer RX cameras are not improvements over previous models in all dimensions. For example, the announced-yesterday RX100 VI has a large zoom range lens, but it also has a narrower aperture than the shorter range lens on the predecessor RX100 V *and* the RX100 VI has no built-in ND filter, while the V does. Thus the VI is an alternative to the V (fast, shorter lens vs. slow bigger zoom), not a full upgrade. On the other hand, the VI has a touch screen, while the V does not. The loss of the ND filter is a puzzler, since the VI adds Slog3 and HLG to the Slog2 available on the V as if the RX cameras are for video (and there is also no ability to screw on filters).

Nigel Barker · June 6th, 2018, 09:32 AM

Here is a link to the announcement of the new RX100 VI with 24-200mm FF equivalent lens & HLG. It's quite a feat of engineering to include this lens in a 300gm pocket camera. In comparison the RX10 IV weighs about 1kg. Sony?s announces RX100 VI that combines high magnification zoom... - Sony Europe As before they re not retiring any of the previous RX100 models.

I mostly shoot stills nowadays & love the 1" format cameras. I have an RX10 II & an FZ1000 & was contemplating trading both of them in & purchasing an RX10 IV as I prefer the Sony but love the 400mm FF equivalent reach of the Panasonic. However I'm wondering whether the RX10 III would give me what I want at considerably lower cost especially if I were to purchase used. Is the RX10 IV really that much better than the RX10 III? The sensor features in the RX10 seem to lag the RX100 by about tear so perhaps I should get an RX10 III now & trade up to an RX10 VI when that gets released with HLG etc?

September 12th, 2017, 10:39 AM	#1
Rob Katz Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: new york city, new york Posts: 594	SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced https://www.sony.com/electronics/cyb...ras/dsc-rx10m4 be well. rob smalltalk.productions

September 13th, 2017, 05:23 AM	#2
Rob Cantwell Major Player Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Tipperary, Ireland Posts: 624	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced looks good, copies of the mark III should come down in price! __________________ http://www.robertcantwell.com

September 13th, 2017, 07:09 PM	#3
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced RX10M2 is still a pretty decent camera too, hasn't come down too much in price, M3's are showing up around the $1K point... Looks like they added a touchscreen for the first time in the RX cameras, and the upgraded AF system tweaked a little further over the RX100M5, other than that, if you don't need the focus speed/tracking or touchscreen (or the 600mm lens), the earlier versions still are pretty "state of the art", the incremental innovations are not "that" exciting, IMO... I'm still waiting for 4k/60p, but the RX's still produce some amazing results for the price if you know how to operate 'em.

September 14th, 2017, 12:44 AM	#4
Eugen Brinzoiu Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2015 Location: Laval, Quebec Posts: 87	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced Still missing ND filters... __________________ Geani66

September 14th, 2017, 05:24 AM	#5
Cliff Totten Trustee Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 1,197	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced Have they finally removed the 29 minute recording limit? I'm betting the app hack won't work on the IV like it does on all the other RX's.

September 15th, 2017, 08:44 PM	#6
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced Unless they change the underlying "OS", which is unlikely given the evolutionary vs. revolutionary nature of the camera, the hack will more likely than not work, if the 29 minute clip limit is still there. The hack works on the RX100M5, which is just an earlier iteration of this sensor/chipset in a smaller package. It's also likely that the hack could be modified should it be needed, hackers are resourceful like that.

September 16th, 2017, 03:42 AM	#7
Donald McPherson Major Player Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Aberdeen Scotland Posts: 815	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced Blame us in Europe for the 29 minute stop. It becomes a video camera after 29 minutes and subject to some sort of TAX. __________________ A little knowledge goes a long way but not long enough.

September 17th, 2017, 01:23 PM	#8
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced Watched a review where the 29 minute clip limit was mentioned, so it's probably still there (bleah), but the odds are good that the hack will either work fine, or can be modified to work, IMO. Otherwise, from the review, I likes what I sees... and I see a lot of Mk3's hitting ebay cheap, if you don't need the spiffy new features. I've been using a RX100 series (1-5!) for a while, and it's been great, as well as the RX10 series - they do what they do, and they do it well, this looks like a good extension of the line, I just hope there will be a firmware upgrade to allow 4K/60p!

December 18th, 2017, 09:16 AM	#9
Brian Tori Major Player Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Detroit, MI Posts: 408	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced Still have my original RX10 and no plans to upgrade for a few reasons. Don't need 4K. The constant aperture lens is great. And lastly, the built-in ND filters are a must for me.

May 31st, 2018, 09:33 AM	#10
Nigel Barker Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK Posts: 3,531	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced It's really odd that Sony don't seem to retire any of these cameras. The RX10, RX10M2 & RX10M3 are still for sale new alongside the latest RX10M4. Panasonic don't still sell the GH2, GH3 & GH4 alongside the GH5

June 6th, 2018, 04:50 AM	#12
Dave Blackhurst Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Apple Valley CA Posts: 4,874	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced The original RX10 is getting pretty dated, but is still a decent camera that can be had at cheap prices relative to what the camera is capable of. No 4K may not matter to some people, and it's a very good stills camera. The M2 retained the lens design, and upgraded the sensor and firmware enough that it actually is still fairly "state of the art", and if you are happy with 28-200mm, it's smaller and lighter with constant f-stop through the range, still a good camera for many purposes, and is quite similar in both tech and menus with the M3, which was mostly a lens with a lot more range on a larger heavier body. An M2 and M3 work well together, or for what each does well individually. The M4 actually takes away the ability to hack the firmware (guess Sony didn't like people playing with the "brains"), retains the M3 larger range lens, and picked up a few sensor improvements, and a bigger price tag. Not a huge compelling upgrade if you have the M2 or M3 and it's doing the job. The same sort of thing applies in the RX100 series (now on M5, with rumors of an M6 around the corner). Incremental improvements, minor changes (some good, others not so much), but as a practical matter other than the first gen 1"class sensor starting to really show it's age, the RX's have established and maintained one of the few camera niches to survive the cell phone invasion, and still offer pretty decent bang for the buck. Not everyone needs "this year's model", and if last years is very close in quality (probably un-noticeable to all but a well trained eye), and cheaper, it will still sell. To be quite realistic, with the collapse of the small camera market due to cell phones diminishing the need for most people to even have a dedicated camera we simply won't see sales in sufficient quantities to get manufacturers to push the envelope or speed up the product release cycle the way it used to be... This presumes the consumer doesn't care TOO much about image quality, but face it, since half the time they shoot in "portrait", "image quality" is not probably high on the list...),

June 6th, 2018, 09:32 AM	#15
Nigel Barker Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Norwich, Norfolk, UK Posts: 3,531	Re: SONY RX10 mk4 bridge camera/super zoom w/1" chip 24-600mm announced Here is a link to the announcement of the new RX100 VI with 24-200mm FF equivalent lens & HLG. It's quite a feat of engineering to include this lens in a 300gm pocket camera. In comparison the RX10 IV weighs about 1kg. Sony?s announces RX100 VI that combines high magnification zoom... - Sony Europe As before they re not retiring any of the previous RX100 models. I mostly shoot stills nowadays & love the 1" format cameras. I have an RX10 II & an FZ1000 & was contemplating trading both of them in & purchasing an RX10 IV as I prefer the Sony but love the 400mm FF equivalent reach of the Panasonic. However I'm wondering whether the RX10 III would give me what I want at considerably lower cost especially if I were to purchase used. Is the RX10 IV really that much better than the RX10 III? The sensor features in the RX10 seem to lag the RX100 by about tear so perhaps I should get an RX10 III now & trade up to an RX10 VI when that gets released with HLG etc?