The new SONY HXR NX70 “Water & Dust proof”

[Dean Sensui]

I like the idea it's waterproof. I wonder if it can really be flushed like that? If so, it would go a long way toward cleaning salt off the camera.

[Steve Struthers]

Neat looking cam. The overall look reminds me a lot of the JVC GY-HM100. Should be interesting to see how this camera stacks up against it and the XF100 from Canon.

[Ozzy Alvarez]

Originally Posted by Dave Campbell

Nice camera, but seems way over priced. When you can get the 700 for 1300, no way could I justify this cost to the boss.

I would be more interested in what certain stores like B & H place as the price for this camera. Sony always prices their cameras at the highest end, while Pro Camera shops like B & H, J&R, Adorama, to name a few may price the camcorder slightly lesser and also offer rebates which may bring the camera down even lower.

[Andy Wilkinson]

Originally Posted by Dean Sensui

I like the idea it's waterproof. I wonder if it can really be flushed like that? If so, it would go a long way toward cleaning salt off the camera.

I like your thinking (and having seen a little of what you shoot from time to time I can see exactly why this is of interest!) However, 'waterproof' and 'rain' (or perhaps shower) proof are two very different things (sorry to be pedantic.....). One will withstand immersion (and is often rated to a depth in meters, e.g. watches) whilst the other is more "a grey marketing term" and implies you can use it in light rain (in my book anyway). You know all this I'm sure Dean, just making sure no one gets too excited as guess which one I believe applies to this new cam - still a great idea though! I've really enjoyed using a Canon 7D in some extreme conditions (like the Arctic) because of it's excellent weatherproofing (there you go, yet another ill defined term!)

And of course there is the dust proofing claim on this new baby too that its design also brings as an added benefit - I can tell you that in some of the factory environments I sometimes shoot in with my EX3 that is a VERY BIG potential advantage/one less thing I would then need to worry about so much!

All in all, looks like a good marketing move by Sony, especially with the 1080p50/60 which is rapidly becoming a new standard/must have (and one reason why I bought an inexpensive little Panasonic TM900 recently)....Let's just hope this NX70 does not have some of the poor menu interface things and limited manual controls that seem to have partly crippled the new CX700 (from what I've read) that forms the guts of it. This thing has more buttons and seems to have independent gain control etc. so hopefully that won't be a problem at all. If those important boxes get ticked, along with good image quality once we get to see samples (but surely, it will be identical to the CX700), then Sony should be onto a winner (once the price gets discounted a bit - seems blummin pricey!). As someone already pointed out, you could buy THREE CX700s for $3,200...and I would add you could put them all in 5 penny plastic bags for rainproofing ;-)

As to it being a XF100 killer as is already being discussed on the Sony YouTube video comments, well not really. The Canon has 720p, different frame rates, lots of pro picture control abilities and of course 4.2.2. at 50 Mbps. They are aimed a different markets and different needs even though it looks like they are going to be similar in price. At it's heart the NX70 is a "souped up" prosumer CX700 cam whilst the XF100 is a "dumbed down" well respected XF300 professional cam. That's how it looks to me anyway, but it's very early days yet. Exciting times - lots of choices, great!!!!

[Ron Evans]

I guess Dave may be correct in people getting the wrong idea about the menu issue I raised.

The CX700 has a perfectly adequate menu system set up for its intended customer the consumer who most of the time will shoot in automatic. I feel it is a backward step from previous Sony cameras that in my mind had a better menu paging approach. For me, used as a second camera to my NX5U, unattended it is not as convenient as either the SR11 or XR500 which have much quicker access to spot focus which I use a lot and the CX700 default to opening page on exit meaning one has to start all again to alter more than one parameter. Not a problem for most at all but to attempt to use as a prosumer unit will require more effort than previous units. The video is lovely and the intelligent auto mode is very good so most of the time there is little need to alter any parameters manually in a consumer environment like the ski holiday I just returned from. For the whole week I left the unit in Intelligent auto active steadyshot and it was great. I used a variable ND filter when on the slopes to cut down a little light.

Shooting in the theatre on Monday evening was different and in this regard it was not as convenient to manage as the SR11 or the XR500. Picture quality in 60i was virtually identical to the XR500 as one would expect. One nice feature which may solve some of my issues with getting to spot focus is the expanded focus feature which is activated when the control is rotated and then reverts to normal magnification when released ( something that would be nice on the NX5U which has a button to engage expanded focus which has to be switched on and off)

Hopefully the NX70 will have all the manual controls I had hoped for but unfortunately I have not seen any mention of manual gain control.

Ron Evans

[Adam Palomer]

Am I reading this wrong?

The Minimum Illumination spec for this camera seems to be relatively high (i.e. not good) given the price range and overall feature set.

The brochure cites a 3 lux figure (Low LUX mode, 1/25 shutter).

Meanwhile, for example, the Canon XF100 has a 4.5 lux spec @ (1/60, +24dB) in full auto mode.

[Dave Campbell]

Ron, thanks for your post since as I was readying Andy's, I again was asking, why all the negative. Now, if the camera did not do something it was sold as doing, great. But again, for the price, I think the camera is great. If you want "pro" features, then why is anyone looking at a consumer or pro consumer camera to start with. A menu can be done lots of ways. As an engineer, there are always trade offs from ease of use to complexity. For the target market this camera is being sold to, I think it is perfect.

Andy, just wondering, how can you justify such negative comments on the camera?

Dave

[Ron Evans]

Maybe I should expand a little on the importance of spot focus for me. These little consumer cameras do not hold backfocus at all. So when they zoom the focus needs to be adjusted. In auto this is not a problem and the Sony is great having lots of auto options like tracking an object or face which it does just great. However if one is shooting a stage event and wants to move around the stage, zoom in etc then manual focus is important ( the lights going up and down will totally throw off the auto focus) so quick spot or manual focus is important. My wife uses the SR11 which has zebra ( unlike the XR500 !!) set with the control wheel on exposure and with the spot focus grid on the LCD. Easy to alter the exposure and spot focus at the same time. Once you have got to this position the CX700 is the same. However to get to Spot focus one has to press menu, camera, then scroll to spot focus, select spot focus. For the SR11 its menu,spot focus immediately. This is the basis of my menu comments as this procedure is true for all selections. If your lucky then the selection doesn't need any scrolling it is however still one more button push than before. The CX700 does have peaking and expanded focus but this is still nowhere near as fast as touching spot focus.

Once again the CX700 picture is beautiful with very low noise levels( just like the XR500 ) and at times much better than the NX5U or the EX3 we shoot with. If you really want a full manual camera with XLR PCM audio etc then buy a NX5U like I did for that very purpose. As a reporter camera left most of the time in full auto the NX70U will be great. It just seems a little pricy for me though.

Ron Evans

[Dave Blackhurst]

I think that the "negative" comes from backwards steps in menu design - it's like the Sony tripod mount guy got promoted to "menus"... It's like a pretty girl with Gilbert Gottfried's voice... it's just so jarring, it sticks out, and justifies a negative...


CX550 - press menu, up pop six items which you can customise to your taste, one touch, you're "in"! Other menu items you have to hit another button and scroll until you find what you want, but six things is pretty much enough, quick, and easy.

I gather on the CX700 Sony designers "forgot" to put a customizable menu in there, and so to find what you want, you have to press, scroll, try to remember where the specific thing you want is, and hit an extra button or two, depending on the submenu...

I know I was no fan of the XR500 "dual menu" system, which IMO was clunky, but the CX500/520/550 use a single menu system, with the aforementioned "custom" menu - very slick, very easy, and they already KNOW how to code it (it was similar on the "7" series cams, SR/CX/HC7)... WHY MAKE IT HARDER?!?!?! It worked on the older cameras, just go with it... "new" is not always "better".


The Nex3/5 was HEAVILY criticized for it's poor menus (on an otherwise well reviewed camera, no less), to the point where they released a firmware update, so "negative" noise can elicit a response from Sony. Firmware is ALL this is, just sloppy interface design, not anything else, and it's SILLY to release cameras that are more difficult to use than they need to be.

When it comes to the NX70, we all have yet to "see" the camera, so no way of knowing how well the design is implemented.

In the end, you (the user) get used to whatever menus the camera HAS, but when there is a good, effective, efficient design and the Mfr KNOWS it, then changes it around to make it less efficient, less easy to use, and clunkier... it's frustrating!

IMO Sony could "standardize" instead of trying to "innovate" and the user would be more comfortable when picking up a new or different camera, but they don't do it that way...

[Andy Wilkinson]

Spot on Dave B and Ron. If its got well thought out menus and performs as well as it's pedigree suggests, then it should be a winner - for its target market - and that probably includes me. And to Dave C, sorry if I came across too negative to you. Truth is I'm VERY interested in this cam for the weatherproofing/dustproofing reasons I mentioned earlier, if nothing else, and especially for it's 1080p50/60 - I'm just loving the Panasonic TM900 for that feature alone! (something my EX3 won't do).

I just need the price to get a bit more sensible - I won't be an "early adopter" at $3,200....or whatever that ends up being in Sterling with all our taxes and our typical UK "local pricing" on cameras.

[Dave Campbell]

Andy, I was commenting about your "that seem to have partly crippled the new CX700 " comments.
Do you have the cx700? Does the cx700 function not to its spec? If the NX70 has all the features some want, then the 3200 price might be right on.

Dave

[Andy Wilkinson]

Well I did say VERY clearly "from what I've read" (mainly from Ron) who has been very good with providing useful user information to the community about his CX700....what's your problem?

[Dave Campbell]

Andy, my "problem" is I just think it is wrong to make negative comments about something you did not try.

Dave

[Doug Tessler]

I agree if you haven't seen it or tried it how do you know . I thought the same about being negative about the Canon XF 300 and I was wrong !

Doug

[Andy Wilkinson]

The camcorderinfo review of the CX700 is now available. I post a link here as it's likely to give a good indication of how the NX70 might perform in a number of key areas since they both share similar, or identical, core components (lens, sensor etc.) from all the information that we current have so far. Like all on-line reviews, read it and make your own mind up!

Sony HDR-CX700V Camcorder Review - CamcorderInfo.com