New Sony NEX-EA50EH Announcement

[Wacharapong Chiowanich]

The lens sure will telescope out when zooming in. It's just a matter of the lens hood racking out along with it or the lens body racking "out of" the lens hood. There is no way their engineers can make the zoom this long on the tele end while keeping the lens' body length the same as in the wide position with the current optical technology. All professional ENG zooms can be made non-telescopic simply because the image circles only need to cover the sensor size of 2/3" or smaller.

[Brian Drysdale]

35mm cine zoom lenses don't telescope when the focal length is changed, with the matte box systems used it would be a serious issue if they did.

[Alister Chapman]

According to the information I have from Sony the lens is essentially the same as the 18-200mm kit lens that comes with the FS100, only re housed with a servo motor to control the zoom. All the indications are that it telescopes in just the same way.

[Alister Chapman]

Originally Posted by Wacharapong Chiowanich

The lens sure will telescope out when zooming in. It's just a matter of the lens hood racking out along with it or the lens body racking "out of" the lens hood. There is no way their engineers can make the zoom this long on the tele end while keeping the lens' body length the same as in the wide position with the current optical technology. All professional ENG zooms can be made non-telescopic simply because the image circles only need to cover the sensor size of 2/3" or smaller.

Really? There are plenty of non telescoping 35mm PL mount lenses with similar zoom ranges from Angenieux, Arri and Canon,. It can be done, it just isn't cheap. You can even add an adapter to a 2/3" lens to increase the size of the image circle to create a non-telescoping s35mm zoom. However it is much cheaper to take a varifocal dslr zoom and modify that.

[Wacharapong Chiowanich]

Yes, but real 35s cinezooms are always humongous (so that the entire lens housing can accommodate the zoom movements required by the optical groups inside). I've never seen a handholdable and compact 35s zoom.

[Brian Drysdale]

The Angenieux Optimo zoom lenses are pretty compact and have an ENG style servo as an accessory.

[Alister Chapman]

And there's the Fujinon ENG style Cabrio compact PL mount zooms the same size as most 2/3" zooms and complete with hand grip and zoom rocker. It can be done, it just requires more sophisticated elements that move relative to each other much more precisely. All of which costs money.

Lets face it, very, very few people are going to buy a $35k lens for a $4k camcorder.

[Matt Davis]

Crumbs, hasn't this little thread blossomed!

I did ask about LANC controllers - this is an E-Mount lens, so there's a manual 'switch' style zoom control on the lens, but the progressive multi-speed control that you'd get from a rocker must be communicated from the E-Mount.

So, I asked... "if I shoved one of these lenses on my FS100, and plugged my old Z1 LANC controller into the FS100, would I get vari-speed zoom from this lens?" (it wasn't quite pitched with these words, but you get the idea...).

There was a pause, and a 'yes, that sounds logical' answer. It may take another firmware upgrade to the FS100, but it would make sense.

Don't forget - this is a tweaked version of the kit lens - it shares so much in common with it.

It will turn your FS100/EA50 into the equivalent of the EX1 minus the last little bit of reach with the telephoto. Slightly better depth of field at f8 (this lens at f8 looks a little better than the EX1 lens at f2.8 regarding DoF), and that's not a bad thing quite frankly. :)

[Alister Chapman]

What I'm curious about is how will it handle focus? The 18-200mm kit lens is varifocal, so focus shifts when you zoom, this would make a servo zoom to be of little real benefit because as you zoom in and out, unless your using auto focus, the focus will change.

It is possible these days to programme a varifocal lens to shift it's focus as you zoom, this is how the EX cameras work, but that normally requires a back-focus setup routine or back focus adjustment. Most lenses only track focus accurately after back-focussing and even things like different thickness ND filters or temperature changes can upset this. I think we will have to wait and see if this new lens will track focus through the zoom range or whether you'll be forced to use autofocus to keep it in focus as you zoom.

[Matt Davis]

The EX1 lens is, if you hammer it (turn off servo zoom, whack the zoom in and out), varifocal save for a little lens element that squeaks around trying to keep things sharp.

If I do a slow creep zoom with the kit lens, the AF seems to keep up with things so long as it doesn't get distracted by the background.

So, I think - yes, the kit lens' varifocal nature will be modified to provide a sort of Parfocalness, which will be easily overcome by snap zooms, and I hope that because the AF is a co-operation between camera and lens, the offset required for NDs will be built in - but that's at the expense of slow response all round.

It will probably be an £800 lens with high profit margin, competing with your high end SD ENG lens at £8k. It will fulfil the needs of Event Videography very well, but no free lunches. We'll hear complaints of focus drift on the FS100, slow response on the FS700, and probably no complaints from the EA50 camp. :)

Still - remember the EX1's slow zoom?

[Lee Mullen]

Originally Posted by Les Wilson

Features cost money. Every feature you enable requires engineering to develop it, test it and maintain it. The more features, the more a camera costs. Additionally, you as a camera owner benefit from a manufacturer choosing model replacement timing and features. It comes in the form of resale value.

Really?? Sorry I dont agree. I suspect makers know what they are doing.

[Ron Evans]

Originally Posted by Jalan Salur

Really?? Sorry I dont agree. I suspect makers know what they are doing.

I expect you are both correct. Sony in particular are good at using essentially the same camera with features turned off as the models progress down in price. In the consumer models it is very obvious. NX5U and AX2000 are good examples. NX30 and PJ760 is another. Sometimes there is a bigger change but the core camera is the same like the NX70 and CX700.

The R&D is clearly done on the the more complex camera and then marketing dictates the feature set for the real products.

Ron Evans

[Les Wilson]

Jalan,
Building products on common components is just a smart way to produce products for different markets. A consumer product that doesn't have a bunch a features that the higher end model has is cheaper to produce so therefore it can have a lower price. Just because the "core" is the same, doesn't mean the cost is the same. A feature that requires a physical button that isn't included in the consumer camera is a physical button not need in manufacturing....it didn't have to be tested on that model for integration with other features and the support costs for handling problems and user issues with the feature are all lower.

An illustrative example of this is zebras. Soccer moms and grand parents won't use it so why should they pay for it? Not enabling saves the user testing of having in in the menus and the support costs for all the consumers that accidently turn it on and call in because their camera is broken with wiggling stripes.

Those who appreciate and want the greater functions are the ones that should pay for it and by putting the functions in the various models, manufacturers can develop products for various markets at various price points. The costs are borne by the proper market segment while the core gets borne across all markets which helps buyers in all of them.

[Ron Evans]

I agree with you Les, however the actual price has little to do with cost and more to do with market pricing. The profit margin is a reflection of how good the R & D was in meeting its intended market. Before retiring I spent my career in high tech as both VP marketing and in R & D so I am well aware of the issues of testing both in R & D and in production.

As an example I got one of the early NX5U camcorders that both suffered the back focus issue as well as the problem with FMU128 and SD card shut downs. Both were fixed under warranty but clearly one was not tested in R & D fully and the other a manufacturing testing issue !!!

I am a Sony fan, all my cameras are Sony. NX5U, CX700, XR500, SR11 and still around but not used FX1, TRV50, HC96, TRV740. even a VX3 !!! Decks DHR1000, EV-S7000 and GV-HD700/1.

None of the current batch of cameras meet my current search for a camera that my wife can use to do closeups for our shoot that is easy to use. She currently uses the SR11, uses touch spot focus and exposure control. It is getting old and compared to the others is not as good. Low light is poor compared to the others and the exposure moves in steps. I would like a camera that has good LANC controlled variable zoom,clearly has touch spot focus and with a continuous exposure control ( no steps). Maintaining focus though zoom would be nice but that is why she uses spot focus all the time now as the SR11 will not hold focus through zooming. Why not use autofocus? Shoots are in the theatre so light changes throw off auto focus all the time. All my batteries, chargers , LANC controllers etc for Sony so a Sony is at the top of my list. If the NEX-EA50EH meets these it may well be interesting and would be an alternate to my NX5U sometimes too.

Ron Evans

[Chris Barcellos]

Originally Posted by Ron Evans

.with features turned off as the models progress down in price. .

The R&D is clearly done on the the more complex camera and then marketing dictates the feature set for the real products.

Ron Evans

Too bad this wasn't the rule with the VG20. Nex 5n and 7n sported scene profile settings which included ability to adjust saturation, sharpness and contrast. Same with the Nex VG10. VG20 shows up, without it, while Sony advertizing actually included it. Of course, the next level up, the FS100 has it again.

Why is it missing in only one camera in the line ? It was obviously a deliberate move to protect from a threat Sony perceived and had nothing to do with higher price options.