Sony Z7 with CF card recording at DVinfo.net

Tony Spring · November 14th, 2007, 02:47 AM

http://www.film-tv-video.de/newsdeta...5Byear%5D=2007

Found this German site with photos and text which i cant read. Looks like the new Sony HDV handheld with interchangeable lenses can record to CF cards too!

Sean Seah · November 14th, 2007, 04:52 AM

http://translate.google.com/translat...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

Jack Zhang · November 14th, 2007, 05:06 AM

Japanese source: http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/do...1114/sony1.htm

3 ClearVid CMOS with Exmor technology... This does not necessarily mean the speed will be as fast as the real Exmors in the EX1. I guessing this camera will still have rolling shutter problems like the previous ClearVid CMOS cameras before it. It's more likely the technology be used for NR.

Colin Zhang · November 14th, 2007, 05:13 AM

Here is the official article on Sony UK's Website: http://www.sonybiz.net/biz/view/Show...=1193315635243

Looks like a great cam, wonder what price the Z7 will be at. I also heard that the shoulder-mount takes full-size HDV tapes.

Jack Zhang · November 14th, 2007, 05:19 AM

Japanese price is listed in the Japanese article.

Peter Jefferson · November 14th, 2007, 07:59 AM

My German is a bit rough.

Wow... Sony reckon it will be compatible with the Sony Alpha range of DSLR lenses... there's also a built in live histogram. Aside from that, I don't know why they bothered with DVCam. With the CF recording, there is no mention of how many slots/cards it supports any any one time. Obviously dropouts are a major issue with HDV (knock on wood), I'm yet to have one at a critical moment) considering the need to include Solid State.

Another thing that wasn't explained was whether or not it supported straight to CF recording (i.e. no tape) or pre-roll recording.

Also, I'm baffled as to why they didn't have an internal connection for SDI to CF (aside from cost of course) considering the CF connection is built in.

Colin Zhang · November 14th, 2007, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Jefferson

My German is a bit rough.

Wow... Sony reckon it will be compatible with the Sony Alpha range of DSLR lenses... there's also a built in live histogram. Aside from that, I don't know why they bothered with DVCam. With the CF recording, there is no mention of how many slots/cards it supports any any one time. Obviously dropouts are a major issue with HDV (knock on wood), I'm yet to have one at a critical moment) considering the need to include Solid State.

Another thing that wasn't explained was whether or not it supported straight to CF recording (i.e. no tape) or pre-roll recording.

Also, I'm baffled as to why they didn't have an internal connection for SDI to CF (aside from cost of course) considering the CF connection is built in.

It supports HDV/DV straight to CF recording as well as DVCAM for the good ol' tape, possibly at the same time. That also answered your question about DVCAM, its because the Z7 also records to tape. The a series DSLR lenses work with an adaptor. It is also compatible with 1/2" or possibly even 2/3" lenses with a special adaptor. There is actually more specific info on the preliminary information page on the Sony UK site.

Peter Jefferson · November 14th, 2007, 08:19 PM

Oh its clear that dual recording to tape and card is there, but there was no menion of a tapeless recording option.

In addition, just thinking out loud here, but I would really hate to see what the crop factor would be when mounting a DSLR lens on this thing.. More than likely it would be anything between 7x to 8x crop factor (i.e. 50mm turns to something like 300mm+)

Barry Richard · November 16th, 2007, 03:40 AM

this is surely not the right forum for this thread -- but I've been away for awhile, and I don't know where else to put it.

I handled the Sony HVR-Z7U today at the GV Expo in Wash DC.

Last year I passsed on the Sony HDV cameras (after being an only Sony guy forever) and got the XHA1.

If I was deciding on a camera today, I would without doubt get HVR-Z7U (despite it costing maybe twice what you can get the XHA1 for.)

The HVR-Z7U is the best package I have ever seen in a camera.

I'll just mention a few things that I recall:

Beautiful pictures (of course)

Though it has a fat removable zeis zoom bayonetted to it, the camera felt comfortably balanced on my wrist. I sensed no front forward stress because Sony adjusted the grip and body balance for excelent user comfort.

A standard non proprietary CF recorder ships with every HVR-Z7U. The camera mini-dv HDV recorder can automatically record when the CF cards runs out. Love it.

In low light they say its as sensitive and quiet as a PD 170.

The zoom instantly converts between auto and manual focus with hard stops, simply by pulling on the focus ring. Manual adjustment is possible while in autofocus.

1080P/i, 24P, 50P (though not 50i, because of greymarket export concerns)

Live focus assist -- making it possible to engage focus assist while video is being recorded (something I have always wanted).

Manual zoom and iris rings.

The camera can be adapted to take SLR and prime lenses.

The cmos chips are read in a new faster and more accurate way that prevents the distortion that can be produced by a rolling shutter during a fast pan, or with fast moving subjects.

VERY sharp and big external LCD

2 XLRs w/limiters.

Uses standard 970 batteries that can go 4+ hrs.

At least 3 shoe / attachment points

Many many external switches for controling everything.

Approx $6500 with lens and CF Recorder.

If someone gave me enough for my A1, I'd be tempted to make the switch

Don Palomaki · November 16th, 2007, 07:17 AM

See the new HVR-Z7 forum.

Philip Williams · November 16th, 2007, 12:30 PM

No doubt about it, its a nice looking cam! I love the CF recording and I hope that off-the-shelf solid state recording is something Canon incorporates on the next XH versions.

I know its said a lot, but these are really good times for people looking to buy a camcorder. From $800 to $6800, whatever the budget is, you're bound to be able to find something that'll knock your socks off.

Dirk Bouwen · November 16th, 2007, 12:47 PM

It all looks fantastic once again... but on which track is Sony now?

How many different systems - even for HD - do they have in place? What is Sony's strategy on solid state now, with this new challenge on the horizon: recording on CF cards, not on propriety?

Are even the pro's not getting a bit saturated with very different workflows and solutions, and lots of hardware, degrading in a few months time?

What we see happening here proofs at least one thing: AVCHD still seems to be intended for Sony's consumer cams only, at least at this moment.

Chris Hurd · November 16th, 2007, 02:48 PM

Moved from Canon XH to Sony Z7 / S270.

John Arnold Ph.D. · November 16th, 2007, 04:19 PM

I cannot accept that there is a technical necessity or niches for all these different HD cameras, just as I do not think that we need three different gaming platforms. So, it must me marketing? If so will it work? Nonetheless, it must costly to develop and produce all of these different types of Sony cameras. I have just left Sony for the Canon A1 and this new Sony does nothing to change my mind, not to mention my pocket book!

Alexander Ibrahim · November 16th, 2007, 04:41 PM

I was less impressed. This is probably because the camera is not aimed at me or my work.

This is an HDV camera, with an MSRP very close to the EX1.

With the exception of the shape of the camera, SDI and the fact that it has two audio inputs, this camera seems to be technically identical to the HVR-270U. Same sensors, lens mount, lens, CF reader, menus... same.

It has good sensors, but they are 1/3" inch. They had a tendency to bloom on hot subjects, but otherwise were quite satisfactory. A definite improvement over most 1/3" HDV sensors- possibly all, but I haven't compared them critically.

I found the colors to be desaturated. I didn't have time to mess with the controls to see if I could correct this in camera.

I was judging the camera on some LUMA LCD's Sony had set up next to the cameras. Admittedly I spent a lot more time with the HVR-270U- but as I said they have the same imaging block.

The main advantage it has for event shooters is that it records to HDV tape and CF cards. It will rollover between card and tape... so you can get continuous shooting.

The Zeiss lens was not that great. The controls left a great deal to be desired. I really disliked the iris control as it was a spin forever control. (why? I don't know.) They are still prototypes, so we shouldn't be too judgmental.

Fortunately the lens is interchangeable. Furthermore it has the same 1/3" mounts as the JVC ProHD cameras- so you can get some much better lenses. I like the notion of a developing market for standard 1/3" glass.

I have pictures, I'll put them up later.

I'd be more impressed if Sony decides to sell this camera as a "body only."

November 14th, 2007, 02:47 AM	#1
Tony Spring Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: london UK Posts: 170	Sony Z7 with CF card recording http://www.film-tv-video.de/newsdeta...5Byear%5D=2007 Found this German site with photos and text which i cant read. Looks like the new Sony HDV handheld with interchangeable lenses can record to CF cards too! __________________ www.springproductions.co.uk

November 14th, 2007, 05:13 AM	#4
Colin Zhang Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: beijing/mississauga Posts: 123	Here is the official article on Sony UK's Website: http://www.sonybiz.net/biz/view/Show...=1193315635243 Looks like a great cam, wonder what price the Z7 will be at. I also heard that the shoulder-mount takes full-size HDV tapes. Last edited by Colin Zhang; November 14th, 2007 at 05:14 AM. Reason: q about price

November 16th, 2007, 03:40 AM	#9
Barry Richard Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 60	the Sony HVR-Z7U this is surely not the right forum for this thread -- but I've been away for awhile, and I don't know where else to put it. I handled the Sony HVR-Z7U today at the GV Expo in Wash DC. Last year I passsed on the Sony HDV cameras (after being an only Sony guy forever) and got the XHA1. If I was deciding on a camera today, I would without doubt get HVR-Z7U (despite it costing maybe twice what you can get the XHA1 for.) The HVR-Z7U is the best package I have ever seen in a camera. I'll just mention a few things that I recall: Beautiful pictures (of course) Though it has a fat removable zeis zoom bayonetted to it, the camera felt comfortably balanced on my wrist. I sensed no front forward stress because Sony adjusted the grip and body balance for excelent user comfort. A standard non proprietary CF recorder ships with every HVR-Z7U. The camera mini-dv HDV recorder can automatically record when the CF cards runs out. Love it. In low light they say its as sensitive and quiet as a PD 170. The zoom instantly converts between auto and manual focus with hard stops, simply by pulling on the focus ring. Manual adjustment is possible while in autofocus. 1080P/i, 24P, 50P (though not 50i, because of greymarket export concerns) Live focus assist -- making it possible to engage focus assist while video is being recorded (something I have always wanted). Manual zoom and iris rings. The camera can be adapted to take SLR and prime lenses. The cmos chips are read in a new faster and more accurate way that prevents the distortion that can be produced by a rolling shutter during a fast pan, or with fast moving subjects. VERY sharp and big external LCD 2 XLRs w/limiters. Uses standard 970 batteries that can go 4+ hrs. At least 3 shoe / attachment points Many many external switches for controling everything. Approx $6500 with lens and CF Recorder. If someone gave me enough for my A1, I'd be tempted to make the switch

November 16th, 2007, 07:17 AM	#10
Don Palomaki Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Northern VA Posts: 4,488	See the new HVR-Z7 forum. __________________ dpalomaki@dspalomaki.com

November 16th, 2007, 12:30 PM	#11
Philip Williams Major Player Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Snellville, Georgia Posts: 614	No doubt about it, its a nice looking cam! I love the CF recording and I hope that off-the-shelf solid state recording is something Canon incorporates on the next XH versions. I know its said a lot, but these are really good times for people looking to buy a camcorder. From $800 to $6800, whatever the budget is, you're bound to be able to find something that'll knock your socks off. __________________ www.philipwilliams.com

November 14th, 2007, 04:52 AM	#2
Sean Seah Trustee Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,498	http://translate.google.com/translat...hl=en&ie=UTF-8

November 14th, 2007, 05:06 AM	#3
Jack Zhang Inner Circle Join Date: May 2005 Location: Burnaby, BC, Canada Posts: 3,053	Japanese source: http://www.watch.impress.co.jp/av/do...1114/sony1.htm 3 ClearVid CMOS with Exmor technology... This does not necessarily mean the speed will be as fast as the real Exmors in the EX1. I guessing this camera will still have rolling shutter problems like the previous ClearVid CMOS cameras before it. It's more likely the technology be used for NR.

November 14th, 2007, 05:19 AM	#5
Jack Zhang Inner Circle Join Date: May 2005 Location: Burnaby, BC, Canada Posts: 3,053	Japanese price is listed in the Japanese article.

November 14th, 2007, 07:59 AM	#6
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	My German is a bit rough. Wow... Sony reckon it will be compatible with the Sony Alpha range of DSLR lenses... there's also a built in live histogram. Aside from that, I don't know why they bothered with DVCam. With the CF recording, there is no mention of how many slots/cards it supports any any one time. Obviously dropouts are a major issue with HDV (knock on wood), I'm yet to have one at a critical moment) considering the need to include Solid State. Another thing that wasn't explained was whether or not it supported straight to CF recording (i.e. no tape) or pre-roll recording. Also, I'm baffled as to why they didn't have an internal connection for SDI to CF (aside from cost of course) considering the CF connection is built in.

November 14th, 2007, 08:19 PM	#8
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Oh its clear that dual recording to tape and card is there, but there was no menion of a tapeless recording option. In addition, just thinking out loud here, but I would really hate to see what the crop factor would be when mounting a DSLR lens on this thing.. More than likely it would be anything between 7x to 8x crop factor (i.e. 50mm turns to something like 300mm+)

November 16th, 2007, 12:47 PM	#12
Dirk Bouwen Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: AC, Belgium Posts: 75	It all looks fantastic once again... but on which track is Sony now? How many different systems - even for HD - do they have in place? What is Sony's strategy on solid state now, with this new challenge on the horizon: recording on CF cards, not on propriety? Are even the pro's not getting a bit saturated with very different workflows and solutions, and lots of hardware, degrading in a few months time? What we see happening here proofs at least one thing: AVCHD still seems to be intended for Sony's consumer cams only, at least at this moment.

November 16th, 2007, 02:48 PM	#13
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Moved from Canon XH to Sony Z7 / S270. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

November 16th, 2007, 04:19 PM	#14
John Arnold Ph.D. New Boot Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Vancouver, B.C. Posts: 17	Successful or doomed marketing strategy? I cannot accept that there is a technical necessity or niches for all these different HD cameras, just as I do not think that we need three different gaming platforms. So, it must me marketing? If so will it work? Nonetheless, it must costly to develop and produce all of these different types of Sony cameras. I have just left Sony for the Canon A1 and this new Sony does nothing to change my mind, not to mention my pocket book!

November 16th, 2007, 04:41 PM	#15
Alexander Ibrahim Major Player Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Washington D.C. Metro Area Posts: 384	I handled the Z7U today as well I was less impressed. This is probably because the camera is not aimed at me or my work. This is an HDV camera, with an MSRP very close to the EX1. With the exception of the shape of the camera, SDI and the fact that it has two audio inputs, this camera seems to be technically identical to the HVR-270U. Same sensors, lens mount, lens, CF reader, menus... same. It has good sensors, but they are 1/3" inch. They had a tendency to bloom on hot subjects, but otherwise were quite satisfactory. A definite improvement over most 1/3" HDV sensors- possibly all, but I haven't compared them critically. I found the colors to be desaturated. I didn't have time to mess with the controls to see if I could correct this in camera. I was judging the camera on some LUMA LCD's Sony had set up next to the cameras. Admittedly I spent a lot more time with the HVR-270U- but as I said they have the same imaging block. The main advantage it has for event shooters is that it records to HDV tape and CF cards. It will rollover between card and tape... so you can get continuous shooting. The Zeiss lens was not that great. The controls left a great deal to be desired. I really disliked the iris control as it was a spin forever control. (why? I don't know.) They are still prototypes, so we shouldn't be too judgmental. Fortunately the lens is interchangeable. Furthermore it has the same 1/3" mounts as the JVC ProHD cameras- so you can get some much better lenses. I like the notion of a developing market for standard 1/3" glass. I have pictures, I'll put them up later. I'd be more impressed if Sony decides to sell this camera as a "body only." __________________ Alexander Ibrahim http://www.alexanderibrahim.net Last edited by Alexander Ibrahim; November 16th, 2007 at 04:45 PM. Reason: incomplete sentence/paragraph.