redering for computer use, deinterlace or not ? Premiere CS3 few other questions :) at DVinfo.net

Michael Standley · June 21st, 2010, 03:09 PM

**if you want to go strait to the questions please scroll down**

First off can I say thank you for all the good information i have read so far. I have spend many hours in the last 2 weeks reading post and learning about my new camera. I was going to ask a few questions I still have left that I have not found yet. I think I might not be searching with the right keywords.

I use Adobe Premiere CS3 (I got the master collecting 2 years ago for a good price) I have watch many of the lessons on Lynda.com to help my wife create some dance video's for her studio.
I now bought the FX1000 to use filming our recitals and to use in class to help promote the studio more.
I have only done a little filming, but have been playing with the settings and learning alot from this forum on several settings for low light.

Preface to question:
I have spent a fair amount of time getting VERY annoyed at the Lines on dancer when i rendered some recording to show my wife. I have been told and read it is the interlace showing up on my computer ( have a computer in the front room hooked up to a Platonics projector) I tried several different setting of rendering to try to rid myself of the problems (I read this would not show up on the DVD as the players have a chip to interlace properly). Finally i found the Field options while reading on the about deinterlance and removing the lines. While this helped some the quality was not what i was watching in premiere.

QUESTION:
1.What are some settings to render from the 1080 60i to watch it on the computer and upload to video sites ?

2. In field options when do you want to "always Deinterlace" as apposed to leaving it interlaced.

3. When i export to Adobe Media Encoder and i select H.264 as format many of the presets give and option for Field Order. If you select None (progressive).... is a good way to remove the lines ?

4. I guess I am just trying to render out a video that looks as smooth as what I'm watch in the NLE.

Last not related to above

5. Would it work well to find someone in my area that needs an extra camcorder for shoots so I could borrower theirs for the same reason. (i could like to use 2 at the rectitals, one to set up in the back and one to zoom and pan with). I ask you this because would you find this helpful or take and offer like this in your area ? If so and you are in Utah let me know :) (Provo/Salt Lake City)

Thank you for your time and help. I don't mind searching myself, I am just needing a little help, if the post is already here, let me know your search term so i can start to find myself.

Claire Buckley · June 30th, 2010, 10:55 AM

Hi Michael.

I'm a CS4 user, but I think the Media >> Export feature is somewhat the same.

Essentially: if it's for PC or web playback then use "None - Progressive" for the Field Order when exporting. And Upper Field if you wish to retain the interlace format if your material playback is intended for TV.

Your original material is interlaced, so you need to select "Progressive" for export for PC or Video sites.

You also have another option underneath the field selction option:

"Pixel Aspect Ratio"

I edit in HDV 1440x1080i (anamorphic 1.33) so I use 16:9 ratio. If your format is 1920x1080, I think I would be correct in saying use the "square pixel" ratio for uploading to video websites - but you can experiment with this.

Don't forget Blu Ray too is an interlaced format so you won't have the field option if you have chosen the Blu Ray preset.

John Wiley · June 30th, 2010, 06:14 PM

I've noticed alot more interlacing problems since switching to HDV from DV a few years ago. In my case I think perhaps it has something to do with the field order for HDV being opposite to PAL and so when I down-convert for DVD export everything goes wrong. Even on the final DVD the interlace lines would show up and sometimes it looked as though the field order was backwards and stuttering. In Vegas Pro my solution was to set all the project settings to be progressive and use the "interpolate fields" method. This got rid of my interlace lines at the expense of some sharpness.

Now I've switched to Premiere and, Halfway through my a wedding edit a few days ago, realised I might have the same issue in CS3 that I was originally having in Vegas. And Premiere, unlike Vegas, does not seem to let you change the project properties half-way through. So I'm hoping that the 50i timeline I'm working on does not have any issues once I render out. If I do have problems, I'll get back to you with whatever solution I come up with.

Leslie Wand · July 1st, 2010, 05:45 AM

in vegas all i've ever done (for 10+ years) is match my tl to my source footage (eg. hdv) then edit away to my hearts (or clients) delight.

come time to render i simply pick whatever i want to render to and bingo, all done with never a interlace / frame rate problem.

i think a lot of people are making heavy weather of what should be a simple process (UNLESS you're mixing formats on the tl, in which case, all bets are off!)

John Wiley · July 7th, 2010, 12:58 AM

Leslie, when I tried that in Vegas 8 Pro it just wouldn't seem to work out.

I tried different workflows thinking maybe somwhere in the downconversion process something was going wrong to reverse the field order.

I tried rendering straight to mpeg2 PAL DVD preset.
I tried rendering straight to mpeg2 PAL DVD preset with reversed field order.
I tried rendering to mpeg2 HDV 1440x1080 preset, then re-importing and rendering to mpeg 2.
I tried rendernig to DV-PAL, reimporting and then rendering to mpeg2 PAL DVD preset.

There were always very obvious interlace lines on any movement. They got worse and more obvious any time the footage had been zoomed, slowed down or reversed.

In Vegas I had the solution figured out and was happy to live with things that way but now I've switched back to Premiere and am worried I'll have similar problems when I export.

So far the only way I've found to de-interlace the footage is to go to clip>video options>field options>always deinterlace. However, you have to do this for every single clip on the timeline so it is not a very efficient way to work. There must be some other way to deinterlace the whole timeline?

Leslie Wand · July 7th, 2010, 02:08 AM

hi john,

i really can't remember doing anything else in 8 either...... but then again, at over 60 i can't even remember where my keyboard is sometimes ;-)

i know what you're talking about though - i see it sometimes in some of my students work (most use mm2 to edit). however, in vegas only when i've mixed different formats on the tl.

however, if i'm working with straight hdv (and no other video footage, eg. avchd), and start the project by pointing properties (video) to the tape, i can happily edit away and then use any preset (ex dvd ws, ntsc, mp4, etc.,) to render out to WITHOUT any frame / interlace problems at all....

John Wiley · July 7th, 2010, 02:24 AM

Hmmm... Interesting.

Let's hope I have the same result with in Premiere that you do in Vegas!

June 21st, 2010, 03:09 PM	#1
Michael Standley New Boot Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Springville, UT Posts: 14	redering for computer use, deinterlace or not ? Premiere CS3 few other questions :) if you want to go strait to the questions please scroll down First off can I say thank you for all the good information i have read so far. I have spend many hours in the last 2 weeks reading post and learning about my new camera. I was going to ask a few questions I still have left that I have not found yet. I think I might not be searching with the right keywords. I use Adobe Premiere CS3 (I got the master collecting 2 years ago for a good price) I have watch many of the lessons on Lynda.com to help my wife create some dance video's for her studio. I now bought the FX1000 to use filming our recitals and to use in class to help promote the studio more. I have only done a little filming, but have been playing with the settings and learning alot from this forum on several settings for low light. Preface to question: I have spent a fair amount of time getting VERY annoyed at the Lines on dancer when i rendered some recording to show my wife. I have been told and read it is the interlace showing up on my computer ( have a computer in the front room hooked up to a Platonics projector) I tried several different setting of rendering to try to rid myself of the problems (I read this would not show up on the DVD as the players have a chip to interlace properly). Finally i found the Field options while reading on the about deinterlance and removing the lines. While this helped some the quality was not what i was watching in premiere. QUESTION: 1.What are some settings to render from the 1080 60i to watch it on the computer and upload to video sites ? 2. In field options when do you want to "always Deinterlace" as apposed to leaving it interlaced. 3. When i export to Adobe Media Encoder and i select H.264 as format many of the presets give and option for Field Order. If you select None (progressive).... is a good way to remove the lines ? 4. I guess I am just trying to render out a video that looks as smooth as what I'm watch in the NLE. Last not related to above 5. Would it work well to find someone in my area that needs an extra camcorder for shoots so I could borrower theirs for the same reason. (i could like to use 2 at the rectitals, one to set up in the back and one to zoom and pan with). I ask you this because would you find this helpful or take and offer like this in your area ? If so and you are in Utah let me know :) (Provo/Salt Lake City) Thank you for your time and help. I don't mind searching myself, I am just needing a little help, if the post is already here, let me know your search term so i can start to find myself.

June 30th, 2010, 10:55 AM	#2
Claire Buckley Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: UK Posts: 176	Hi Michael. I'm a CS4 user, but I think the Media >> Export feature is somewhat the same. Essentially: if it's for PC or web playback then use "None - Progressive" for the Field Order when exporting. And Upper Field if you wish to retain the interlace format if your material playback is intended for TV. Your original material is interlaced, so you need to select "Progressive" for export for PC or Video sites. You also have another option underneath the field selction option: "Pixel Aspect Ratio" I edit in HDV 1440x1080i (anamorphic 1.33) so I use 16:9 ratio. If your format is 1920x1080, I think I would be correct in saying use the "square pixel" ratio for uploading to video websites - but you can experiment with this. Don't forget Blu Ray too is an interlaced format so you won't have the field option if you have chosen the Blu Ray preset. __________________ Women don't hit harder, they just hit lower!

June 30th, 2010, 06:14 PM	#3
John Wiley Trustee Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Byron Bay, Australia Posts: 1,155	I've noticed alot more interlacing problems since switching to HDV from DV a few years ago. In my case I think perhaps it has something to do with the field order for HDV being opposite to PAL and so when I down-convert for DVD export everything goes wrong. Even on the final DVD the interlace lines would show up and sometimes it looked as though the field order was backwards and stuttering. In Vegas Pro my solution was to set all the project settings to be progressive and use the "interpolate fields" method. This got rid of my interlace lines at the expense of some sharpness. Now I've switched to Premiere and, Halfway through my a wedding edit a few days ago, realised I might have the same issue in CS3 that I was originally having in Vegas. And Premiere, unlike Vegas, does not seem to let you change the project properties half-way through. So I'm hoping that the 50i timeline I'm working on does not have any issues once I render out. If I do have problems, I'll get back to you with whatever solution I come up with.

July 1st, 2010, 05:45 AM	#4
Leslie Wand Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: upper hunter, australia Posts: 1,410	in vegas all i've ever done (for 10+ years) is match my tl to my source footage (eg. hdv) then edit away to my hearts (or clients) delight. come time to render i simply pick whatever i want to render to and bingo, all done with never a interlace / frame rate problem. i think a lot of people are making heavy weather of what should be a simple process (UNLESS you're mixing formats on the tl, in which case, all bets are off!)

July 7th, 2010, 12:58 AM	#5
John Wiley Trustee Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Byron Bay, Australia Posts: 1,155	Leslie, when I tried that in Vegas 8 Pro it just wouldn't seem to work out. I tried different workflows thinking maybe somwhere in the downconversion process something was going wrong to reverse the field order. I tried rendering straight to mpeg2 PAL DVD preset. I tried rendering straight to mpeg2 PAL DVD preset with reversed field order. I tried rendering to mpeg2 HDV 1440x1080 preset, then re-importing and rendering to mpeg 2. I tried rendernig to DV-PAL, reimporting and then rendering to mpeg2 PAL DVD preset. There were always very obvious interlace lines on any movement. They got worse and more obvious any time the footage had been zoomed, slowed down or reversed. In Vegas I had the solution figured out and was happy to live with things that way but now I've switched back to Premiere and am worried I'll have similar problems when I export. So far the only way I've found to de-interlace the footage is to go to clip>video options>field options>always deinterlace. However, you have to do this for every single clip on the timeline so it is not a very efficient way to work. There must be some other way to deinterlace the whole timeline?

July 7th, 2010, 02:08 AM	#6
Leslie Wand Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: upper hunter, australia Posts: 1,410	hi john, i really can't remember doing anything else in 8 either...... but then again, at over 60 i can't even remember where my keyboard is sometimes ;-) i know what you're talking about though - i see it sometimes in some of my students work (most use mm2 to edit). however, in vegas only when i've mixed different formats on the tl. however, if i'm working with straight hdv (and no other video footage, eg. avchd), and start the project by pointing properties (video) to the tape, i can happily edit away and then use any preset (ex dvd ws, ntsc, mp4, etc.,) to render out to WITHOUT any frame / interlace problems at all....

July 7th, 2010, 02:24 AM	#7
John Wiley Trustee Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Byron Bay, Australia Posts: 1,155	Hmmm... Interesting. Let's hope I have the same result with in Premiere that you do in Vegas!