MRC-1 missing frames

Bill Ackerman · June 16th, 2009, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Laves

The ONLY way that I have been able to get the utility to work is if the files are still on the original CF card. My Sony utilty program will not even recognize anything at all, if the clips have been copied to any other drive or storage medium. I shot a ballet recently and each act was almost an hour long. I pulled the cards right out of the camera and ran everything through the utility. It worked perfectly. And when I went to put them on the timeline, 6 - 20+ minutes clips became 2 - 1 hour clips.

Yes, that is what I experienced with the Sony Utility. To clarify: I wanted to compare 2 separate workflows using a single shot that exceeded 4GB so 2 files were created on the CF card:

Workflow 1 (No Sony Utility): Dragging the 2 files directly from the card into Premiere Pro CS4 and then to the timeline. Result: 2 frame gap at the join point

Workflow 2: Using the Sony Utility program to convert two files on the card into a single file. This file was then dragged into Premiere Pro and then into the timeline. Result: No gap.

Greg Laves · June 16th, 2009, 08:38 PM

Ohhh. I read that to mean that you dragged both to PP FIRST and then used the utilty.

Adam Gold · June 16th, 2009, 10:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Greg Laves

The ONLY way that I have been able to get the utility to work is if the files are still on the original CF card.

So, Greg, is this the resolution to the problem you posted about in your other thread?

Ron Evans · June 17th, 2009, 06:06 AM

This is the way the Sony Motion Browser software works for cams like the XR500. The camera sees one clip however long the shot was, Sony Motion Browser sees this one clip to transfer to the PC and when transferred it is one long clip. I know that the hard drive on the XR500 is FAT 32 but I never see this when looking at clips on the camera or when Sony Motion Browser looks at a clip on the camera from the PC. FAT32 is always masked from the user. I have shot several shows in the last month where I left the XR500 running for about 3 hours and the clip was transferred as 1 clip.

Ron Evans

Rob Morse · June 17th, 2009, 07:08 AM

I downloaded some footage I shot this weekend, I used the utility program, and it worked fine. Unless resetting the unit as Sony suggested and re-formatting the cards did something, I couldn’t get it to work before. When I posted this weekend I used the footage I had from the prior week. I downloaded the new footage last night and it was fine. It worked perfectly. I called Sony last night and the guy I was speaking to didn’t show any software upgrade for the unit. Of course to boot, he said the guy I spoke to Friday didn’t log the call. He suggested I call during the day when more techs would be available. I’ll let everyone know what they tell me. If you’re having the same problem, try resetting the unit and then try the utility. I wish the utility worked with files on the hard drive so I can go back and test the older footage. I guess I could always copy them back to the CF card and try it that way. Sorry for the dissertation.

Greg Laves · June 17th, 2009, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Adam Gold

So, Greg, is this the resolution to the problem you posted about in your other thread?

I believe it was a combination of things. Most of the problems were cleared up when I quit formatting the cards in my computer (I should have read the manual). Ironically, it seemed like I had to format the cards a couple of times in the MRC1 until all of the problems disappeared. It was sort of like there was some kind of residue left over from the computer formatting. ???? For extra insurance, I now avoid formatting the cards unless I have had a problem (no problems recently). Now I just delete files, instead. Plus I don't do anything at all with the CF cards once they come out of the MRC1 until I have run them through the Sony utility. It has been working much better since I adopted this routine. I think 99% of my problems were operator induced errors.

Richard Peddington · May 4th, 2010, 10:31 PM

Has anybody had issues with M2T files and Adobe Premiere (or any other software) where the last seven or so frames of each clip has video but no audio? Not a huge deal unless I'm creating an unedited version of a project for a client.

Leslie Wand · May 4th, 2010, 11:35 PM

what exactly is this 'sony utility' everyone keeps referring to?

my unit came with a 'utility' called CF Capture, but i don't see any option to 'join' separate takes into one long file?

i can't comment on the above problem since i haven't shot anything continuously for more than 15 to 20 minutes.

leslie

Richard Peddington · May 4th, 2010, 11:39 PM

Hi Leslie,

It's actually called the Sony Recording Unit Utility. It's primary task is to join files larger than 4GB as per FAT32 limitations. If you're curious here's the Sony page Digital HD Video Camera Recorder - Memory Recording Unit

It's essential if you have files over 21:44 minutes. But if all your clips are under that, the utility will work, but the end result is the same as if you were to copy the files directly from the unit via Windows explorer.

Unfortunately the unit won't join multiple files into one, just the files that exceed 4GB. It's unfortunate, because up until now, my workflow has consisted of editing hour+ long Matrox AVIs, rather than hundreds of separate clips. On that note, if anyone knows of a utility (for Windows) that will merge multiple M2T files into one large file, I'd be forever indebted!

Rich

Leslie Wand · May 5th, 2010, 02:00 AM

thanks richard,

that's the software that came with my mrc1 - and which i use to off-load from cf cards.

in which case, it seems i'd never have know ;-)

Alex Chamberlain · May 5th, 2010, 09:34 AM

Richard,
I haven't tried this with .m2t files, but I've managed to combine multiple .m2ts files using TSRemux or TSMuxer, both free. Neither are perfectly intuitive, but they're not impossible either. They'd be worth a try if you're using Windows.

Richard Peddington · May 5th, 2010, 10:13 AM

Hi Alexander,

Thanks a mill for your suggestion. I will definitely give them both a try. How lossless are the resulting files in your opinion?

Rich

Alex Chamberlain · May 5th, 2010, 10:28 AM

Richard,
Since the files are remuxed and non recompressed, the resultant combined file is completely lossless from the previous "generation." You're basically just taking existing streams and joining them together. It's also a pretty quick process. I hope it works on your files. I've only used it to backup my Blu-ray discs. I use Sony's CF Utility to combine the .m2t files from my camera.

Bill Ackerman · May 5th, 2010, 10:35 AM

I may be wrong, but I think the Sony utility does some magic using the sidecar files for long clips to repair the seam where it breaks them up. The Sony utility is the only way I have found to restore the missing frame(s) at the break.

Richard Peddington · May 5th, 2010, 10:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alex Chamberlain

Richard,
Since the files are remuxed and non recompressed, the resultant combined file is completely lossless from the previous "generation." You're basically just taking existing streams and joining them together. It's also a pretty quick process. I hope it works on your files. I've only used it to backup my Blu-ray discs. I use Sony's CF Utility to combine the .m2t files from my camera.

Alex,

When you say you use Sony's CF Utility to combine the M2Ts from your camera, you mean just the >4GB files, not every single clip (40MB, 100MB, etc) right? I want to make sure I'm not missing out on an updated version of the software...

Rich

May 5th, 2010, 09:34 AM	#26
Alex Chamberlain Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Hurricane, UT Posts: 186	Richard, I haven't tried this with .m2t files, but I've managed to combine multiple .m2ts files using TSRemux or TSMuxer, both free. Neither are perfectly intuitive, but they're not impossible either. They'd be worth a try if you're using Windows. __________________ Get rid of the "Aspiring" in "Aspiring Filmmaker." Shoot it; you're a filmmaker. After that you're just negotiating your budget. (James Cameron paraphrased)

May 5th, 2010, 10:28 AM	#28
Alex Chamberlain Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Hurricane, UT Posts: 186	Richard, Since the files are remuxed and non recompressed, the resultant combined file is completely lossless from the previous "generation." You're basically just taking existing streams and joining them together. It's also a pretty quick process. I hope it works on your files. I've only used it to backup my Blu-ray discs. I use Sony's CF Utility to combine the .m2t files from my camera. __________________ Get rid of the "Aspiring" in "Aspiring Filmmaker." Shoot it; you're a filmmaker. After that you're just negotiating your budget. (James Cameron paraphrased)

June 16th, 2009, 08:38 PM	#17
Greg Laves Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Corpus Christi, TX Posts: 640	Ohhh. I read that to mean that you dragged both to PP FIRST and then used the utilty.

June 17th, 2009, 06:06 AM	#19
Ron Evans Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada Posts: 4,222	This is the way the Sony Motion Browser software works for cams like the XR500. The camera sees one clip however long the shot was, Sony Motion Browser sees this one clip to transfer to the PC and when transferred it is one long clip. I know that the hard drive on the XR500 is FAT 32 but I never see this when looking at clips on the camera or when Sony Motion Browser looks at a clip on the camera from the PC. FAT32 is always masked from the user. I have shot several shows in the last month where I left the XR500 running for about 3 hours and the clip was transferred as 1 clip. Ron Evans

June 17th, 2009, 07:08 AM	#20
Rob Morse Major Player Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Charlotte, NC Posts: 427	I downloaded some footage I shot this weekend, I used the utility program, and it worked fine. Unless resetting the unit as Sony suggested and re-formatting the cards did something, I couldn’t get it to work before. When I posted this weekend I used the footage I had from the prior week. I downloaded the new footage last night and it was fine. It worked perfectly. I called Sony last night and the guy I was speaking to didn’t show any software upgrade for the unit. Of course to boot, he said the guy I spoke to Friday didn’t log the call. He suggested I call during the day when more techs would be available. I’ll let everyone know what they tell me. If you’re having the same problem, try resetting the unit and then try the utility. I wish the utility worked with files on the hard drive so I can go back and test the older footage. I guess I could always copy them back to the CF card and try it that way. Sorry for the dissertation.

May 4th, 2010, 10:31 PM	#22
Richard Peddington Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 32	Has anybody had issues with M2T files and Adobe Premiere (or any other software) where the last seven or so frames of each clip has video but no audio? Not a huge deal unless I'm creating an unedited version of a project for a client.

May 4th, 2010, 11:35 PM	#23
Leslie Wand Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: upper hunter, australia Posts: 1,410	what exactly is this 'sony utility' everyone keeps referring to? my unit came with a 'utility' called CF Capture, but i don't see any option to 'join' separate takes into one long file? i can't comment on the above problem since i haven't shot anything continuously for more than 15 to 20 minutes. leslie

May 4th, 2010, 11:39 PM	#24
Richard Peddington Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 32	Hi Leslie, It's actually called the Sony Recording Unit Utility. It's primary task is to join files larger than 4GB as per FAT32 limitations. If you're curious here's the Sony page Digital HD Video Camera Recorder - Memory Recording Unit It's essential if you have files over 21:44 minutes. But if all your clips are under that, the utility will work, but the end result is the same as if you were to copy the files directly from the unit via Windows explorer. Unfortunately the unit won't join multiple files into one, just the files that exceed 4GB. It's unfortunate, because up until now, my workflow has consisted of editing hour+ long Matrox AVIs, rather than hundreds of separate clips. On that note, if anyone knows of a utility (for Windows) that will merge multiple M2T files into one large file, I'd be forever indebted! Rich

May 5th, 2010, 02:00 AM	#25
Leslie Wand Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: upper hunter, australia Posts: 1,410	thanks richard, that's the software that came with my mrc1 - and which i use to off-load from cf cards. in which case, it seems i'd never have know ;-)

May 5th, 2010, 10:13 AM	#27
Richard Peddington Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 32	Hi Alexander, Thanks a mill for your suggestion. I will definitely give them both a try. How lossless are the resulting files in your opinion? Rich

May 5th, 2010, 10:35 AM	#29
Bill Ackerman Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Rio Chango, Brazil Posts: 112	I may be wrong, but I think the Sony utility does some magic using the sidecar files for long clips to repair the seam where it breaks them up. The Sony utility is the only way I have found to restore the missing frame(s) at the break.