How to get the best SD image from these cameras?

Stelios Christofides · April 14th, 2009, 01:46 AM

Well so far (touch wood, and I have filmed nearly 20 events) I never had any dropped frames with my Z5. Ofcousre 90% of these were recorded in SD and most of them were also recorded on the MRC1 as well.

Stelios

Martin Duffy · April 14th, 2009, 03:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stelios Christofides

Well so far (touch wood, and I have filmed nearly 20 events) I never had any dropped frames with my Z5. Ofcousre 90% of these were recorded in SD and most of them were also recorded on the MRC1 as well.
Stelios

I have filmed about 40 hours now on the FX1000 via tape and had no dropped frames.

I certainly will be getting a CF unit soon though.

Anyone out there know how much a 32 gig card will cost? Approx.

Assuming 32 gig will give one around 150 minutes in SD.

How many minutes in HD?

Jeff Harper · April 14th, 2009, 04:41 AM

As I have mentnioned in other posts I have a bad camera. My second camera doesn't have issues, only the first one.

Stelios Christofides · April 14th, 2009, 04:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martin Duffy

....Anyone out there know how much a 32 gig card will cost? Approx.

Assuming 32 gig will give one around 150 minutes in SD.

How many minutes in HD?

Martin, Have a look a this post:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/sony-hvr-...ash-cards.html

Whether you record in SD or HD the recording minutes are the same.

Stelios

Barron Thompson · April 15th, 2009, 06:34 PM

Picasa Web Albums - Barron - Shed HDV-SD t...

The render settings in Vegas Pro 8.0c were MainConcept MPEG-2.
Template: DVD Architect 24p NTSC video stream

The camera settings were
Gamma: Cinematone1
Blk Comp: OFF
Knee: Low
Color mode: Cinematone1
Color level/phase/depth: 0
WB Shift : 0
Sharpness: 0 and -7 as noted on the pics
Skintone dtl: OFF

It still looks as though the in camera conversion has a *tad* more detail. There was more difference between the two methods in my first test when the sharpness was at +7.

Jon Goulden · April 17th, 2009, 01:06 AM

I'm finding that it is necessary to increase the quality using Frame Controls (the terminology in Apple's Compressor product) when doing the conversion from HDV to SD to make the SD DVD. This DRAMATICALLY increases the processing time, roughly 14 hours on an 8way system set up as a cluster.

Also you can get a 32Gb Ridata 233x card for $105 at supermediastore.com. They are working well for me.

Jon Goulden · April 17th, 2009, 01:13 AM

I'm finding that it is necessary to increase the quality using Frame Controls (the terminology in Apple's Compressor product) when doing the conversion from HDV to SD to make the SD DVD. This DRAMATICALLY increases the processing time, roughly 14 hours on an 8way system set up as a cluster.

Also you can get a 32Gb Ridata 233x card for $105 at supermediastore.com. They are working well for me.

Stelios Christofides · July 17th, 2009, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stelios Christofides

OK guys this is what I will do. Shoot in HDV, edit in HDV and then burn in DVD.
Then do the same thing, same scene, shoot in DV, edit in DV and burn in DVD. Get a few friends over some drinks show both videos on the same big LCD screen and ask them if they notice any difference and see. This will be interesting... It's not that I don't want to shoot in HDV, its because I know that my clients, so far, want the finished product in DVD with no intention to change it in the foreseeable future. Besides editing in DV (with my PC) is quicker.

Stelios

Remember this?

Well, finally I did the test last night with some friends ( 8) that I have invited over and showed them a DVD mixed with scenes filmed in HDV and DV and marked those scenes in numbers, gave them a piece of paper with the numbers on the one side with two columns marked HDV and DV and all they had to do is to place an X next to the numbered scene if , to their judgement was filmed in HDV or DV. Guess what? I had 6 scenes, 3 HDV and 3 DV, I got the following:
Scene.... HDV... DV
1. HDV.... 3x... 5x
2. HDV.... 4x... 4x
3. DV..... 2x... 6x
4. HDV.... 5x... 3x
5. DV..... 6x... 2x
6. DV..... 4x... 4x

Explanation Note: If you take Scene No.1(shot in HDV) 3x=3 guys though that it was HDV and 5x=5 guys though it was DV

It seems from the above (for me at least) that the results are the same whether you shoot in HDV or DV and render to DVD.

Stelios

Jeff Harper · July 18th, 2009, 12:05 AM

I found the same thing, no difference, at least no noticeable difference.

Tom Hardwick · July 18th, 2009, 06:46 AM

Stelios - well done - an interesting test and result.
What I'd like to see is the same test to find out whether downconverters make that much difference if you're watching a DVD into a big new 1080P TV.

OK, I know they do for test-chart zonies, but for real filmmakers?

1) Take an HDV camera and film in DV (i.e. downconvert between chips and tape).

2) Same camera but film in HDV and downconvert in the camera.

3) Same camera, downconvert the timeline.

I'm guessing the worst downconversion will give the best looking DVD if that disc is boosted by being played in an upscaling DVD player, say.

tom.

Stelios Christofides · July 18th, 2009, 03:10 PM

Well Tom someone else must do these tests now. I have done my part:-) Maybe you or Jeff. No more beers left in my fridge (for the moment)...lol

Stelios

April 14th, 2009, 01:46 AM	#31
Stelios Christofides Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Nicosia, CYPRUS Posts: 1,080	Well so far (touch wood, and I have filmed nearly 20 events) I never had any dropped frames with my Z5. Ofcousre 90% of these were recorded in SD and most of them were also recorded on the MRC1 as well. Stelios __________________ My Blog: http://steliosc.blogspot.com "I hope for nothing, I fear nothing, I am free" Nikos Kazantzakis

April 17th, 2009, 01:06 AM	#36
Jon Goulden Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: United States Posts: 32	Frame controls are key to quality I'm finding that it is necessary to increase the quality using Frame Controls (the terminology in Apple's Compressor product) when doing the conversion from HDV to SD to make the SD DVD. This DRAMATICALLY increases the processing time, roughly 14 hours on an 8way system set up as a cluster. Also you can get a 32Gb Ridata 233x card for $105 at supermediastore.com. They are working well for me.

April 17th, 2009, 01:13 AM	#37
Jon Goulden Regular Crew Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: United States Posts: 32	Frame controls are key to quality I'm finding that it is necessary to increase the quality using Frame Controls (the terminology in Apple's Compressor product) when doing the conversion from HDV to SD to make the SD DVD. This DRAMATICALLY increases the processing time, roughly 14 hours on an 8way system set up as a cluster. Also you can get a 32Gb Ridata 233x card for $105 at supermediastore.com. They are working well for me.

July 18th, 2009, 03:10 PM	#41
Stelios Christofides Trustee Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Nicosia, CYPRUS Posts: 1,080	Well Tom someone else must do these tests now. I have done my part:-) Maybe you or Jeff. No more beers left in my fridge (for the moment)...lol Stelios __________________ My Blog: http://steliosc.blogspot.com "I hope for nothing, I fear nothing, I am free" Nikos Kazantzakis

April 14th, 2009, 04:41 AM	#33
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	As I have mentnioned in other posts I have a bad camera. My second camera doesn't have issues, only the first one.

April 15th, 2009, 06:34 PM	#35
Barron Thompson Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Burlington, Ontario Posts: 67	Picasa Web Albums - Barron - Shed HDV-SD t... The render settings in Vegas Pro 8.0c were MainConcept MPEG-2. Template: DVD Architect 24p NTSC video stream The camera settings were Gamma: Cinematone1 Blk Comp: OFF Knee: Low Color mode: Cinematone1 Color level/phase/depth: 0 WB Shift : 0 Sharpness: 0 and -7 as noted on the pics Skintone dtl: OFF It still looks as though the in camera conversion has a tad more detail. There was more difference between the two methods in my first test when the sharpness was at +7.

July 18th, 2009, 12:05 AM	#39
Jeff Harper Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Cincinnati, OH Posts: 8,425	I found the same thing, no difference, at least no noticeable difference.

July 18th, 2009, 06:46 AM	#40
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Stelios - well done - an interesting test and result. What I'd like to see is the same test to find out whether downconverters make that much difference if you're watching a DVD into a big new 1080P TV. OK, I know they do for test-chart zonies, but for real filmmakers? 1) Take an HDV camera and film in DV (i.e. downconvert between chips and tape). 2) Same camera but film in HDV and downconvert in the camera. 3) Same camera, downconvert the timeline. I'm guessing the worst downconversion will give the best looking DVD if that disc is boosted by being played in an upscaling DVD player, say. tom.