Can you get 4:3 with the FX1 and Vegas? at DVinfo.net

Dan Measel · October 26th, 2005, 04:24 PM

I know, I know, why would I want to anyway? Well I'm currently doing a 2 camera shoot with two SD cameras and want to add a third camera and all I have left is my FX1.

I rendered in Vegas to 4:3 but that left black bars. Is there a good trick to do this without distiorting the picture? Didn't see anything in the manual to suggest I could record in 4:3.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated, as always.

Steve Crisdale · October 26th, 2005, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dan Measel

I know, I know, why would I want to anyway? Well I'm currently doing a 2 camera shoot with two SD cameras and want to add a third camera and all I have left is my FX1.

I rendered in Vegas to 4:3 but that left black bars. Is there a good trick to do this without distiorting the picture? Didn't see anything in the manual to suggest I could record in 4:3.

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated, as always.

Well... you could always record in 4:3 DV on the FX-1 rather than 16:9 DV or HDV.

If you already have the 16:9 HDV in your machine, use Vegas' Track Motion to trim the 16:9 to 4:3. just set the template from the drop-down list to 4:3 and you should see how the 16:9 will be cropped. You can even move your HD footage around to get the best sections of the larger image where you want them, and add keys to animate the motion of the HDV 16:9 within the 4:3 frame... I hope that makes sense - it's early in the morning and the house painter has just turned up - too many things to think of!!

Ben Hardy · October 27th, 2005, 03:10 PM

Steve,
What version of Vegas are you using? Where is the "template from the drop-down list to 4:3" accessed? Any details for us "new users" would be appreciated.
Good luck with your painting.
Thanks,
Ben

Steve Crisdale · October 28th, 2005, 02:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ben Hardy

Steve,
What version of Vegas are you using? Where is the "template from the drop-down list to 4:3" accessed? Any details for us "new users" would be appreciated.
Good luck with your painting.
Thanks,
Ben

I'm currently using Vegas 5.

Click on the small "Event pan/crop" icon that's at the right hand end of video clips loaded into the time-line. You'll see a Preset drop-down button at the top of the "Event pan/crop" window that opens... click the drop-down button and you should see a selection of formats. 1:1 Square pixel aspect ratio, 4:3 standard TV aspect ratio, 16:9 widescreen TV aspect ratio, 1.85:1 Academy aspect ratio and PAL SVCD to DVD wide are what show in mine.

Once you select the 4:3 aspect ratio (with 16:9 material loaded), the dotted line preview guide shows how the 16:9 clips will be cropped... Hopefully you'll be able to work out how to keyframe moving the crop from left to right etc. - if you really need it that is. hopefully you've framed every shot so you won't need to pan a 4:3 crop around on your 16:9 HDV master clip!!

Ben Hardy · October 28th, 2005, 08:03 AM

Thank you very much, Steve. As you know, only the Z1 will output (while recording in HDV) 4:3 SD. Now I can use my FX1 to record in HDV, for SD 3:4 DVD delivery!
Presently, I remotely zoom, pan and tilt stage events in real-time (VX-2000), but I'm intrigued by the prospect of using a "stationary" camera recording (full-stage) in HDV, and then doing all the reframing, zooms and pans in post.

Another learning curve, no doubt, but thanks to informative posts such as yours,
inexperienced users (like me) are gaining much expertise in becoming (one day) acceptable editors.
Your help is deeply appreciated.
Ben

Dan Measel · October 31st, 2005, 03:42 PM

Thanks Steve that was very helpful.

Patrick Swinnea · November 1st, 2005, 12:45 PM

Ben, keep in mind the render times to do this can be a pain. I recently shot a food training video destined for 4:3 SD DVD.

I shot most of it in 4:3 DV mode with my FX1. Just as an experiment, on the last day of shooting I shot everything in 16:9 HDV.

Using Vegas 6, I rendered the 16:9 HDV out to 4:3 DV. After everything was printed to DVD, I would challenge anyone to guess which was shot in SD and which was shot in HD. (The training TVs they use are under 21 inches).

What I'm trying to say is, unless there is a need to re-edit in HD in the future, I would just shoot in 4:3 DV mode. The rendering takes up too much editing time. Any way to cut down on the rendering time and I'm all for it.

The Z1 4:3 DV downconvert mode would have been a great feature to have on the FX1...

Ben Hardy · November 2nd, 2005, 04:28 PM

Patrick,
Thank you for the information. Before the Z-1 was introduced, I was misinformed (by a reviewer, no less) that the FX-1 did, indeed, have the 4:3 DV downconvert mode. After buying the unit, I was very disappointed to learn that it didn't.

In my setup, primarily recording Band and Choral Concerts, the output of the "camera" of the FX-1 or VX-2000 is sent to a DV VCR (DHR 1000) and audio is added from a pair of Neumann KM-86 microphones. Pan/Tilt and Zoom are remotely controlled. All editing (pausing between selections) is done in real time, so I only have to assemble a batch capture of the recording and go directly to DVD production.
I was hoping to record HDV and have the 4:3 DV downconvert mode to the DV VCR.
We have a concert in a few weeks and I'll likely use my reliable VX-2000 as described above, but I may mount the FX-1 on the tripod as well. Perhaps I can frame the ensemble (wide) and just run the FX-1 and play with the HDV footage later.

Again, many thanks for your comments.
Ben

October 26th, 2005, 04:24 PM	#1
Dan Measel Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Athens, GA Posts: 196	Can you get 4:3 with the FX1 and Vegas? I know, I know, why would I want to anyway? Well I'm currently doing a 2 camera shoot with two SD cameras and want to add a third camera and all I have left is my FX1. I rendered in Vegas to 4:3 but that left black bars. Is there a good trick to do this without distiorting the picture? Didn't see anything in the manual to suggest I could record in 4:3. Any feedback would be greatly appreciated, as always.

October 27th, 2005, 03:10 PM	#3
Ben Hardy Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Metairie, LA Posts: 54	Steve, What version of Vegas are you using? Where is the "template from the drop-down list to 4:3" accessed? Any details for us "new users" would be appreciated. Good luck with your painting. Thanks, Ben

October 28th, 2005, 08:03 AM	#5
Ben Hardy Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Metairie, LA Posts: 54	Thank you very much, Steve. As you know, only the Z1 will output (while recording in HDV) 4:3 SD. Now I can use my FX1 to record in HDV, for SD 3:4 DVD delivery! Presently, I remotely zoom, pan and tilt stage events in real-time (VX-2000), but I'm intrigued by the prospect of using a "stationary" camera recording (full-stage) in HDV, and then doing all the reframing, zooms and pans in post. Another learning curve, no doubt, but thanks to informative posts such as yours, inexperienced users (like me) are gaining much expertise in becoming (one day) acceptable editors. Your help is deeply appreciated. Ben

October 31st, 2005, 03:42 PM	#6
Dan Measel Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Athens, GA Posts: 196	Thanks Steve that was very helpful.

November 1st, 2005, 12:45 PM	#7
Patrick Swinnea Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Denver, CO, USA Posts: 93	Ben, keep in mind the render times to do this can be a pain. I recently shot a food training video destined for 4:3 SD DVD. I shot most of it in 4:3 DV mode with my FX1. Just as an experiment, on the last day of shooting I shot everything in 16:9 HDV. Using Vegas 6, I rendered the 16:9 HDV out to 4:3 DV. After everything was printed to DVD, I would challenge anyone to guess which was shot in SD and which was shot in HD. (The training TVs they use are under 21 inches). What I'm trying to say is, unless there is a need to re-edit in HD in the future, I would just shoot in 4:3 DV mode. The rendering takes up too much editing time. Any way to cut down on the rendering time and I'm all for it. The Z1 4:3 DV downconvert mode would have been a great feature to have on the FX1...

November 2nd, 2005, 04:28 PM	#8
Ben Hardy Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Metairie, LA Posts: 54	Patrick, Thank you for the information. Before the Z-1 was introduced, I was misinformed (by a reviewer, no less) that the FX-1 did, indeed, have the 4:3 DV downconvert mode. After buying the unit, I was very disappointed to learn that it didn't. In my setup, primarily recording Band and Choral Concerts, the output of the "camera" of the FX-1 or VX-2000 is sent to a DV VCR (DHR 1000) and audio is added from a pair of Neumann KM-86 microphones. Pan/Tilt and Zoom are remotely controlled. All editing (pausing between selections) is done in real time, so I only have to assemble a batch capture of the recording and go directly to DVD production. I was hoping to record HDV and have the 4:3 DV downconvert mode to the DV VCR. We have a concert in a few weeks and I'll likely use my reliable VX-2000 as described above, but I may mount the FX-1 on the tripod as well. Perhaps I can frame the ensemble (wide) and just run the FX-1 and play with the HDV footage later. Again, many thanks for your comments. Ben