Raw HDR-FX1 mpeg2 files are posted.

Markus Rupprecht · October 28th, 2004, 04:33 PM

Hi!

I noticed that there are many people around the world with big HDTV screens and projectors. Well here's a link to a litte clip:

www.drachenfeder.com/int/dach_after.avi

it's 720p 24 frames/s. It's divX coded but still decent quality. I'd like to ask for your opinion of this image compared to the FX1 image. Any comments are welcome.

Greets
Markus

Michael Pappas · October 28th, 2004, 04:58 PM

Interesting. Hello Markus, what is the source of this clip. If you did it, give some more background. What's the original size and etc. Thanks.....

Michael Pappas

Markus Rupprecht · October 28th, 2004, 05:04 PM

@Miachael Pappas

It's the original size. Well before going thru divX it was 4:4:4 uncompressed. It's shot with our self build HD camera direct to disc. We do curently some beta testing and I'm interested how the picture this camera produces "feels" on different screens.

Check out this clip:
www.drachenfeder.com/int/take1.avi

It's more cine like. Although there is a small problem with fixed pattern noise in the bright areas. We fixed this already, just hadn'd time to convert a new file.

Michael Pappas · October 28th, 2004, 05:27 PM

Markus, is this the Silicon Imaging cameras, which by the way is down the street from me in Costa Mesa CA. I like the quality. I am going to swing over to the PC/HD system later and view it. Are you from the Alternative Imaging forum on this Board. I am very aware of this gear if so. I have been quietly watching this section for some time. The clips that I have are very few, two to be exact and they are outstanding even for wmvhd's down-conversions from the original SI camera shots. They are the closest to film I have seen in some respects, and by far blow the HDV out of the water. I have told Chris Hurd a while ago that the alternative board section is and should be voted number 1 in DV magazine as being the most cutting edge publicly on display in HD/digital cinema research and design. IF THERE ARE ANY DV-MAGAZINE EDITORS ETC, THINK ABOUT GIVING THIS A BLURB IN THE DV magazine to DVinf.net "Alternative Imaging Methods " forum

Markus what players will this view with, my VLC won't play it for some reason. Strange that on my Internet Explorer OSX will. I would like to see more done with this and if you could point me towards links with other shots I would like to see and study them and report back here. Thanks

To others that have not known about this section here on DVino.net. Here is the link. If top notch HD 4:4:4 is what you need or even 4:2:2 go have a look at the cutting edge:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisp...?s=&forumid=70

PS: Markus you need to make those links hyperlink so we can do a "save as" to desktop.

Michael Pappas
Arrfilms@hotmail.com

Michael Pappas · October 28th, 2004, 05:30 PM

<<<Originally posted by Markus Rupprecht : @Miachael Pappas

It's the original size. Well before going thru divX it was 4:4:4 uncompressed. It's shot with our self build HD camera direct to disc. We do curently some beta testing and I'm interested how the picture this camera produces "feels" on different screens.

Check out this clip:
www.drachenfeder.com/int/take1.avi>>>?

MARKUS.................OUTSTANDING...........

I suggest others take a look at this link too:

www.drachenfeder.com/int/take1.avi

Michael Pappas

Markus Rupprecht · October 28th, 2004, 05:40 PM

It should play with the latest divX player or VLC player. and well, it's not done with a SI camera. I won't get into details on what chip we build our camera around. But be shure, we did it indie style. I'd really love to get some feedback on the "feel" of this pictures before getting involved in endless technical discussions. I'm a director after all. And we started this entire "build your own HD cine cam" adventure just because I was a few weeks away from shooting and totally trusted the industry with the specs on the JVC HDV cam. And it sucked. color resolution, compression. Awfull. Well, soon you will get the entire story. But for now...

Laurence Kingston · October 28th, 2004, 08:45 PM

The homebuilt HD cam footage looks great but it's a static shot. I'd love to see some fast pans and heavy motion shots. I guess some heavy motion night shots would be the ultimate test. We already know that the HDV really shines there!

Steve Crisdale · October 29th, 2004, 02:47 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Troy Lamont :

When you're talking digital displays the actual pixel resolution is the same as the viewable.
-->>>

Huh?...... Actual physical pixels in a screen don't necessarily indicate the viewable resolution. Despite only having 1330x800 physical pixels, the Sharp Aquos can display 1080i full screen viewable, just the same as 1280x720 fills the full 1330x800 screen size.....same deal with all of my digital monitors (regardless of their actual resolution). However, the more physical pixels in a screens' makeup, the greater the clarity.

<<<--
Not true as I pointed out above. Your set and the 45" 1080p Aquos sets are different models, you can't compare resolution specs. You may also want to check your specs again. The Sharp 1920X1080 is 1920X1080 viewable, it's already been confirmed by several owners.
-->>>

No dissension here..... I don't believe I stated that the 45" or 55" Sharp LCD displays were any resolution.

<<<--
As far as I know, 720p is at 60Hz or 60fps. That's about as far away from a filmic look as anything. There are a lot of other processing in each HDTV set that may account for a different look on each set.
-->>>

Would that make 720i 120fps? And, yes I know there's a lot of other processing going on in HDTV sets, which was the intent of my original post.

BTW, I hope you made a mistake in quoting Kevin Dooley without assignation in your reply to my post, otherwise it could appear to misrepresent my original post.....

Christopher C. Murphy · October 29th, 2004, 08:37 AM

Hey, what the heck is that? It looks remarkably like film.

Is this something that's be available soon? Is it a portable unit or one of those make-shift cameras that won't be good for field work? I'm very interested in this if it's going to be available for under $7,000!

Murph

Troy Lamont · October 29th, 2004, 09:12 AM

Quote:

Huh?...... Actual physical pixels in a screen don't necessarily indicate the viewable resolution.

Since this is a thread about the FX1, I'm not going to disdain any further discussion about this topic with you. It seems as if you hit the nail on the head with the first word of your quote above. Do your homework thou hast not an inkling.

Markus,

Quote:

I'd like to ask for your opinion of this image compared to the FX1 image. Any comments are welcome.

These clips are excellent! I played them back on my 55" HDTV and I thought I was at the movies! Very smooth, very detailed with excellent contrast. Kudos.

You have to reveal the source and thanks for the clips.

Kaku,

Was I under the assumption that you were going to do an 'official' review once you're done with your real job? :)

Any more clips pending?

Thanks again for all you've provided.

Troy

Michael Pappas · October 29th, 2004, 10:57 AM

<<<These clips are excellent! I played them back on my 55" HDTV and I thought I was at the movies! Very smooth, very detailed with excellent contrast. Kudos.
You have to reveal the source and thanks for the clips.>>>>>

I agree.......
I watched them on the big screen last nignt, amazing looking. This is many many years ahead of what the consumer will have. My brother thought it was a HD trailer from a movie when it first rolled on the 50" HD screen....

This was just a simple AVI, imagine what the 4:4:4 or 4:2:2 version looks like.

Here is a link to the people who shot this and other stills form his camera. It's in German so you will have to translate.

Still Images shot with his Homemade HD cam:

http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72...emplate=plain&

http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72...emplate=plain&

http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72...emplate=plain&

MAIN LINK- ARTICLE to his HD system:

http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72003

Now back to the FX1
Now as I have said before, I would like to see someone shoot some tripod shots
of people interacting with one another with the HDR FX1. I don't have accsess to it or i would be filming actors etc. Kaku and the others that are lucky to have A FX1, go film people-kids, well composed shots etc. Oh yeah 0db gain too, and 1/60th.

Heath McKnight · October 29th, 2004, 11:35 AM

FYI on hyperlinking your web links:

[url ]www.dvinfo.net/conf[/url ]

Now, I had to put a space between both "l" and "]" so you'll need to take away that space, so you get:

www.hdvinfo.net/conf

If you want to make it a clickable text link, do this:

[url =www.dvinfo.net/conf]DV Info Net Forums[/url ]

Again, get rid of the space between "l" and "=" and also "l" and "]"

You'd get:

DV Info Net Forums

Your friendly wrangler,

heath

Betsy Moore · October 29th, 2004, 11:49 AM

I'm reading the article through Babel fish--and my head's spinning--Gosh, it's hard to get through those translations.

Donal Briard · October 29th, 2004, 01:10 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Betsy Moore : I'm reading the article through Babel fish--and my head's spinning--Gosh, it's hard to get through those translations. -->>>

When using the Babel Fish: DON'T PANIC.

Betsy Moore · October 29th, 2004, 01:37 PM

Hey Markus,

I noticed one of the photos was captioned 720p--are they all 720 or are you messing around with 1080 too? What do you imagine this camera would cost (ballpark)

As they say in your country,

Donkey Shame:)

October 29th, 2004, 08:37 AM	#129
Christopher C. Murphy Trustee Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 1,707	Hey, what the heck is that? It looks remarkably like film. Is this something that's be available soon? Is it a portable unit or one of those make-shift cameras that won't be good for field work? I'm very interested in this if it's going to be available for under $7,000! Murph __________________ Christopher C. Murphy Director, Producer, Writer

October 29th, 2004, 11:35 AM	#132
Heath McKnight MPS Digital Studios Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Palm Beach County, Florida Posts: 8,531	FYI on hyperlinking your web links: [url ]www.dvinfo.net/conf[/url ] Now, I had to put a space between both "l" and "]" so you'll need to take away that space, so you get: www.hdvinfo.net/conf If you want to make it a clickable text link, do this: [url =www.dvinfo.net/conf]DV Info Net Forums[/url ] Again, get rid of the space between "l" and "=" and also "l" and "]" You'd get: DV Info Net Forums Your friendly wrangler, heath __________________ My Final Cut Pro X blog

October 28th, 2004, 04:33 PM	#121
Markus Rupprecht Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: germany Posts: 31	Hi! I noticed that there are many people around the world with big HDTV screens and projectors. Well here's a link to a litte clip: www.drachenfeder.com/int/dach_after.avi it's 720p 24 frames/s. It's divX coded but still decent quality. I'd like to ask for your opinion of this image compared to the FX1 image. Any comments are welcome. Greets Markus

October 28th, 2004, 04:58 PM	#122
Michael Pappas Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: California Posts: 667	Interesting. Hello Markus, what is the source of this clip. If you did it, give some more background. What's the original size and etc. Thanks..... Michael Pappas

October 28th, 2004, 05:04 PM	#123
Markus Rupprecht Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: germany Posts: 31	@Miachael Pappas It's the original size. Well before going thru divX it was 4:4:4 uncompressed. It's shot with our self build HD camera direct to disc. We do curently some beta testing and I'm interested how the picture this camera produces "feels" on different screens. Check out this clip: www.drachenfeder.com/int/take1.avi It's more cine like. Although there is a small problem with fixed pattern noise in the bright areas. We fixed this already, just hadn'd time to convert a new file.

October 28th, 2004, 05:27 PM	#124
Michael Pappas Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: California Posts: 667	Markus, is this the Silicon Imaging cameras, which by the way is down the street from me in Costa Mesa CA. I like the quality. I am going to swing over to the PC/HD system later and view it. Are you from the Alternative Imaging forum on this Board. I am very aware of this gear if so. I have been quietly watching this section for some time. The clips that I have are very few, two to be exact and they are outstanding even for wmvhd's down-conversions from the original SI camera shots. They are the closest to film I have seen in some respects, and by far blow the HDV out of the water. I have told Chris Hurd a while ago that the alternative board section is and should be voted number 1 in DV magazine as being the most cutting edge publicly on display in HD/digital cinema research and design. IF THERE ARE ANY DV-MAGAZINE EDITORS ETC, THINK ABOUT GIVING THIS A BLURB IN THE DV magazine to DVinf.net "Alternative Imaging Methods " forum Markus what players will this view with, my VLC won't play it for some reason. Strange that on my Internet Explorer OSX will. I would like to see more done with this and if you could point me towards links with other shots I would like to see and study them and report back here. Thanks To others that have not known about this section here on DVino.net. Here is the link. If top notch HD 4:4:4 is what you need or even 4:2:2 go have a look at the cutting edge: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/forumdisp...?s=&forumid=70 PS: Markus you need to make those links hyperlink so we can do a "save as" to desktop. Michael Pappas Arrfilms@hotmail.com

October 28th, 2004, 05:30 PM	#125
Michael Pappas Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: California Posts: 667	<<<Originally posted by Markus Rupprecht : @Miachael Pappas It's the original size. Well before going thru divX it was 4:4:4 uncompressed. It's shot with our self build HD camera direct to disc. We do curently some beta testing and I'm interested how the picture this camera produces "feels" on different screens. Check out this clip: www.drachenfeder.com/int/take1.avi>>>? MARKUS.................OUTSTANDING........... I suggest others take a look at this link too: www.drachenfeder.com/int/take1.avi Michael Pappas

October 28th, 2004, 05:40 PM	#126
Markus Rupprecht Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: germany Posts: 31	It should play with the latest divX player or VLC player. and well, it's not done with a SI camera. I won't get into details on what chip we build our camera around. But be shure, we did it indie style. I'd really love to get some feedback on the "feel" of this pictures before getting involved in endless technical discussions. I'm a director after all. And we started this entire "build your own HD cine cam" adventure just because I was a few weeks away from shooting and totally trusted the industry with the specs on the JVC HDV cam. And it sucked. color resolution, compression. Awfull. Well, soon you will get the entire story. But for now...

October 28th, 2004, 08:45 PM	#127
Laurence Kingston Major Player Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Clermont, FL. Posts: 941	The homebuilt HD cam footage looks great but it's a static shot. I'd love to see some fast pans and heavy motion shots. I guess some heavy motion night shots would be the ultimate test. We already know that the HDV really shines there!

October 29th, 2004, 02:47 AM	#128
Steve Crisdale Major Player Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Katoomba NSW Australia Posts: 635	<<<-- Originally posted by Troy Lamont : When you're talking digital displays the actual pixel resolution is the same as the viewable. -->>> Huh?...... Actual physical pixels in a screen don't necessarily indicate the viewable resolution. Despite only having 1330x800 physical pixels, the Sharp Aquos can display 1080i full screen viewable, just the same as 1280x720 fills the full 1330x800 screen size.....same deal with all of my digital monitors (regardless of their actual resolution). However, the more physical pixels in a screens' makeup, the greater the clarity. <<<-- Not true as I pointed out above. Your set and the 45" 1080p Aquos sets are different models, you can't compare resolution specs. You may also want to check your specs again. The Sharp 1920X1080 is 1920X1080 viewable, it's already been confirmed by several owners. -->>> No dissension here..... I don't believe I stated that the 45" or 55" Sharp LCD displays were any resolution. <<<-- As far as I know, 720p is at 60Hz or 60fps. That's about as far away from a filmic look as anything. There are a lot of other processing in each HDTV set that may account for a different look on each set. -->>> Would that make 720i 120fps? And, yes I know there's a lot of other processing going on in HDTV sets, which was the intent of my original post. BTW, I hope you made a mistake in quoting Kevin Dooley without assignation in your reply to my post, otherwise it could appear to misrepresent my original post.....

October 29th, 2004, 10:57 AM	#131
Michael Pappas Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: California Posts: 667	<<<These clips are excellent! I played them back on my 55" HDTV and I thought I was at the movies! Very smooth, very detailed with excellent contrast. Kudos. You have to reveal the source and thanks for the clips.>>>>> I agree....... I watched them on the big screen last nignt, amazing looking. This is many many years ahead of what the consumer will have. My brother thought it was a HD trailer from a movie when it first rolled on the 50" HD screen.... This was just a simple AVI, imagine what the 4:4:4 or 4:2:2 version looks like. Here is a link to the people who shot this and other stills form his camera. It's in German so you will have to translate. Still Images shot with his Homemade HD cam: http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72...emplate=plain& http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72...emplate=plain& http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72...emplate=plain& MAIN LINK- ARTICLE to his HD system: http://web2.1289-1.1st-housing.de/72003 Now back to the FX1 Now as I have said before, I would like to see someone shoot some tripod shots of people interacting with one another with the HDR FX1. I don't have accsess to it or i would be filming actors etc. Kaku and the others that are lucky to have A FX1, go film people-kids, well composed shots etc. Oh yeah 0db gain too, and 1/60th.

October 29th, 2004, 11:49 AM	#133
Betsy Moore Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 444	I'm reading the article through Babel fish--and my head's spinning--Gosh, it's hard to get through those translations.

October 29th, 2004, 01:10 PM	#134
Donal Briard Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 43	<<<-- Originally posted by Betsy Moore : I'm reading the article through Babel fish--and my head's spinning--Gosh, it's hard to get through those translations. -->>> When using the Babel Fish: DON'T PANIC.

October 29th, 2004, 01:37 PM	#135
Betsy Moore Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 444	Hey Markus, I noticed one of the photos was captioned 720p--are they all 720 or are you messing around with 1080 too? What do you imagine this camera would cost (ballpark) As they say in your country, Donkey Shame:)