I think HDV is here to stay! at DVinfo.net

Ken Hodson · September 11th, 2004, 01:55 AM

With the advertising punch Sony has just pulled( huge considering we have been in the HDV world a while now) one has to wonder if Sony has just made %80 of their products obsolete?
How many of their current prosummer DV cams cams do they hope to sell given the price and apparent capabilities of the new cam? Does it have any DV/SD modes at all? I haven't read a thing.
How much does Sony want to wipe out their $8,000 to $20,000 cam range product line-up? If we believe the marketing this cam has everything (minus XLR and detachable lens and esspecially progressive scan, which they will try to convince you isn't important) else is sub-par.
I am less inclined to give credabilty to the "leaked" visuals, as we can not give the sources any credability or put them in any context. I for one believe the output from this cam to be far from miraculous given the price tag set by Sony. I bet it is good, as so far the HDV format has been, but something tells me Sony has held back in some respect as they have too many product lines to step on. We will only know for sure when the cam is on our hands. Going by Sony's specs it blows everything else under $15,000 out of the water. Interesting.

My personal opinion is, that to not offer progressive capture in any mode is a joke. Interlace for distribution is fine as it cuts down on the data rate, but interlace capture is inherently crap. If you like the look of video it's fine. If you like the look of film you have to de-interlace. Say good-by to 1/4 of your resolution minimum and welcome de-interlace artifacts. Considering this cam doesn't come close to the true 1080i resolution in pixels captured, where does this leave us? And if you are a modern media artist who relies upon compositing, who wants to de-interlace? For the life of me I can't understand why they didn't include a 720 30p mode. Why? Is it all a conspiracy. No manual controlls in one, no progressive in another?

I can't wait for a legit review. Hopefully non Sony sponsored if that is possible. Should be around March, shortly after this cam shops in volume.

One thing for sure, I would bite the ass off a dead horse to have those manual controls on my HD-10 ;>)

Long live the HD-10 and welcome the FX1 !
HDV is here to stay.

Anhar Miah · September 11th, 2004, 05:49 AM

maybe just maybe (my speculation) is that since the FX1 is a "consumer" cam they need to take something off, so that their "pro" cameras can have progressive mode. Maybe its the old VX and PD route all over again.

Ed Hill · September 11th, 2004, 10:23 AM

I'm not surpeised that the FX1 has the failings it does.

Nonetheless the all manual control capability is a good step up from the HD10.

This camera is no threat to existing Sony consumer type standard def cameras.
Price is always a factor in the consumer market. Only consumers with deep pockets and early adopters of technology will even look at this camera.

In the Pro market this camera is again no threat to existing Sony models. With 1/3 inch CCD's most pro studios and TV stations will njot even look at the new FX1. Video studios & TV stations are now used to larger CCD image areas ( 2/3 inch is common), and expect to pay $ 15K to $ 100K for cameras.

The new FX1 might be perfect for colleges, local cable operators, small market TV stations, event videographers, and new production companies like mine.

Wayne Orr · September 11th, 2004, 10:53 AM

Consider the possibility that the purpose of the new Sony FX1 is to sell hi def televisions. Hi Def has been an underperformer in the United States, and in PAL countries, its not even a blip on the radar. But give the consumers a camera that shoots hi def, and you sell a television set to go with it. Certainly, consumers aren't rushing out to buy hi def tv's to watch Jay Leno. But given the opportunity to capture their kids' birthday parties, and all of life's experiences in beautiful hi definition (that we all know will eventually be the de facto standard), maybe they pop for both the camera and the television. And the average consumer doesn't know or care about the difference between progressive and interlaced.

I guarantee that Sony didn't release this camera because they were concerned about a relatively small market of aspiring filmmakers. And btw, neither did JVC.

Just my 2¢

Ken Tanaka · September 11th, 2004, 11:49 AM

Wayne makes a very keen point. Sony's bet on HD actually goes beyond selling televisions. Their stake travels up the chain into their broadcast holdings and interests. So it is, indeed, very much in their interests that HD begins to grow legs.

September 11th, 2004, 01:55 AM	#1
Ken Hodson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 1,315	I think HDV is here to stay! With the advertising punch Sony has just pulled( huge considering we have been in the HDV world a while now) one has to wonder if Sony has just made %80 of their products obsolete? How many of their current prosummer DV cams cams do they hope to sell given the price and apparent capabilities of the new cam? Does it have any DV/SD modes at all? I haven't read a thing. How much does Sony want to wipe out their $8,000 to $20,000 cam range product line-up? If we believe the marketing this cam has everything (minus XLR and detachable lens and esspecially progressive scan, which they will try to convince you isn't important) else is sub-par. I am less inclined to give credabilty to the "leaked" visuals, as we can not give the sources any credability or put them in any context. I for one believe the output from this cam to be far from miraculous given the price tag set by Sony. I bet it is good, as so far the HDV format has been, but something tells me Sony has held back in some respect as they have too many product lines to step on. We will only know for sure when the cam is on our hands. Going by Sony's specs it blows everything else under $15,000 out of the water. Interesting. My personal opinion is, that to not offer progressive capture in any mode is a joke. Interlace for distribution is fine as it cuts down on the data rate, but interlace capture is inherently crap. If you like the look of video it's fine. If you like the look of film you have to de-interlace. Say good-by to 1/4 of your resolution minimum and welcome de-interlace artifacts. Considering this cam doesn't come close to the true 1080i resolution in pixels captured, where does this leave us? And if you are a modern media artist who relies upon compositing, who wants to de-interlace? For the life of me I can't understand why they didn't include a 720 30p mode. Why? Is it all a conspiracy. No manual controlls in one, no progressive in another? I can't wait for a legit review. Hopefully non Sony sponsored if that is possible. Should be around March, shortly after this cam shops in volume. One thing for sure, I would bite the ass off a dead horse to have those manual controls on my HD-10 ;>) Long live the HD-10 and welcome the FX1 ! HDV is here to stay. __________________ Damnit Jim, I'm a film maker not a sysytems tech.

September 11th, 2004, 10:23 AM	#3
Ed Hill Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Atlanta, GA, USA Posts: 104	I'm not surpeised that the FX1 has the failings it does. Nonetheless the all manual control capability is a good step up from the HD10. This camera is no threat to existing Sony consumer type standard def cameras. Price is always a factor in the consumer market. Only consumers with deep pockets and early adopters of technology will even look at this camera. In the Pro market this camera is again no threat to existing Sony models. With 1/3 inch CCD's most pro studios and TV stations will njot even look at the new FX1. Video studios & TV stations are now used to larger CCD image areas ( 2/3 inch is common), and expect to pay $ 15K to $ 100K for cameras. The new FX1 might be perfect for colleges, local cable operators, small market TV stations, event videographers, and new production companies like mine. __________________ Ed Hill HighlyDef Productions, Atlanta, GA prblog.edhillpr.com Video and Online Advertising ed@highlydef.com

September 11th, 2004, 10:53 AM	#4
Wayne Orr Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Northridge Ca Posts: 734	Consider the possibility that the purpose of the new Sony FX1 is to sell hi def televisions. Hi Def has been an underperformer in the United States, and in PAL countries, its not even a blip on the radar. But give the consumers a camera that shoots hi def, and you sell a television set to go with it. Certainly, consumers aren't rushing out to buy hi def tv's to watch Jay Leno. But given the opportunity to capture their kids' birthday parties, and all of life's experiences in beautiful hi definition (that we all know will eventually be the de facto standard), maybe they pop for both the camera and the television. And the average consumer doesn't know or care about the difference between progressive and interlaced. I guarantee that Sony didn't release this camera because they were concerned about a relatively small market of aspiring filmmakers. And btw, neither did JVC. Just my 2¢ __________________ Wayne If it was easy, they'd get a relative to do it.

September 11th, 2004, 11:49 AM	#5
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Wayne makes a very keen point. Sony's bet on HD actually goes beyond selling televisions. Their stake travels up the chain into their broadcast holdings and interests. So it is, indeed, very much in their interests that HD begins to grow legs. __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

September 11th, 2004, 05:49 AM	#2
Anhar Miah Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: United Kindom, England Posts: 290	maybe just maybe (my speculation) is that since the FX1 is a "consumer" cam they need to take something off, so that their "pro" cameras can have progressive mode. Maybe its the old VX and PD route all over again.