Dropout issues? at DVinfo.net

Eric Johannes · January 25th, 2007, 12:54 PM

I am just digitizing some footage from my V1U and it looks fabulous. I shoot in 1080i.

I have been noticing some dropouts (digital pixeling) more than I would expect. Many times it was when the camera was moving suddenly and therefore the footage was not important, but now I am seeing more of it.

I was digitizing some footage of a man ice skating when it happened at the worst possible moment...it was a large wide digital artifact that ruined the shot.

Is this something you HDV guys live with? Or is this unique to my camera? I have shot SD with our 2 Sony DSR-250's for years and have never seen this amount of dropouts (or whatever they are called) and I'm becoming alarmed.

Does anyone have any insights? Is there something I am possibly doing wrong?

On one dropout I noticed last week....I just re-digitized the clip and it wasn't on the tape the second time around. But this latest spot has been redigi'd 4 times now, and it stays in the same spot and has ruined the shot.

Do I have a lemon?

Zsolt Gordos · January 25th, 2007, 01:17 PM

What sort of tape do you use?

Paul Frederick · January 25th, 2007, 01:23 PM

I don't have enough hours on my V1 to say if this camera is prone to dropouts. I have shot HUNDREDS of hours of footage on my FX1 and can only say I've seen maybe 5 or 6 dropouts. I use Panasonic Master tapes (the white ones) and sometimes I use the regular Panasonic tapes. I try to avoid mixing brands.

If you are seeing that many, I suspect you either have some bad tape stock or there is something wrong with the camera.

Eric Johannes · January 25th, 2007, 01:34 PM

Sony Digital Master HDV 63 mins. PVHDM-63DM

this is VERY disappointing.

I wonder if anyone else has heard of this?

Lee Berger · January 25th, 2007, 03:53 PM

When recording long GOP, where only every 15th frame is real, there is a some risk of a catastrophic dropout. If you're using Final Cut Pro you might try Digital Heaven's DH_Dropout Plugin. I use it on Betacam dropouts and it works quite well.

http://www.digital-heaven.co.uk/fcpl...dh_dropout.php

So far I've only shot some test footage in HDV on my V1U and haven't noticed any dropouts. Time will tell.

Keith Moreau · January 25th, 2007, 06:47 PM

I have shot about 3 hours on 3 tapes. On the very first tape I shot, using the supplied Sony Master tape that was in the box, I experienced 1 dropout about 5 minutes into the tape, which I think was the first dropout in HDV (I had been using a Sony HC1) I'd ever experienced. It manifested itself as a 'skip' in a long pan I was doing, as if time had just been cut out. I had been using Panasonic masters previously but I didn't have one of those tapes for the first shoot and so used the supplied Sony master tape. Later tapes I used the Panasonic Master tapes DVMQ-63, and haven't experienced a dropout since.

Perhaps it is the Sony tapes, I had never used them before and they are about 3 times the cost of the Panasonic Masters so I'm going to continue to use the Panasonic tapes unless I have problems.

Regards,

-Keith

Chris Hurd · January 25th, 2007, 06:56 PM

On *any* brand new camcorder, as soon as it comes out of the box, you'll want to run a head-cleaning cassette for a few seconds before putting in that first tape. This practice solves 95% of all dropout issues associated with new camcorders.

This issue is *not* limited to any one particular make or model of DV or HDV camcorder.

Steve Mullen · January 25th, 2007, 07:55 PM

I've shot over 8 hours and the drop-outs are typical for HDV. I use only Sony and JVC DV/HDV tapes. I nevr use Panasonic tapes.

I feel the Sony HDV tape is worth the price.

Dave F. Nelson · January 25th, 2007, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Mullen

I've shot over 8 hours and the drop-outs are typical for HDV. I use only Sony and JVC DV/HDV tapes. I nevr use Panasonic tapes.

I feel the Sony HDV tape is worth the price.

I use Sony tapes too. I have never used either Panasonic or JVC tapes, but I find the above statement interesting. Both Panasonic and JVC are divisions of the same parent company, Matsushita Electric Industrial Co. of Japan. I would guess that both tapes come off the same production line and just get different labels slapped on them, although I couldn't say so for sure.

I have had good results over the years with Sony tapes.

Ken Ross · January 25th, 2007, 08:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric Johannes

I am just digitizing some footage from my V1U and it looks fabulous. I shoot in 1080i.

I have been noticing some dropouts (digital pixeling) more than I would expect. Many times it was when the camera was moving suddenly and therefore the footage was not important, but now I am seeing more of it.

I was digitizing some footage of a man ice skating when it happened at the worst possible moment...it was a large wide digital artifact that ruined the shot.

Is this something you HDV guys live with? Or is this unique to my camera? I have shot SD with our 2 Sony DSR-250's for years and have never seen this amount of dropouts (or whatever they are called) and I'm becoming alarmed.

Does anyone have any insights? Is there something I am possibly doing wrong?

On one dropout I noticed last week....I just re-digitized the clip and it wasn't on the tape the second time around. But this latest spot has been redigi'd 4 times now, and it stays in the same spot and has ruined the shot.

Do I have a lemon?

Sometimes new heads need to be run in a bit. Some units don't seem to have this issue and others do. This is not related to just Sony cams, but any cams. The other thing is that if you rewind the tape to the point you first saw the dropout, and on a 2nd play it's gone, it was never a dropout.

Robert Ducon · January 25th, 2007, 11:09 PM

I shot over 50 tapes over 2006, and experienced drop outs on every tape, on every shoot. I just take it and live with it.. one reason to shoot a safety for every take.

Z1U and FX1.

Doug Graham · January 26th, 2007, 04:41 PM

Something's amiss, Robert. You should not be experiencing that high a number of dropouts.

As for the original poster...you said the (latest) problem occurred when shooting an ice skater. How cold was the camera? I have had small Sony camcorders start to glitch in various ways in cold weather (below 30 deg F). The colder the camera, the worse the operation.

John Hewat · January 26th, 2007, 08:06 PM

I have been shooting with a Z1 for over a year and only ever had one drop-out.

I've barely shot 10 hours of footage with the V1 and already had 3 or 4 drop-outs. On the expensive Pro tapes, too.

Ken Ross · January 27th, 2007, 08:14 AM

Interestingly the only time I've had droputs was with the Sony HDV tape. Once I went back to regular Sony mini-DV tapes all was fine. Go figure.

Ron Little · January 27th, 2007, 08:28 AM

I shoot on Maxell tape the cheapest I can find and have had no problems. I have only shot a few hours from my V1 but have had my hc1 for over a year with no problem. I can only think of one dropout on my hc1 and that was the first tape I ran thru it. I am probably just lucky. I will continue to use the cheep tape unless there is a problem. I just looked and I have over 400 hours of dv on Mexell tape.

January 25th, 2007, 12:54 PM	#1
Eric Johannes New Boot Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: St. Paul, MN Posts: 11	Dropout issues? I am just digitizing some footage from my V1U and it looks fabulous. I shoot in 1080i. I have been noticing some dropouts (digital pixeling) more than I would expect. Many times it was when the camera was moving suddenly and therefore the footage was not important, but now I am seeing more of it. I was digitizing some footage of a man ice skating when it happened at the worst possible moment...it was a large wide digital artifact that ruined the shot. Is this something you HDV guys live with? Or is this unique to my camera? I have shot SD with our 2 Sony DSR-250's for years and have never seen this amount of dropouts (or whatever they are called) and I'm becoming alarmed. Does anyone have any insights? Is there something I am possibly doing wrong? On one dropout I noticed last week....I just re-digitized the clip and it wasn't on the tape the second time around. But this latest spot has been redigi'd 4 times now, and it stays in the same spot and has ruined the shot. Do I have a lemon?

January 25th, 2007, 01:17 PM	#2
Zsolt Gordos Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Budapest, Hungary Posts: 414	What sort of tape do you use? __________________ Sony XDCAM EX1r, Canon 5DMkII, Røde NTG2, Røde NT1000, Røde Stereo Videomic, Sachtler DV6 SB on Gitzo 1325V, Steadicam Merlin, Omnitracker, Hackintosh 3.5Ghz Quad 8Gb RAM

January 25th, 2007, 06:56 PM	#7
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	On any brand new camcorder, as soon as it comes out of the box, you'll want to run a head-cleaning cassette for a few seconds before putting in that first tape. This practice solves 95% of all dropout issues associated with new camcorders. This issue is not limited to any one particular make or model of DV or HDV camcorder. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

January 25th, 2007, 07:55 PM	#8
Steve Mullen HDV Cinema Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Las Vegas Posts: 4,007	I've shot over 8 hours and the drop-outs are typical for HDV. I use only Sony and JVC DV/HDV tapes. I nevr use Panasonic tapes. I feel the Sony HDV tape is worth the price. __________________ Switcher's Quick Guide to the Avid Media Composer >>> http://home.mindspring.com/~d-v-c

January 25th, 2007, 11:09 PM	#11
Robert Ducon Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Victoria BC Posts: 400	I shot over 50 tapes over 2006, and experienced drop outs on every tape, on every shoot. I just take it and live with it.. one reason to shoot a safety for every take. Z1U and FX1. __________________ Mac + Canon HV20

January 25th, 2007, 01:23 PM	#3
Paul Frederick Major Player Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: WestChazy, NY Posts: 291	I don't have enough hours on my V1 to say if this camera is prone to dropouts. I have shot HUNDREDS of hours of footage on my FX1 and can only say I've seen maybe 5 or 6 dropouts. I use Panasonic Master tapes (the white ones) and sometimes I use the regular Panasonic tapes. I try to avoid mixing brands. If you are seeing that many, I suspect you either have some bad tape stock or there is something wrong with the camera.

January 25th, 2007, 01:34 PM	#4
Eric Johannes New Boot Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: St. Paul, MN Posts: 11	Sony Digital Master HDV 63 mins. PVHDM-63DM this is VERY disappointing. I wonder if anyone else has heard of this?

January 25th, 2007, 03:53 PM	#5
Lee Berger Major Player Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Tallahassee, Florida Posts: 326	When recording long GOP, where only every 15th frame is real, there is a some risk of a catastrophic dropout. If you're using Final Cut Pro you might try Digital Heaven's DH_Dropout Plugin. I use it on Betacam dropouts and it works quite well. http://www.digital-heaven.co.uk/fcpl...dh_dropout.php So far I've only shot some test footage in HDV on my V1U and haven't noticed any dropouts. Time will tell.

January 25th, 2007, 06:47 PM	#6
Keith Moreau Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Brisbane, California Posts: 530	I have shot about 3 hours on 3 tapes. On the very first tape I shot, using the supplied Sony Master tape that was in the box, I experienced 1 dropout about 5 minutes into the tape, which I think was the first dropout in HDV (I had been using a Sony HC1) I'd ever experienced. It manifested itself as a 'skip' in a long pan I was doing, as if time had just been cut out. I had been using Panasonic masters previously but I didn't have one of those tapes for the first shoot and so used the supplied Sony master tape. Later tapes I used the Panasonic Master tapes DVMQ-63, and haven't experienced a dropout since. Perhaps it is the Sony tapes, I had never used them before and they are about 3 times the cost of the Panasonic Masters so I'm going to continue to use the Panasonic tapes unless I have problems. Regards, -Keith

January 26th, 2007, 04:41 PM	#12
Doug Graham Video Bear Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Stafford, VA, USA Posts: 45	Something's amiss, Robert. You should not be experiencing that high a number of dropouts. As for the original poster...you said the (latest) problem occurred when shooting an ice skater. How cold was the camera? I have had small Sony camcorders start to glitch in various ways in cold weather (below 30 deg F). The colder the camera, the worse the operation. __________________ Regards, Doug Graham

January 26th, 2007, 08:06 PM	#13
John Hewat Major Player Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Melbourne, AUSTRALIA Posts: 735	I have been shooting with a Z1 for over a year and only ever had one drop-out. I've barely shot 10 hours of footage with the V1 and already had 3 or 4 drop-outs. On the expensive Pro tapes, too. __________________ John Hewat Mammoth Media Productions

January 27th, 2007, 08:14 AM	#14
Ken Ross Trustee Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: New York Posts: 1,945	Interestingly the only time I've had droputs was with the Sony HDV tape. Once I went back to regular Sony mini-DV tapes all was fine. Go figure.

January 27th, 2007, 08:28 AM	#15
Ron Little Major Player Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Pensacola Fl. Posts: 627	I shoot on Maxell tape the cheapest I can find and have had no problems. I have only shot a few hours from my V1 but have had my hc1 for over a year with no problem. I can only think of one dropout on my hc1 and that was the first tape I ran thru it. I am probably just lucky. I will continue to use the cheep tape unless there is a problem. I just looked and I have over 400 hours of dv on Mexell tape.