V1 25p issues (combined threads)

Zsolt Gordos · December 15th, 2006, 04:57 PM

Now I am seriously worried. My V1 arrives on Monday. Maybe I will use same day delivery - as in back to the store...

Peter Sieben · December 15th, 2006, 05:02 PM

Hi Spot, the only thing I managed to find within the small session this afternoon was setting the shutter speed at 1/50 second (and activating the 25P modus). To have a nice average framerate for 25P footage. I didn't touch any other functions in the camera as it was basically coming straight from the box. Could this cause the image/gain problems?

Peter Sieben · December 15th, 2006, 05:07 PM

Here is one videoclip from the footage (in HD WMV9 format):
http://www.videomontageforum.nl/ubbt...?Number=104504

Douglas Spotted Eagle · December 15th, 2006, 05:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Sieben

Hi Spot, the only thing I managed to find within the small session this afternoon was setting the shutter speed at 1/50 second (and activating the 25P modus). To have a nice average framerate for 25P footage. I didn't touch any other functions in the camera as it was basically coming straight from the box. Could this cause the image/gain problems?

Could this cause the image/gain problems?
Absolutely! Most likely, in fact.
To correctly set the camcorder for manual gain, select the menu button.
Now select Camera Setup.
Now scroll down to Iris.
Set Iris to "Iris." Not Iris-Auto Shutter, and not Iris Auto Gain.
Scroll back up to exit.
Select menu again to exit the menu.
Now your gain is manual, and displayed in the preview window.

Peter Sieben · December 15th, 2006, 05:23 PM

Thanks Spot. Within two weeks I might be able to do a second try and will alter the settings as you described. Weird that the standard settings are not doing the camera any justice.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · December 15th, 2006, 05:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Sieben

Thanks Spot. Within two weeks I might be able to do a second try and will alter the settings as you described. Weird that the standard settings are not doing the camera any justice.

But they are. You didn't use the standard settings, you went into the menu and modified the camera. If you're shooting manual, then the manufacturer expects you've looked into the menus and set it up for manual use. If you want "easy" mode, put the cam in the Green Box/Easy mode and shoot that way. Whether it's Sony, Canon, Panasonic, JVC, or whomever, I'm not sure how they could have a "de-suck" setting that would say "well...he's got this in manual and that in auto, and it will look bad, so we'd better modify this to prevent suckage..." ;-)

Boyd Ostroff · December 15th, 2006, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Sieben

I had the chance to shoot some 25P footage with the Z1 PAL camera this afternoon.

Peter: you said the camera was a Z1 in both the title of the thread and in your post. Did you mean V1???

Zsolt Gordos · December 15th, 2006, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boyd Ostroff

Peter: you said the camera was a Z1 in both the title of the thread and in your post. Did you mean V1???

its quite likely a typo error as Z1 cannot shoot 25p.

Peter Sieben · December 15th, 2006, 06:15 PM

Sorry guys, yes it was a V1 I hold this afternoon.

Boyd Ostroff · December 15th, 2006, 06:27 PM

Thanks Peter. I have changed the title of the thread to correct this.

Thomas Smet · December 15th, 2006, 06:49 PM

Wow are those bad. While this may be an easy fix I wonder what the heck SONY was thinking by letting this get past quality control. I mean even a two year old would be able to tell that those images just are not right. At least JVC with the split screen issue had a valid technical reason for doing it the way they did. You could still use the camera but you had to be carefull.

Some of these images to me kind of look how a really bad flat panel HDTV will try to upsample and sharpen footage and it comes out with this very odd look. From a distance it looks ok but up close it looks like poodoo.

Tony Tremble · December 16th, 2006, 01:48 AM

Guys the oil paint problem is magnified with the gain up.

The oil paint efect is cause by an over aggressive noise (high frequency) filter. Any high frequency detail or noise in an image is smoothed out.

Come on, let's not for get Sony know about the problem and are working on a fix.

Yes, the 25P mode is dreadful but for only the time being.

IT'S GOING TO BE FIXED.

TT

Tony Tremble · December 16th, 2006, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thomas Smet

From a distance it looks ok but up close it looks like poodoo.

It doesn't look that good!!!!

:)

Zsolt Gordos · December 16th, 2006, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Tremble

Yes, the 25P mode is dreadful but for only the time being.

IT'S GOING TO BE FIXED.

TT

Tony, are you certain about this? You seem to know more than you share :)

I dont mind that, I just dont want to end up without a fix.

Tony Tremble · December 16th, 2006, 02:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zsolt Gordos

Tony, are you certain about this? You seem to know more than you share :)

I dont mind that, I just dont want to end up without a fix.

I am not holding anything back. There is nothing more that can be said. Sony know about the problem and it will be fixed...

TT

December 15th, 2006, 05:02 PM	#122
Peter Sieben Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 345	Hi Spot, the only thing I managed to find within the small session this afternoon was setting the shutter speed at 1/50 second (and activating the 25P modus). To have a nice average framerate for 25P footage. I didn't touch any other functions in the camera as it was basically coming straight from the box. Could this cause the image/gain problems? __________________ Peter / Orphic Film www.orphicfilm.nl and www.myspace.com/orphicfilm

December 15th, 2006, 05:07 PM	#123
Peter Sieben Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 345	Here is one videoclip from the footage (in HD WMV9 format): http://www.videomontageforum.nl/ubbt...?Number=104504 __________________ Peter / Orphic Film www.orphicfilm.nl and www.myspace.com/orphicfilm

December 15th, 2006, 05:23 PM	#125
Peter Sieben Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 345	Thanks Spot. Within two weeks I might be able to do a second try and will alter the settings as you described. Weird that the standard settings are not doing the camera any justice. __________________ Peter / Orphic Film www.orphicfilm.nl and www.myspace.com/orphicfilm

December 15th, 2006, 06:15 PM	#129
Peter Sieben Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 345	a V1 ! Sorry guys, yes it was a V1 I hold this afternoon. __________________ Peter / Orphic Film www.orphicfilm.nl and www.myspace.com/orphicfilm

December 15th, 2006, 04:57 PM	#121
Zsolt Gordos Major Player Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Budapest, Hungary Posts: 414	Now I am seriously worried. My V1 arrives on Monday. Maybe I will use same day delivery - as in back to the store...

December 15th, 2006, 06:27 PM	#130
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,801	Thanks Peter. I have changed the title of the thread to correct this.

December 15th, 2006, 06:49 PM	#131
Thomas Smet Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 1,719	Wow are those bad. While this may be an easy fix I wonder what the heck SONY was thinking by letting this get past quality control. I mean even a two year old would be able to tell that those images just are not right. At least JVC with the split screen issue had a valid technical reason for doing it the way they did. You could still use the camera but you had to be carefull. Some of these images to me kind of look how a really bad flat panel HDTV will try to upsample and sharpen footage and it comes out with this very odd look. From a distance it looks ok but up close it looks like poodoo.

December 16th, 2006, 01:48 AM	#132
Tony Tremble Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 451	Guys the oil paint problem is magnified with the gain up. The oil paint efect is cause by an over aggressive noise (high frequency) filter. Any high frequency detail or noise in an image is smoothed out. Come on, let's not for get Sony know about the problem and are working on a fix. Yes, the 25P mode is dreadful but for only the time being. IT'S GOING TO BE FIXED. TT