24p edit at DVinfo.net

Bob Zimmerman · September 22nd, 2006, 02:35 PM

On the Sony V1 page, in the intro it says shoot in progessive and then edit using standard HDV equipment. What does that mean? When you shoot 24p progessive can you edit it with iMovie?. Final Cut Express?

Do you need Final Cut Pro to edit with this camera?

Jerry Waters · September 22nd, 2006, 09:22 PM

On the Sony site it says it shoots 24p but is recorded to tape as 60i (sort of a reverse pulldown as I understand) so you can edit it. However, it also said that several NLEs were working on capturing back to 24p and it would edit in that. They have a whole workflow laid out on their site.

Bob Zimmerman · September 22nd, 2006, 09:42 PM

so at some point you will be able to shoot 24p capture in 24p and edit in 24p? When the new FCP come out?

Steve Mullen · September 23rd, 2006, 12:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Zimmerman

On the Sony V1 page, in the intro it says shoot in progessive and then edit using standard HDV equipment. What does that mean? When you shoot 24p progessive can you edit it with iMovie?. Final Cut Express?

Do you need Final Cut Pro to edit with this camera?

They are correct -- you can edit Sony 24p in any 60i equipment -- that's the nature of pulldown. It can, but need not be, removed.

Douglas Spotted Eagle · September 23rd, 2006, 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Zimmerman

so at some point you will be able to shoot 24p capture in 24p and edit in 24p? When the new FCP come out?

You don't *need* to remove the pulldown, but virtually everyone *wants* to remove the pulldown. You can edit the 60i in FCP now, but Apple will have pulldown removal out soon, or so they say.
24p footage edits best as 24p footage, and 24p put to DVD as 24p allows for up to 25% more efficient storage, meaning you can have a higher bitrate for the same length movie as you would be able to enjoy in a 60i output. If the DVD player can't play out the 24p media as 24p, it inserts the pulldown at the player, just like a standard Hollywood release.
In another thread in this same category, Barry Green enumerates the many reasons why you'd *prefer* editing 24p footage as 24p, even though it's quite convenient to transport it as 60i.
All that said, I'm not a huge proponent of 24p; I'd submit that 24p cadence is responsible for far more crummy-looking films have been made due to lack of understanding of shooting 24p than video projects that have used 60i as their acquisition format. Well shot 24p is great for a lot of projects, including features, but it's not always the best format for high motion.

Jerry Waters · September 23rd, 2006, 05:14 AM

What is best and why, Douglas? Frankly, I am surprised how well 60i renders to 24p out of Vegas. I'd take a short answer. I already bought the new book but all this is changing so fast. Also, I can't locate the Barry Green post. The name heading it must have changed.

Bob Zimmerman · September 23rd, 2006, 06:55 AM

I think Spot is talking about Barry's post in the 'sony unveils new 24p HDV camcorder' number 86

Bob Zimmerman · September 23rd, 2006, 06:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Douglas Spotted Eagle

You don't *need* to remove the pulldown, but virtually everyone *wants* to remove the pulldown. You can edit the 60i in FCP now, but Apple will have pulldown removal out soon, or so they say.
24p footage edits best as 24p footage, and 24p put to DVD as 24p allows for up to 25% more efficient storage, meaning you can have a higher bitrate for the same length movie as you would be able to enjoy in a 60i output. If the DVD player can't play out the 24p media as 24p, it inserts the pulldown at the player, just like a standard Hollywood release.
In another thread in this same category, Barry Green enumerates the many reasons why you'd *prefer* editing 24p footage as 24p, even though it's quite convenient to transport it as 60i.
All that said, I'm not a huge proponent of 24p; I'd submit that 24p cadence is responsible for far more crummy-looking films have been made due to lack of understanding of shooting 24p than video projects that have used 60i as their acquisition format. Well shot 24p is great for a lot of projects, including features, but it's not always the best format for high motion.

thanks. But it was smart to put 24p on the V1.

Bob Zimmerman · September 23rd, 2006, 08:26 AM

but can you record in 24p then edit in a 60i timeline in something like final cut express HD? Or does it have to be FCP?

Douglas Spotted Eagle · September 23rd, 2006, 09:22 AM

Any editing application will work great with the 60i. Even FCP Express, iMovie, whatever you want. Sony Vegas, IMO, manages 24p better than anything there is, and also does the most respectable conversion to 24p than any NLE I've ever seen. There are some specialty softwares that do a good conversion as well.

Betsy Moore · September 24th, 2006, 12:59 AM

Will there be an update for those of us with G5 Final Cut Pros? Or is my 9 month old computer already out of date?

Evan C. King · September 24th, 2006, 01:07 AM

Since FCP is now universal the updates count for both ppc and intel machines. No need to worry. The update is free through software update and should be up in a month.

Jerry Waters · September 24th, 2006, 06:47 AM

How long are any of us "in date" now?

Betsy Moore · September 24th, 2006, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jerry Waters

How long are any of us "in date" now?

Why Jerry... you're a philosopher...

Thanks Evan:) One less thing to worry 'bout...

Thomas Smet · September 24th, 2006, 06:57 PM

What about Cineform? They have been able to pull out the 24p from Cineframe24 for a long time now. As far as I know Cineframe24 uses the same type of pulldown sitting inside of a 60i stream.

I can see no reason why Premiere Pro users who use Cineform wouldn't be able to handle the 24p footage right away or at least with a small update which should come very fast.

September 22nd, 2006, 02:35 PM	#1
Bob Zimmerman Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Illinois Posts: 888	24p edit On the Sony V1 page, in the intro it says shoot in progessive and then edit using standard HDV equipment. What does that mean? When you shoot 24p progessive can you edit it with iMovie?. Final Cut Express? Do you need Final Cut Pro to edit with this camera?

September 22nd, 2006, 09:22 PM	#2
Jerry Waters Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 136	On the Sony site it says it shoots 24p but is recorded to tape as 60i (sort of a reverse pulldown as I understand) so you can edit it. However, it also said that several NLEs were working on capturing back to 24p and it would edit in that. They have a whole workflow laid out on their site. __________________ Jerry Waters Arize Productions

September 23rd, 2006, 05:14 AM	#6
Jerry Waters Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 136	What is best and why, Douglas? Frankly, I am surprised how well 60i renders to 24p out of Vegas. I'd take a short answer. I already bought the new book but all this is changing so fast. Also, I can't locate the Barry Green post. The name heading it must have changed. __________________ Jerry Waters Arize Productions

September 23rd, 2006, 09:22 AM	#10
Douglas Spotted Eagle VASST Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Stockton, UT Posts: 5,648	Any editing application will work great with the 60i. Even FCP Express, iMovie, whatever you want. Sony Vegas, IMO, manages 24p better than anything there is, and also does the most respectable conversion to 24p than any NLE I've ever seen. There are some specialty softwares that do a good conversion as well. __________________ Douglas Spotted Eagle/Spot Author, producer, composer Certified Sony Vegas Trainer http://www.vasst.com

September 24th, 2006, 06:47 AM	#13
Jerry Waters Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 136	How long are any of us "in date" now? __________________ Jerry Waters Arize Productions

September 22nd, 2006, 09:42 PM	#3
Bob Zimmerman Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Illinois Posts: 888	so at some point you will be able to shoot 24p capture in 24p and edit in 24p? When the new FCP come out?

September 23rd, 2006, 06:55 AM	#7
Bob Zimmerman Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Illinois Posts: 888	I think Spot is talking about Barry's post in the 'sony unveils new 24p HDV camcorder' number 86

September 23rd, 2006, 08:26 AM	#9
Bob Zimmerman Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Illinois Posts: 888	but can you record in 24p then edit in a 60i timeline in something like final cut express HD? Or does it have to be FCP?

September 24th, 2006, 12:59 AM	#11
Betsy Moore Major Player Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 444	Will there be an update for those of us with G5 Final Cut Pros? Or is my 9 month old computer already out of date?

September 24th, 2006, 01:07 AM	#12
Evan C. King Major Player Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Toronto Posts: 532	Since FCP is now universal the updates count for both ppc and intel machines. No need to worry. The update is free through software update and should be up in a month.

September 24th, 2006, 06:57 PM	#15
Thomas Smet Trustee Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 1,719	What about Cineform? They have been able to pull out the 24p from Cineframe24 for a long time now. As far as I know Cineframe24 uses the same type of pulldown sitting inside of a 60i stream. I can see no reason why Premiere Pro users who use Cineform wouldn't be able to handle the 24p footage right away or at least with a small update which should come very fast.