Sony FDR-AX100

[Dave Blackhurst]

@Mark -
I'm "guessing" that the WiFi image is much lower rez than HDMI? Can anyone confirm the resolution on phone or tablet? I'm with Ken that the horsepower is probably not there to encode/write AND generate a signal to HDMI, but who knows!? I'm sure the Sony engineers had a "good" reason, but from this side of the looking glass, it's hard to know these things, we can only guess....



@Cliff -

re: the LANC... can you confirm the configuration you're using - I'm presuming the VMC-AVM1 adapter and RM-AV2 with the "D" A/V plug? I've got that combo and am trying to sort out using it with the RX series... it "should" work, but for some odd reason doesn't (see above!). The VPR1/VPR10 remotes use the MULTI, have the same chip that is in the AV2, which basically does the same thing in both units - allows remote control of zoom, on/off, shutter, record (the VPR "handle" I have adds a couple things). Glad to hear that it "should" work with the AX100 at least, as the camera is on the "acquire soon" list.

The instructions with the AVM1 show it for "Handycam", but strangely not for the Cybershots, even though the interface is definitely THERE on the MULTI interface to allow remote control!

So far I've got pinouts, and have the two controllers apart for "examination", just haven't figured out the "key" to unlock the function - Sony uses "trigger" resistors, and somehow the VPR's do something a little different from the AV2 LANC controls... I suspect it's just a resistor on one of the other pins....

It would help to know for sure that the AVM1/AV2 combo does work on the AX100, I'm presuming that the VPR's also work...

Sony comes up with these "new improved" interfaces, and it's "fun" to try to figure out how to make them do what you expect!! The MULTI seems to replace the A/V, which replaced the LANC and A/V.

[Glen Vandermolen]

I just got an email from B&H that said the AX100 is now in stock.
Who pre-ordered one?

[Ken Ross]

I would suggest that anyone ordering this from B&H do it soon, since it will probably go to 'back ordered' before too long.

This has not proven to be an easy camera to get and I just lucked out getting it from Value Electronics.

[Cliff Totten]

Originally Posted by Dave Blackhurst

@Mark -
I'm "guessing" that the WiFi image is much lower rez than HDMI? Can anyone confirm the resolution on phone or tablet? I'm with Ken that the horsepower is probably not there to encode/write AND generate a signal to HDMI, but who knows!? I'm sure the Sony engineers had a "good" reason, but from this side of the looking glass, it's hard to know these things, we can only guess....



@Cliff -

re: the LANC... can you confirm the configuration you're using - I'm presuming the VMC-AVM1 adapter and RM-AV2 with the "D" A/V plug? I've got that combo and am trying to sort out using it with the RX series... it "should" work, but for some odd reason doesn't (see above!). The VPR1/VPR10 remotes use the MULTI, have the same chip that is in the AV2, which basically does the same thing in both units - allows remote control of zoom, on/off, shutter, record (the VPR "handle" I have adds a couple things). Glad to hear that it "should" work with the AX100 at least, as the camera is on the "acquire soon" list.

The instructions with the AVM1 show it for "Handycam", but strangely not for the Cybershots, even though the interface is definitely THERE on the MULTI interface to allow remote control!

So far I've got pinouts, and have the two controllers apart for "examination", just haven't figured out the "key" to unlock the function - Sony uses "trigger" resistors, and somehow the VPR's do something a little different from the AV2 LANC controls... I suspect it's just a resistor on one of the other pins....

It would help to know for sure that the AVM1/AV2 combo does work on the AX100, I'm presuming that the VPR's also work...

Sony comes up with these "new improved" interfaces, and it's "fun" to try to figure out how to make them do what you expect!! The MULTI seems to replace the A/V, which replaced the LANC and A/V.

Yup, I got the Sony multi interface to the older AV "round" adapter. I have another LANC to Sony AV "round" adapter to convert that.

I originally got this for my RX10 and that didnt work. I just tried it in my AX100 and it worked perfectly.

CT

[Steve Mullen]

Originally Posted by Mark Rosenzweig

You can download the original XAVC-S video.

Nice job.

The Vimeo site only shows an "HD 1920x1080" file -- no 3840x2160 file which makes sense since I don't think Vimeo supports UHD. But, your info says you shot 4K. Did you upload FHD or UHD? In any case, the only download isn't UHD it's FHD.

MOREOVER, it is not the original file uploaded file. It is the Vimeo 4.5Mbps compressed FHD file. (I'm not sure why anyone is using Vimeo now that they are shooting UHD.)

On YouTube there is a UHD version that can be played, but Downloading isn't possible.

It would be nice to be able to download the UHD version.

Were you mostly shooting in Tele because there was a lot of very tiny jitter?

[Rodman Bourne]

My first AX100 4K Video post....

My First Sony FDR AX100 4K Video Water and Snow - YouTube

[Dave Blackhurst]

Originally Posted by Cliff Totten

Yup, I got the Sony multi interface to the older AV "round" adapter. I have another LANC to Sony AV "round" adapter to convert that.

I originally got this for my RX10 and that didnt work. I just tried it in my AX100 and it worked perfectly.

CT

OK, just to double check, it's the AVM1 Multi to A/V... then an A/V to 2.5mm... then the LANC w/2.5mm? Reason for asking is that the original "adapters" from 2.5mm to A/V have an added trigger resistor in the mix, and I'm trying to figure out what additional trigger mechanism is being used by the VPR remotes so that the signal get through to the RX's - I'm pretty sure the VPR tripods work with the AX100... and they work with the RX's (and other Cybershots with MULTI)... the mystery is why the AVM1 adapter isn't working between the AV2 (native A/V plug on the old LANC Sony used to make) and the RX's....

I'll post if I figure this one out, since I've got several AV2's, as I'm sure most of us do, and would like to use 'em - they are small and handy, unlike the VPR's!

[Steve Mullen]

Originally Posted by Peter Siamidis

Yeah it's the low lux setting which drops to 1/30th shutter when there isn't enough light. I'm just curious why I wouldn't always use that in 4k mode given that it records 30fps in 4k mode anyways,....

The reason is that the AX100 needs to be treated and used as a motion picture camera. That's true even at 30p. So shutter speeds of 1/50th or 1/60th and almost NEVER EVER higher. That means constant use of an ND filter to keep the aperture from going higher than f/8 or f/11.

Apply all the cinema rules on shutter-speed (180 rule), keeping the aperture as constant as possible shot to shot (likely f/5.6), use shallow DOF to cover RS and motion judder, pan with a moving subject, don't shoot subjects moving the through the frame at any more than a walking speed, pan at the correct rate for the amount of zoom, and avoid zooms while shooting. And, of course, lock exposure and focus for every shot. In low-light add illumination not gain. Lastly, keep medium focal lengths to avoid CA.

It does look like a tripod will be needed for most shots -- which is a pain.

[Mark Rosenzweig]

Originally Posted by Steve Mullen

Nice job.

The Vimeo site only shows an "HD 1920x1080" file -- no 3840x2160 file which makes sense since I don't think Vimeo supports UHD. But, your info says you shot 4K. Did you upload FHD or UHD? In any case, the only download isn't UHD.

On YouTube there is a UHD version, but Downloading isn't enabled.

It would be nice to be able to download the UHD version.

Were you mostly shooting in Tele because there was a lot of very tiny jitter?

Thanks. You have to log in to Vimeo to access the original, non re-compressed UHD file that I uploaded, and you can download it if you log in (289 people have downloaded it). If you are not a Vimeo member, joining is free.

Many shots in tele, and only Standard OIS was used. To achieve best stability, you need to use Active mode for tele. The jury is still out on whether there is a visible reduction in video quality in that mode.

[Hans Stephan]

as a Vimeo member ..... you will see this:



Hans

[Ken Ross]

Originally Posted by Steve Mullen

Nice job.

The Vimeo site only shows an "HD 1920x1080" file -- no 3840x2160 file which makes sense since I don't think Vimeo supports UHD. But, your info says you shot 4K. Did you upload FHD or UHD? In any case, the only download isn't UHD.

On YouTube there is a UHD version, but Downloading isn't enabled.

It would be nice to be able to download the UHD version.

Steve, you need to be a Vimeo member to access Mark's 4K version. It is there.

Oops, see this was posted already.

[Ron Evans]

Does data code work for the 4K files? It is something that does not yet work on my AX1 so would be interested to find out if it worked on the AX100.

Ron Evans

[Cliff Totten]

"Data code" meaning meaning shot settings display?

If that is what you mean than yes, the AX100 will display "gain", "shutter speed" and "iris" values on playback as well as recording. (something the Handycam CX760 and NXCAM NX30 dont do)

After a full day now with this camera and lot's of nerdy "pixel peeping", I'm starting to respect this low bitrate codec allot more than I originally did.

Despite it's very low numbers, it still seems to hold up remarkably well in the shadows. I cant say that it's as tough as the FS100's CODEC. The FS100 can survive pretty high amounts of grading and gamma curving, bending and stretching. If you push the AX100 beyond "light" grading, artifacts can start popping out of the woodwork. I do think it's "reasonable" though.

There seems to be an odd "grain" to the shadows in detailed patterns....even at 0db. There can also be some very very light "flecks" on some edges. This is all very slight and something you really need to look hard to see.

But this is really nothing when you consider that its only 60Mbp/s recorded onto common SD cards. It seems that Sony really did a great job with that AX100 encoder circuit. I never thought this was possible at 60Mbp/s.

I'm now starting to get a little bit "attached" to my AX100. So far so good. The only "ugly" cripple is that HDMI shut off trick. The thing records 4k,...sends a scaled image to monitor, sends a scaled image over WiFi but refuses to rout that same (already processed) video to the HDMI when the record button is pressed. I'm sorry Sony,...this trick is a real dirty one.

That crippling stunt aside,....I'm starting to love this camera!

Oh,..on rolling shutter:

30p with 1/60 and faster shutter = No "real" Jell-O to speak of.
30p with 1/30 shutter = Only "slight" amounts of Jell-O but easily manageable.
24p with 1/24 shutter = Potentially heavy Jell-O but can be managed if very careful.

I strongly suspect that Sony put allot of extra design hours into the camera. It certainly "feels" like it. It doesn't feel like the usual "crippled" Handycam at all. (HDMI shut off stunt aside)

I think we could all agree that for $2,000, Sony is giving us allot of camera.

Now,....If Sony would release firmware that would unlock the HDMI and add RX10 style, simple "contrast" and "saturation" +/- tweaks....Sony would then have a "perfect" camera to fight the GH4.


Just my $.02

CT

[Ron Evans]

That is good to know but I should tell you both my CX700 and NX30U show full data code on playback by pressing data code button on the remote. Exposure control, white balance, gain, shutter speed, iris as well as date, time and GPS location. I assume you were referring to showing info during recording.

The data code button is on the AX1 but currently does nothing for playback but does show all info during recording just like the NX5U I have too !!! The promised update this summer is supposed to make these work as well as include AVCHD 2.0. We shall see !!!

Ron Evans

[Cliff Totten]

Yup,...during recording. I was always pissed that the CX760 didn't show "gain" during shooting. They gave it to you on playback but not when it was most important...during shooting. (I can imagine those engineers laughing with each other at the design meetings for those cameras) Who thought of that cripple? That was really an "outside the box" stunt.

I would LOVE to see a side by side, AX1 and AX100 low light shootout. What a great A/B test that would be!

Hmmm,...what will Sony add to this possible AX100 "pro" NXCAM model?

CT