Was there a new body at the seminars?

Jason Rodriguez · March 19th, 2007, 08:52 PM

Yikes! Flash from the past!

Haha, that was such a funny read, I love the people wondering how long it was going to be . . . I bet if you told the guys on the "future RED thread" it would be 2.5 years to shipping they would have immediately dismissed the idea as a fable.

Of course we've taken a long time ourselves . . . and it's good to see people like Obin, Juan, and Wayne remaining as active members of this board.

Yep Chris, you've created a great resource here at DVinfo with a solid community of people and well-moderated boards, and you should give yourself a pat on the back for creating an environment that has helped foster the ideas going into the next generation of digital cinema aquisition.

Come by the booth (SL7826) at NAB and we can talk some more about any bake-off's, reviews, etc. you'd like to organize.

Kristin Stewart · March 20th, 2007, 01:19 AM

Chris, yes I agree, my concern wasn't really about the Cineform quality but its price. When you put say $13,000 for a camera, you expect to be able to use it without having to buy a necessary software ($1500 right ?). But I'm coming from the prosumer world ! The Sheer codec seems to be good too. It would be nice if Silicon Imaging could set a complete package with a free licence of Cineform, just like Red with their free Redcine.

The samples of the SI website are really great, it has a S16 feeling I really like. Just another suggestion : if there could be more wide shots (to see details in leaves for instance) it would be paradise !

Congrats anyway to the SI team !

Exciting times !

Kristin

Bob Grant · March 26th, 2007, 06:42 PM

Jason,
I'll be at NAB and one of my primary goals is to bend you or someone's ears about the SI-2K. Really need to get a good handle on what we need to build an end to end solution on a greenfields site.
At the moment it seems to me, perhaps wrongly, that there needs to be a document that defines the whole deal. I realise there's many options and a lot comes from 3rd parties however it's all getting a bit hard trying to cost it all out. Being too flexible can work against you unless you have a chart showing all the paths one might go down or better still a recommended set of paths with rough costings.
Even where to post to get information on your offering seems a bit fragmented.

Jason Rodriguez · March 26th, 2007, 10:53 PM

Looking forward to seeing you there :)

Jerry Waters · March 29th, 2007, 09:48 AM

As the new guy to this block, I have a few questions. I think a comparison of the Red and SI cameras would be interesting but since the complete package of SI is under $20k and the Red (as I read the description on HD for Indies) is about $42k, shouldn't we expect the Red to be better?

Since I can see myself stretching to drop $20k, I can't see myself as a prospective Red customer at this time. And since I spent 25 years as a civil trial lawyer before getting SO interested in video production I have always been impressed by evidence. Last year before NAB I heard for 3 mos about how big the Red exhibit was going to be - Red advertised it heavily. When I got there I saw a tent and a sign "under development."

The week before NAB I see an announcement that SI has developed a working camera and it will be at the show, that it shot RAW with Cineform and I was impressed - even more so when I saw it at the convention.

It was announced that both cameras would be about $17,500. Now we find that to have batteries, etc, in decent configuration Red will run over twice that.

Now I too think it wonderful that these companies are both working to give us something new and useful. I'm also happy to have both companies pushing the envelope. I am not condeming anyone's approach but I cannot help but recall the judge's instruction when the case went to the jury, "You are the sole judges of the credibility of the witnesses and the weight to be given their testimony." I cannot help but have some opinions in that regard from my experience. That could change but I'd need fresh evidence.

Don Donatello · March 29th, 2007, 06:24 PM

please show us where RED is over 2x $$ SI camera .. i guess i could price it 4x if i include master primes on the RED and fuji screw mt lens for SI ?.. i can't find the price list for SI 2k & accessories ? so i don't know the price ..
for under 20k are you talking the mini ?

how about showing this evidence ? prices for same package for both camera's ..
body, same # batts, LCD , i believe the SI needs audio capture device ... and if you wish add on comparable lens or same lens ...if you want to compare apple to apple go 2k to 2k camera's ......or compare apple to oranges 2K to 4k but please list how you are comparing and what items you are including.

Jason Rodriguez · March 29th, 2007, 09:46 PM

Balanced L/R line input and output audio is included in the base SI-2K camera.

March 29th, 2007, 09:48 AM	#35
Jerry Waters Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 136	As the new guy to this block, I have a few questions. I think a comparison of the Red and SI cameras would be interesting but since the complete package of SI is under $20k and the Red (as I read the description on HD for Indies) is about $42k, shouldn't we expect the Red to be better? Since I can see myself stretching to drop $20k, I can't see myself as a prospective Red customer at this time. And since I spent 25 years as a civil trial lawyer before getting SO interested in video production I have always been impressed by evidence. Last year before NAB I heard for 3 mos about how big the Red exhibit was going to be - Red advertised it heavily. When I got there I saw a tent and a sign "under development." The week before NAB I see an announcement that SI has developed a working camera and it will be at the show, that it shot RAW with Cineform and I was impressed - even more so when I saw it at the convention. It was announced that both cameras would be about $17,500. Now we find that to have batteries, etc, in decent configuration Red will run over twice that. Now I too think it wonderful that these companies are both working to give us something new and useful. I'm also happy to have both companies pushing the envelope. I am not condeming anyone's approach but I cannot help but recall the judge's instruction when the case went to the jury, "You are the sole judges of the credibility of the witnesses and the weight to be given their testimony." I cannot help but have some opinions in that regard from my experience. That could change but I'd need fresh evidence. __________________ Jerry Waters Arize Productions

March 19th, 2007, 08:52 PM	#31
Jason Rodriguez Trustee Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 1,095	Yikes! Flash from the past! Haha, that was such a funny read, I love the people wondering how long it was going to be . . . I bet if you told the guys on the "future RED thread" it would be 2.5 years to shipping they would have immediately dismissed the idea as a fable. Of course we've taken a long time ourselves . . . and it's good to see people like Obin, Juan, and Wayne remaining as active members of this board. Yep Chris, you've created a great resource here at DVinfo with a solid community of people and well-moderated boards, and you should give yourself a pat on the back for creating an environment that has helped foster the ideas going into the next generation of digital cinema aquisition. Come by the booth (SL7826) at NAB and we can talk some more about any bake-off's, reviews, etc. you'd like to organize.

March 20th, 2007, 01:19 AM	#32
Kristin Stewart Regular Crew Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Paris, France Posts: 75	Chris, yes I agree, my concern wasn't really about the Cineform quality but its price. When you put say $13,000 for a camera, you expect to be able to use it without having to buy a necessary software ($1500 right ?). But I'm coming from the prosumer world ! The Sheer codec seems to be good too. It would be nice if Silicon Imaging could set a complete package with a free licence of Cineform, just like Red with their free Redcine. The samples of the SI website are really great, it has a S16 feeling I really like. Just another suggestion : if there could be more wide shots (to see details in leaves for instance) it would be paradise ! Congrats anyway to the SI team ! Exciting times ! Kristin

March 26th, 2007, 06:42 PM	#33
Bob Grant Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Sydney Australia Posts: 1,570	Jason, I'll be at NAB and one of my primary goals is to bend you or someone's ears about the SI-2K. Really need to get a good handle on what we need to build an end to end solution on a greenfields site. At the moment it seems to me, perhaps wrongly, that there needs to be a document that defines the whole deal. I realise there's many options and a lot comes from 3rd parties however it's all getting a bit hard trying to cost it all out. Being too flexible can work against you unless you have a chart showing all the paths one might go down or better still a recommended set of paths with rough costings. Even where to post to get information on your offering seems a bit fragmented.

March 26th, 2007, 10:53 PM	#34
Jason Rodriguez Trustee Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 1,095	Looking forward to seeing you there :)

March 29th, 2007, 06:24 PM	#36
Don Donatello Hawaiian Shirt Mogul Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: northern cailfornia Posts: 1,261	please show us where RED is over 2x $$ SI camera .. i guess i could price it 4x if i include master primes on the RED and fuji screw mt lens for SI ?.. i can't find the price list for SI 2k & accessories ? so i don't know the price .. for under 20k are you talking the mini ? how about showing this evidence ? prices for same package for both camera's .. body, same # batts, LCD , i believe the SI needs audio capture device ... and if you wish add on comparable lens or same lens ...if you want to compare apple to apple go 2k to 2k camera's ......or compare apple to oranges 2K to 4k but please list how you are comparing and what items you are including.

March 29th, 2007, 09:46 PM	#37
Jason Rodriguez Trustee Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 1,095	Balanced L/R line input and output audio is included in the base SI-2K camera.