Just want to know.. at DVinfo.net

Andreas Fernbrant · May 10th, 2003, 06:08 PM

I just want to know what you think, what you feel when you see this clip I've made with the XL1.. Opinions please!

http://www.fernbrant.com/andreas/saltomortalez2.mpg

Andreas

Akos Szemenyei · May 10th, 2003, 07:55 PM

The look and feel is really cool, but the whites from the sun looks to be clipped. I 've never shot the sunset with a DV camera so I don't really have any suggestions except maybe put on more ND filters. Otherwise keep up the good work.

Boyd Ostroff · May 10th, 2003, 08:37 PM

Personally I love it. Nice work!

Stylianos Moschapidakis · May 10th, 2003, 09:03 PM

Andreas,

Very good job! Loved it.

Would you like to share the specifics --camera settings, post manupulation etc.?

John Locke · May 10th, 2003, 09:35 PM

I concur, Andreas. Very nice. I'm interested in what Stylianos asked about also.

Brad Simmons · May 11th, 2003, 01:00 AM

Nice clip, I really like the look.

Andreas Fernbrant · May 11th, 2003, 11:19 AM

Hi all, thank you for all the nice replys!

Ok, I'll try to break it down easy.

First off I used interlaced mode (no frames) because I can't do slowmotion with frames.

Gain = +0
Whitebalance= Sunpreset (yeah I know;) but it works!
LENS ND = ON
Polfilter = ON
UVFilter = ON

I did contrast and colorcorrect (pulled up the reds on midtones)

Akos, I agree with you but I don't know how to not get the sun clipped.. Perhaps you have some pointers? I believe that Lens ND + Filter ND would be too much...

Thanks for the support!

/Andy

John Threat · May 11th, 2003, 11:32 AM

gorgeous. I like that the sun is burning on the image.

Akos Szemenyei · May 11th, 2003, 09:33 PM

Sorry, I don't have any pointers at all, film has a lot more latitude so it's easier. Maybe someone else knows how to remedy the clipped sun situation on DV.

Charles Papert · May 11th, 2003, 11:32 PM

Andreas, I too thought this was beautiful imagery.

One way to have avoided the clipped whites in the water would have been to set the tripod lower and eliminate the ocean entirely. I know this seems like sacrilege, but the image would have still been strong graphically (the grass silhouetted against the sky rather than the ocean). This would have brought the sun itself into the frame, but assuming that it would have still been above the figure, you could have used an ND hard grad (.6 or .9) to knock down the sun a bit as well as create a vignette look to the top of the frame that would visually mirror the darkness at the bottom.

This is all just conjecture, because to be honest I don't mind the blown out sun reflection either.

One thing that might be worth looking at is going to a more severe matte like a 1:85 or more, i.e. increasing the size of the letterbox. It might be cleaner to eliminate the half-sun at the top of the frame.

Andreas Fernbrant · May 12th, 2003, 05:32 AM

Charles,

Thank you for the kind words.
I think the TV will matte out the sun for me (safeframe)
I just did this really fast to see how it would look.

Thank you for the pointers, I will try to put on a ND next time!

/Andreas

Dean Sensui · May 12th, 2003, 03:15 PM

Nice... and I don't even see the wires! :-)

Nice saturated colors.

Dean Sensui
Base Two Productions

Wayne Orr · May 12th, 2003, 03:43 PM

What's not to like? Its beautiful! As a point of information, you are probably not getting much effect out of the polarizer, other than knocking down the image a half stop or so. I just don't want people thinking they need to use a pola for sunset shots. I don't think the picture would be nearly so effective if the water was not burned out. Its those differences between light and dark that make pictures interesting. Nice job on the color correction. It would be interesting to show the original, uncorrected footage for comparison.

Andreas Fernbrant · May 12th, 2003, 06:29 PM

Wayne, My thoughts where to use the pol to get more detail in the clouds. More diffrence might be a more correct term when I think of it. But actually I just let it stay on because I used it in the shot before.

www.fernbrant.com/andreas/dvinfo.html
(but the site is down right now. I hope for it to be up soon. Host problems)

There you can find a "before" picture and a picture that takes me to a new problem. I get a kind of aura around or on one side of some objects some times. The aura is most often white. I don't quite know how to minimize or get rid of this unwanted effect.

What pointers do you guys have for me there?

Also, I think the resolution is to low for my tv.. The picture is better then analog video but still not super high resolution.
I know I get a resolution knockoff when I use widescreen and frame mode.. I use both:( Any pointers there to even it out? I can't add resolution but perhaps I can use some filter to get it better? Post production perhaps?

Charles Papert · May 12th, 2003, 08:22 PM

Rather than use the 16:9 mode, just shoot full frame and letterbox later.

You could use software like Magic Bullet to alter the frame rate without the loss of resolution of Frame mode, assuming you can deal with the rendering time!

May 10th, 2003, 06:08 PM	#1
Andreas Fernbrant Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sweden - Helsingborg Posts: 283	Just want to know.. I just want to know what you think, what you feel when you see this clip I've made with the XL1.. Opinions please! http://www.fernbrant.com/andreas/saltomortalez2.mpg Andreas

May 10th, 2003, 09:03 PM	#4
Stylianos Moschapidakis Regular Crew Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Cambridge, MA/Crete, Greece Posts: 189	Andreas, Very good job! Loved it. Would you like to share the specifics --camera settings, post manupulation etc.? __________________ Stelios G.M.

May 10th, 2003, 09:35 PM	#5
John Locke Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Austin, TX USA Posts: 2,882	I concur, Andreas. Very nice. I'm interested in what Stylianos asked about also. __________________ John Locke SursumFilms.com

May 11th, 2003, 11:32 PM	#10
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Andreas, I too thought this was beautiful imagery. One way to have avoided the clipped whites in the water would have been to set the tripod lower and eliminate the ocean entirely. I know this seems like sacrilege, but the image would have still been strong graphically (the grass silhouetted against the sky rather than the ocean). This would have brought the sun itself into the frame, but assuming that it would have still been above the figure, you could have used an ND hard grad (.6 or .9) to knock down the sun a bit as well as create a vignette look to the top of the frame that would visually mirror the darkness at the bottom. This is all just conjecture, because to be honest I don't mind the blown out sun reflection either. One thing that might be worth looking at is going to a more severe matte like a 1:85 or more, i.e. increasing the size of the letterbox. It might be cleaner to eliminate the half-sun at the top of the frame. __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

May 12th, 2003, 03:43 PM	#13
Wayne Orr Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Northridge Ca Posts: 734	What's not to like? Its beautiful! As a point of information, you are probably not getting much effect out of the polarizer, other than knocking down the image a half stop or so. I just don't want people thinking they need to use a pola for sunset shots. I don't think the picture would be nearly so effective if the water was not burned out. Its those differences between light and dark that make pictures interesting. Nice job on the color correction. It would be interesting to show the original, uncorrected footage for comparison. __________________ Wayne If it was easy, they'd get a relative to do it.

May 10th, 2003, 07:55 PM	#2
Akos Szemenyei Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Saitama, Japan Posts: 111	The look and feel is really cool, but the whites from the sun looks to be clipped. I 've never shot the sunset with a DV camera so I don't really have any suggestions except maybe put on more ND filters. Otherwise keep up the good work.

May 10th, 2003, 08:37 PM	#3
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,801	Personally I love it. Nice work!

May 11th, 2003, 01:00 AM	#6
Brad Simmons Major Player Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Washington DC Posts: 304	Nice clip, I really like the look.

May 11th, 2003, 11:19 AM	#7
Andreas Fernbrant Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sweden - Helsingborg Posts: 283	Hi all, thank you for all the nice replys! Ok, I'll try to break it down easy. First off I used interlaced mode (no frames) because I can't do slowmotion with frames. Gain = +0 Whitebalance= Sunpreset (yeah I know;) but it works! LENS ND = ON Polfilter = ON UVFilter = ON I did contrast and colorcorrect (pulled up the reds on midtones) Akos, I agree with you but I don't know how to not get the sun clipped.. Perhaps you have some pointers? I believe that Lens ND + Filter ND would be too much... Thanks for the support! /Andy

May 11th, 2003, 11:32 AM	#8
John Threat Major Player Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New York Posts: 322	gorgeous. I like that the sun is burning on the image.

May 11th, 2003, 09:33 PM	#9
Akos Szemenyei Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Saitama, Japan Posts: 111	Sorry, I don't have any pointers at all, film has a lot more latitude so it's easier. Maybe someone else knows how to remedy the clipped sun situation on DV.

May 12th, 2003, 05:32 AM	#11
Andreas Fernbrant Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sweden - Helsingborg Posts: 283	Charles, Thank you for the kind words. I think the TV will matte out the sun for me (safeframe) I just did this really fast to see how it would look. Thank you for the pointers, I will try to put on a ND next time! /Andreas

May 12th, 2003, 03:15 PM	#12
Dean Sensui Inner Circle Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 2,054	Nice... and I don't even see the wires! :-) Nice saturated colors. Dean Sensui Base Two Productions

May 12th, 2003, 06:29 PM	#14
Andreas Fernbrant Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Sweden - Helsingborg Posts: 283	Wayne, My thoughts where to use the pol to get more detail in the clouds. More diffrence might be a more correct term when I think of it. But actually I just let it stay on because I used it in the shot before. www.fernbrant.com/andreas/dvinfo.html (but the site is down right now. I hope for it to be up soon. Host problems) There you can find a "before" picture and a picture that takes me to a new problem. I get a kind of aura around or on one side of some objects some times. The aura is most often white. I don't quite know how to minimize or get rid of this unwanted effect. What pointers do you guys have for me there? Also, I think the resolution is to low for my tv.. The picture is better then analog video but still not super high resolution. I know I get a resolution knockoff when I use widescreen and frame mode.. I use both:( Any pointers there to even it out? I can't add resolution but perhaps I can use some filter to get it better? Post production perhaps?

May 12th, 2003, 08:22 PM	#15
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	Rather than use the 16:9 mode, just shoot full frame and letterbox later. You could use software like Magic Bullet to alter the frame rate without the loss of resolution of Frame mode, assuming you can deal with the rendering time! __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com