On using reflectors

Marcus Marchesseault · July 7th, 2007, 10:27 PM

I'm starting to think a par HID would be ideal for my upcoming shoot. With the latitude I'm getting out of my combination of V1U, Brevis, and filters, I just need some daylight fill for some stuff I plan on shooting in the forest here. I might have to get by with reflectors, but I know how nice it is to have a daylight fixture for where reflectors don't work. A small kit with light and battery would be the only thing practical for taking into the woods.

Richard Andrewski · July 7th, 2007, 10:36 PM

I hear you loud and clear! Lots of people going out into the sticks and they need light. I think 70 to 150w is doable. Above that the battery requirements start to get ridiculous. But 13000 lumens of long throw light running off a battery should light a pretty good area.

Glenn Chan · July 8th, 2007, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Someone said that the sungun is only 3200K.

Sorry, I think I abused the terminology there. Anyways, 3200K lights can have the problem of not being powerful enough after you gel them.

Andris Krastins · July 8th, 2007, 01:03 AM

Thank you all for the helpful info,
I'll try to get my hands on that HID gun, thanks :)

Christian Schmitt · July 8th, 2007, 03:44 AM

So where can I get this portable lights?
Did I overlook the link?
Thanks!

Christopher Witz · July 8th, 2007, 11:32 AM

I buy mine at samsclub..... down to $65 now....

samsclub.com shows them by searching HID... at only $47!

I think I'll order a few more today as well!

Andris Krastins · July 8th, 2007, 11:51 AM

Well, since I can't find any shop selling thse lights in Europe (ordering from the US doubles the price), I'll try looking for something similar in our local shops, so question: Is there a way to tell the colour temperature of a light when testing it in shop?
What specs could indicate the temperature?

Thanks

Mark Sasahara · July 8th, 2007, 09:33 PM

Most 200W HMI's can be powered with 12V Anton/Bauer Batteries, or other types of camera batteries.

Reflectors can work pretty well on overcast days, unless it's really dark. As someone said, negative fill also works, using Duvetyne, or anything black to block/eat light.

You can get Beadboard reflectors, or make your own.

Buy, or rent larger frames. 4'x4', 6'x6', 8'x8', 12'x 12', 20'x20' are standard sizes. You can gets nets, silk, or grid cloth for diffusion, solids for neg fill, various materials are available for bounce too.

Mirrors can also work well, especially if you need to relay light from outside, into a building.

You'll need lots of grip gear to hold all this and probably a person at each reflector to aim them.

Smaller Honda 2Kw silent generators work pretty well and can wired parallel, so you have 4Kw of power. Just be sure that it's way the hell away from set and bring things to create a sound blimp. Be sure that the intake and exhaust aren't blocked.

Richard Andrewski · July 8th, 2007, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andris Krastins

Well, since I can't find any shop selling thse lights in Europe (ordering from the US doubles the price), I'll try looking for something similar in our local shops, so question: Is there a way to tell the colour temperature of a light when testing it in shop?
What specs could indicate the temperature?

Thanks

Not really. You could use a Gossen Color Meter 3F but they're really expensive at around $1400 unless you can pick one up cheaper off Ebay where you see them from time to time. Most of these HID type 35w bulbs will be in the range of 4200K to 6500K so you can pretty much guess it'll be in that area.

Christian Schmitt · July 9th, 2007, 01:59 AM

Sam`s Club says they are only available "in club" - I guess that means local outlets, no mailorder...?
Any other US distributers of that light that take online orders?
Thanks!

Richard Andrewski · July 9th, 2007, 05:35 AM

I did a quick check and couldn't find a similar model anywhere for a reasonable price.

What would really be cool would be a pistol grip version of this thing with a stand mount at the end of the grip. Now that would be a sungun.

Charles Papert · July 9th, 2007, 06:06 AM

For closeups on overcast days, you can often get a substantial "air bounce" with a 4x4 piece of beadboard held next to or under the subject's face--more than a few feet away the effect will disappear, hence the ability to do this only with closeups! The larger the bounce, the more the effect, but at this level you are unlikely to be working with griffs and ultrabounces on large frames. The nice thing about the under-the-face bounce for overcast day work is that it will restore some value to the underside of the face, reducing the top-heavy look of overcast skies, and because it is so soft it will look quite natural. And to echo what has already been said several times, neg fill is a powerful weapon also.

One issue with a small battery powered light is that it will more often than not produce a "lit" effect. Adding diffusion at the light will not improve things much--you would really want to use a larger frame of diffusion closer to the subject to help things out. What is good for the evening news is not good for narrative filmmaking (unless it's supposed to look like the news!)

Christopher Witz · July 9th, 2007, 06:14 AM

here's another company selling them besides sams...

http://boatandrvaccessories.com/SLH100P

looks like there made by vector

Richard Andrewski · July 9th, 2007, 07:01 AM

Even better price on that one too. $49 is a bargain.

Christian Schmitt · July 11th, 2007, 03:14 PM

But unfortunately out of stock...

July 7th, 2007, 10:36 PM	#17
Richard Andrewski Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Shenzhen, China Posts: 781	I hear you loud and clear! Lots of people going out into the sticks and they need light. I think 70 to 150w is doable. Above that the battery requirements start to get ridiculous. But 13000 lumens of long throw light running off a battery should light a pretty good area. __________________ Richard Andrewski - Cool Lights USA - RED #114 http://www.coollights.biz

July 8th, 2007, 01:03 AM	#19
Andris Krastins Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: Lielvārde, Latvia Posts: 326	Thank you all for the helpful info, I'll try to get my hands on that HID gun, thanks :) __________________ Our Fire Films - a free film project.

July 8th, 2007, 11:51 AM	#22
Andris Krastins Major Player Join Date: May 2007 Location: Lielvārde, Latvia Posts: 326	Well, since I can't find any shop selling thse lights in Europe (ordering from the US doubles the price), I'll try looking for something similar in our local shops, so question: Is there a way to tell the colour temperature of a light when testing it in shop? What specs could indicate the temperature? Thanks __________________ Our Fire Films - a free film project.

July 8th, 2007, 09:33 PM	#23
Mark Sasahara Major Player Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: NYC Posts: 649	Most 200W HMI's can be powered with 12V Anton/Bauer Batteries, or other types of camera batteries. Reflectors can work pretty well on overcast days, unless it's really dark. As someone said, negative fill also works, using Duvetyne, or anything black to block/eat light. You can get Beadboard reflectors, or make your own. Buy, or rent larger frames. 4'x4', 6'x6', 8'x8', 12'x 12', 20'x20' are standard sizes. You can gets nets, silk, or grid cloth for diffusion, solids for neg fill, various materials are available for bounce too. Mirrors can also work well, especially if you need to relay light from outside, into a building. You'll need lots of grip gear to hold all this and probably a person at each reflector to aim them. Smaller Honda 2Kw silent generators work pretty well and can wired parallel, so you have 4Kw of power. Just be sure that it's way the hell away from set and bring things to create a sound blimp. Be sure that the intake and exhaust aren't blocked. __________________ Mark Sasahara Director of Photography

July 9th, 2007, 05:35 AM	#26
Richard Andrewski Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Shenzhen, China Posts: 781	I did a quick check and couldn't find a similar model anywhere for a reasonable price. What would really be cool would be a pistol grip version of this thing with a stand mount at the end of the grip. Now that would be a sungun. __________________ Richard Andrewski - Cool Lights USA - RED #114 http://www.coollights.biz

July 7th, 2007, 10:27 PM	#16
Marcus Marchesseault Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Honolulu, HI Posts: 1,961	I'm starting to think a par HID would be ideal for my upcoming shoot. With the latitude I'm getting out of my combination of V1U, Brevis, and filters, I just need some daylight fill for some stuff I plan on shooting in the forest here. I might have to get by with reflectors, but I know how nice it is to have a daylight fixture for where reflectors don't work. A small kit with light and battery would be the only thing practical for taking into the woods.

July 8th, 2007, 03:44 AM	#20
Christian Schmitt Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 59	So where can I get this portable lights? Did I overlook the link? Thanks!

July 8th, 2007, 11:32 AM	#21
Christopher Witz Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 591	I buy mine at samsclub..... down to $65 now.... samsclub.com shows them by searching HID... at only $47! I think I'll order a few more today as well!

July 9th, 2007, 01:59 AM	#25
Christian Schmitt Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 59	Sam`s Club says they are only available "in club" - I guess that means local outlets, no mailorder...? Any other US distributers of that light that take online orders? Thanks!

July 9th, 2007, 06:06 AM	#27
Charles Papert Wrangler Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 6,810	For closeups on overcast days, you can often get a substantial "air bounce" with a 4x4 piece of beadboard held next to or under the subject's face--more than a few feet away the effect will disappear, hence the ability to do this only with closeups! The larger the bounce, the more the effect, but at this level you are unlikely to be working with griffs and ultrabounces on large frames. The nice thing about the under-the-face bounce for overcast day work is that it will restore some value to the underside of the face, reducing the top-heavy look of overcast skies, and because it is so soft it will look quite natural. And to echo what has already been said several times, neg fill is a powerful weapon also. One issue with a small battery powered light is that it will more often than not produce a "lit" effect. Adding diffusion at the light will not improve things much--you would really want to use a larger frame of diffusion closer to the subject to help things out. What is good for the evening news is not good for narrative filmmaking (unless it's supposed to look like the news!) __________________ Charles Papert www.charlespapert.com

July 9th, 2007, 06:14 AM	#28
Christopher Witz Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 591	here's another company selling them besides sams... http://boatandrvaccessories.com/SLH100P looks like there made by vector

July 9th, 2007, 07:01 AM	#29
Richard Andrewski Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Shenzhen, China Posts: 781	Even better price on that one too. $49 is a bargain. __________________ Richard Andrewski - Cool Lights USA - RED #114 http://www.coollights.biz

July 11th, 2007, 03:14 PM	#30
Christian Schmitt Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Germany Posts: 59	But unfortunately out of stock...