Making a brightly lit gym dark at DVinfo.net

Evan Shaw · July 2nd, 2007, 04:55 PM

Ok, so here's my problem. I have a commercial shoot next week for a football team. The theme of the commercial is something similar to the under-armour commercials that are everywhere these days. The team is coming out of a blowup tunnel getting psyched up for the game. Now in my mind this obviously needs to be lit fairly darkly with a lot of shadows crossing their faces, etc. Only problem is the lights in the gym (they play in a dome) "wont turn off". At least thats what I was told. Any ideas on how to get the effect I'm looking for with those giant flourescents on? I have a feeling its going to get interesting...

Emre Safak · July 2nd, 2007, 05:50 PM

You could throw even more light on them, then reduce the exposure. That way you can make the environment look dark while lighting the team ...

Bob Willis · July 2nd, 2007, 06:01 PM

I'm confused. You said a football team that plays in a dome (stadium?). Then you mention a gym. Not sure what you are trying to light?

I'm sure the lights will turn off. You just need to talk to the right facility person. It does take quite a while for stadium lights to come back to full output once you turn them off.

Evan Shaw · July 2nd, 2007, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Willis

I'm confused. You said a football team that plays in a dome (stadium?). Then you mention a gym. Not sure what you are trying to light?

I'm sure the lights will turn off. You just need to talk to the right facility person. It does take quite a while for stadium lights to come back to full output once you turn them off.

Its a dome, but the basketball team plays in there as well during the off season so I just interchanged the words. And I'm sure the lights would turn off, but apparently its not an option for some political reason, who knows...

Justin Deming · July 2nd, 2007, 08:51 PM

Just a note, you said "Any ideas on how to get the effect I'm looking for with those giant flourescents on?"

Actuay in a Gymn, or large dome, they are probbably not using flourescent's, it is probbably HMI's, or mercury vapor lights you will be dealing with. It doesn't matter exactly what lights they are using as much as what color of light they are putting out, as any lighting you do will need to match it as much as possible.

Emre had the right idea, you will need to carefuly throw even more light on them in the right spots, and reduce your exposure so the areas that are being lit by the lights in the dome look dark in comparison.

Either that or create a structure, and cover everything in black fabric to block out the light, but I doubt you will want to go that route.

Evan Shaw · July 2nd, 2007, 08:53 PM

Yeah, filling them with more light is better than anything I've come up with. I'll probably end up doing that. I'll let you know how it turns out.

Thanks guys.

Bob Willis · July 2nd, 2007, 09:30 PM

Well, if we leave the "political" problems aside and go with the limitations you have given, this how I would approach this problem:

Set up a 20X20 black overhead to knock out the overhead lighting.
Drape two 12X12 blacks as a negative fill along one side of the tunnel exit.
Place a strong backlight blasting through the tunnel.
Now you can key from the side or 3/4 front. You might not need any additional lights if you want it more dramatic.

You will have to gel your lights to match the available lighting. At least close enough to get a decent white balance.

It will take a decent size crew and grip truck to set this up.
Or you could get the lights turned off.

Bob Willis · July 2nd, 2007, 09:33 PM

You will never be able to overpower stadium style lighting unless this is a dark high school gym. Even then you would need large HMI lighting that would be very expensive.

You could always shoot outside on a field at sunrise or sunset.

Cole McDonald · July 2nd, 2007, 10:15 PM

Find out when they turn the lights on, get permission to shoot then, shoot the background plate, shoot the team green screen ? not...ok...In post, mask the team out and crank the contrast on them while dropping the brightness on the background. Then add some 80's new wave video light slashes across their eyes...

Or add light to raise the exposure on their faces with the patterns and shapes you want on them, then stop down to push the background dark...wait...did someone suggest this already? DOH!

Don Donatello · July 2nd, 2007, 11:22 PM

what kind of lighting budget do you have ?

not seeing any story boards or seeing the location ...
give me 2 10 ton trucks , 3 18k HMI's, 4 6k HMI pars and a couple of 4-7k xenotechs and some smaller lights and i know we can get you within reach of that look ...

Jim Andrada · July 3rd, 2007, 03:54 PM

Could you shoot IN the tunnel, just before they exit?

Evan Shaw · July 3rd, 2007, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Andrada

Could you shoot IN the tunnel, just before they exit?

Thats what I'm probably going to end up doing as well...The lighting budget is pretty much nil, so I'll have to make due with what I've got. It would be very nice to get a couple 10 Ton grip trucks... or even better yet, just turn off the stupid lights... oh well... thanks for the help guys, I'll let you know how it turns out.

Evan Shaw · July 4th, 2007, 12:23 AM

What about this? The piece can be fairly stylized, and I know that as long as the players stay in the tunnel they'll be relatively shielded from the overhead lights. How cheesy/bad would it look if I added a matte in post with some soft edges. If I shot it right, tight, I think this would get rid of the excess light on the edges and perhaps make it look like its supposed to be framed as such. Any thoughts suggestions? Again, thanks for the help. I've finally broken into the business with a real job after college and this is one of my first projects with the new gig. Since I'm the new guy I'm a little anxious about getting what I want. Thanks.

Evan

Mark Sasahara · July 8th, 2007, 09:47 PM

Why not go to a different location? Somewhere that will be large enough and more accommodating? Football field at night?

July 2nd, 2007, 04:55 PM	#1
Evan Shaw New Boot Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 19	Making a brightly lit gym dark Ok, so here's my problem. I have a commercial shoot next week for a football team. The theme of the commercial is something similar to the under-armour commercials that are everywhere these days. The team is coming out of a blowup tunnel getting psyched up for the game. Now in my mind this obviously needs to be lit fairly darkly with a lot of shadows crossing their faces, etc. Only problem is the lights in the gym (they play in a dome) "wont turn off". At least thats what I was told. Any ideas on how to get the effect I'm looking for with those giant flourescents on? I have a feeling its going to get interesting...

July 2nd, 2007, 10:15 PM	#9
Cole McDonald Trustee Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Sauk Rapids, MN, USA Posts: 1,675	Find out when they turn the lights on, get permission to shoot then, shoot the background plate, shoot the team green screen ? not...ok...In post, mask the team out and crank the contrast on them while dropping the brightness on the background. Then add some 80's new wave video light slashes across their eyes... Or add light to raise the exposure on their faces with the patterns and shapes you want on them, then stop down to push the background dark...wait...did someone suggest this already? DOH! __________________ Web Youtube Facebook

July 8th, 2007, 09:47 PM	#14
Mark Sasahara Major Player Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: NYC Posts: 649	Why not go to a different location? Somewhere that will be large enough and more accommodating? Football field at night? __________________ Mark Sasahara Director of Photography

July 2nd, 2007, 05:50 PM	#2
Emre Safak Trustee Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Brookline, MA Posts: 1,447	You could throw even more light on them, then reduce the exposure. That way you can make the environment look dark while lighting the team ...

July 2nd, 2007, 06:01 PM	#3
Bob Willis Major Player Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico Posts: 292	I'm confused. You said a football team that plays in a dome (stadium?). Then you mention a gym. Not sure what you are trying to light? I'm sure the lights will turn off. You just need to talk to the right facility person. It does take quite a while for stadium lights to come back to full output once you turn them off.

July 2nd, 2007, 08:51 PM	#5
Justin Deming Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Minneapolis, MA Posts: 84	Just a note, you said "Any ideas on how to get the effect I'm looking for with those giant flourescents on?" Actuay in a Gymn, or large dome, they are probbably not using flourescent's, it is probbably HMI's, or mercury vapor lights you will be dealing with. It doesn't matter exactly what lights they are using as much as what color of light they are putting out, as any lighting you do will need to match it as much as possible. Emre had the right idea, you will need to carefuly throw even more light on them in the right spots, and reduce your exposure so the areas that are being lit by the lights in the dome look dark in comparison. Either that or create a structure, and cover everything in black fabric to block out the light, but I doubt you will want to go that route.

July 2nd, 2007, 08:53 PM	#6
Evan Shaw New Boot Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 19	Yeah, filling them with more light is better than anything I've come up with. I'll probably end up doing that. I'll let you know how it turns out. Thanks guys.

July 2nd, 2007, 09:30 PM	#7
Bob Willis Major Player Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico Posts: 292	Well, if we leave the "political" problems aside and go with the limitations you have given, this how I would approach this problem: Set up a 20X20 black overhead to knock out the overhead lighting. Drape two 12X12 blacks as a negative fill along one side of the tunnel exit. Place a strong backlight blasting through the tunnel. Now you can key from the side or 3/4 front. You might not need any additional lights if you want it more dramatic. You will have to gel your lights to match the available lighting. At least close enough to get a decent white balance. It will take a decent size crew and grip truck to set this up. Or you could get the lights turned off.

July 2nd, 2007, 09:33 PM	#8
Bob Willis Major Player Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico Posts: 292	You will never be able to overpower stadium style lighting unless this is a dark high school gym. Even then you would need large HMI lighting that would be very expensive. You could always shoot outside on a field at sunrise or sunset.

July 2nd, 2007, 11:22 PM	#10
Don Donatello Hawaiian Shirt Mogul Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: northern cailfornia Posts: 1,261	what kind of lighting budget do you have ? not seeing any story boards or seeing the location ... give me 2 10 ton trucks , 3 18k HMI's, 4 6k HMI pars and a couple of 4-7k xenotechs and some smaller lights and i know we can get you within reach of that look ...

July 3rd, 2007, 03:54 PM	#11
Jim Andrada Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 2,211	Could you shoot IN the tunnel, just before they exit?

July 4th, 2007, 12:23 AM	#13
Evan Shaw New Boot Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 19	What about this? The piece can be fairly stylized, and I know that as long as the players stay in the tunnel they'll be relatively shielded from the overhead lights. How cheesy/bad would it look if I added a matte in post with some soft edges. If I shot it right, tight, I think this would get rid of the excess light on the edges and perhaps make it look like its supposed to be framed as such. Any thoughts suggestions? Again, thanks for the help. I've finally broken into the business with a real job after college and this is one of my first projects with the new gig. Since I'm the new guy I'm a little anxious about getting what I want. Thanks. Evan