lighting white screen and CFL's at DVinfo.net

Jaser Stockert · February 15th, 2010, 10:00 AM

will be shooting subject in front of a white screen indoors during daylight. no incandescants, just natural daylight in the living room area. going to be using cfl's to light the background and subject. looking at CFL's online, i see there are 5000K, 6400K bulbs for $3.00 and 5500K for $7.00. Budget is tight so I'm wondering if the 5000K or 6400K will balance fine with daylight or should I spend more for the 5500K to match daylight? I'm looking to purchase 24 CFL's w/ matching temps. thanks.

Paul Hudson · February 15th, 2010, 10:40 AM

Some may argue but an extra dollar to get properly balanced lamps is well worth the price.

Paul Hudson
Lizardlandvideo.com
Phoenix video production

Paul R Johnson · February 15th, 2010, 04:41 PM

I'm probably just a bit sensitive and this is turning into my pet subject of the week - but you have daylight as your subject lighting and are planning on using ....... cfl lighting? 24 lamps I'm assuming probably 50W ones? In terms of overall brightness, this is around 2.4K of conventional lighting - but only if you put reflectors on the cfls - assuming they are the usual folded/spiral tube versions. Forward light output is pretty feeble, so the reflector is essential - mirror finish is pretty efficient, white isn't. You've also got 24 sockets, lots of cabling, and a fair bit of weight. Assuming you buy the $3 ones, I'd estimate another $3 for the sockets. Even without your time, you are now looking at a sizeable investment for a home brew system. Personally, I'd go for the higher colour temp versions to more closely match the daylight - but as that will change depending on the sky conditions, even that is tricky. It could be cheaper to buy the cheap lamps and then buy enough CT to cover the windows!

How much will the complete thing cost? Me - I'd just buy a few redheads, stick the diffuser on them and wash the screen with those. So much less trouble than what you propose, and perhaps even cheaper!

I'm not even going to suggest that the horrible colour rendition of the cfls and the unpredictable beam quality from the units you intend knocking up might well leave you deeply unhappy.

I've no problem at all with fluorescent tubes - in proper fittings, with well designed light properties and decent photometrics to back them up, but a pile of domestic lamps in an untested housing just seem so unlikely to produce quality light. I'd strongly advise you to take a single cfl, and point it at a screen and look at it with the video camera which will show you the beam evenness much better than the naked eye. Then you can see how much of the output is wasted going in the wrong direction and maybe try ways to contain and reflect it. Please try this first - because what you don't want are multiple gentle shadows, and that's so easy with random lamp placement.

I've just noticed recently that for some really weird reason everyone is getting excited by using CFLs for video - I really expected white LEDs to be the craze for this year.

Paul Hudson · February 15th, 2010, 06:03 PM

A good point. View the white screen on my website. It was all lighted by 5k's and 4 bank 4 foot Kino Flo's

Paul Hudson
Lizardlandvideo.com
Phoenix Video Production

Jaser Stockert · February 15th, 2010, 06:34 PM

Thank you for the reply gentleman. If there is an LED solution that will cost similar to CFL's, please point me in that direction. Also, I can block off light coming into windows since there are thick wood shutters that I can completely close. This is really what I'm trying to accomplish, thus the CFL's inserted into clamp lights which is why I'm asking about color temperature 5000K etc:

Michael Liebergot · February 15th, 2010, 06:37 PM

I agree about using Kno Flos or wide soft even light for green screen or white screen work.

We have had very good luck using 4 bank FloLights, bank switchable (non dimming). Easy to setup and nice even lighting makes background work easy.

Jaser Stockert · February 16th, 2010, 06:48 PM

i just got access to 2-4 softboxes sized 24x24 or 32x32 ranging from 200w-300w. will this help in lighting of the white screen? i also have $500 to spend. anything close to the kino's at that price? or any suggestions to LED's mentioned? thanks again.

Jaser Stockert · February 18th, 2010, 12:10 PM

Hi Paul,

Just checked the video. Looks great! Can you tell me what your set up/wattage was(LED or fluorescents)? Do you think two 4 bank 4ft lights will be enough for an infinite white background? How about softboxes or umbrellas if it'll work. thanks!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Hudson

A good point. View the white screen on my website. It was all lighted by 5k's and 4 bank 4 foot Kino Flo's

Paul Hudson
Lizardlandvideo.com
Phoenix Video Production

Jaser Stockert · March 19th, 2010, 07:48 PM

will 2 of these cool lights 24x24 softboxes spread and be strong enough to light up an infinite white background? they're 800w equivalent.

CL-SFT1 Softbox Kit 5600K (With Stand) - Cool Lights USA

they're a couple hundred cheaper than their 4 bank flo lights. and coming from a reputable company and great customer service from Richard.

Jaser Stockert · March 25th, 2010, 02:04 PM

anyone? would like to make purchase by next week. thanks.

Mike Watson · March 25th, 2010, 02:31 PM

Personally, I'd rather see you get the longer lights, and orient them vertically, for a more even light on the backdrop. The CL-255's might work, the 455's would certainly work better.

I think you will be displeased with 50 CFLs and 50 home depot scoops, but apparently (via the video), with enough positioning and post-processing, you can get the intended effect.

If you do this correctly, you can set up two (or three - a 255 up top, if you have a C-stand) of the 455's in about ten minutes, set up the backdrop in 10 minutes, and do basically no post-processing - just have the "inifinity" look in-cam.

Your 24x24 (or 36x36) would be a tremendous key or fill, and a workable backlight.

February 15th, 2010, 10:00 AM	#1
Jaser Stockert Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: California Posts: 147	lighting white screen and CFL's will be shooting subject in front of a white screen indoors during daylight. no incandescants, just natural daylight in the living room area. going to be using cfl's to light the background and subject. looking at CFL's online, i see there are 5000K, 6400K bulbs for $3.00 and 5500K for $7.00. Budget is tight so I'm wondering if the 5000K or 6400K will balance fine with daylight or should I spend more for the 5500K to match daylight? I'm looking to purchase 24 CFL's w/ matching temps. thanks.

February 15th, 2010, 06:34 PM	#5
Jaser Stockert Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: California Posts: 147	Thank you for the reply gentleman. If there is an LED solution that will cost similar to CFL's, please point me in that direction. Also, I can block off light coming into windows since there are thick wood shutters that I can completely close. This is really what I'm trying to accomplish, thus the CFL's inserted into clamp lights which is why I'm asking about color temperature 5000K etc: Lighting Infinite White on Vimeo

February 15th, 2010, 06:37 PM	#6
Michael Liebergot Trustee Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Maryland Posts: 1,505	I agree about using Kno Flos or wide soft even light for green screen or white screen work. We have had very good luck using 4 bank FloLights, bank switchable (non dimming). Easy to setup and nice even lighting makes background work easy. __________________ Michael www.lvpvideo.com

February 15th, 2010, 10:40 AM	#2
Paul Hudson Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 37	Some may argue but an extra dollar to get properly balanced lamps is well worth the price. Paul Hudson Lizardlandvideo.com Phoenix video production

February 15th, 2010, 04:41 PM	#3
Paul R Johnson Inner Circle Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Lowestoft - UK Posts: 4,045	I'm probably just a bit sensitive and this is turning into my pet subject of the week - but you have daylight as your subject lighting and are planning on using ....... cfl lighting? 24 lamps I'm assuming probably 50W ones? In terms of overall brightness, this is around 2.4K of conventional lighting - but only if you put reflectors on the cfls - assuming they are the usual folded/spiral tube versions. Forward light output is pretty feeble, so the reflector is essential - mirror finish is pretty efficient, white isn't. You've also got 24 sockets, lots of cabling, and a fair bit of weight. Assuming you buy the $3 ones, I'd estimate another $3 for the sockets. Even without your time, you are now looking at a sizeable investment for a home brew system. Personally, I'd go for the higher colour temp versions to more closely match the daylight - but as that will change depending on the sky conditions, even that is tricky. It could be cheaper to buy the cheap lamps and then buy enough CT to cover the windows! How much will the complete thing cost? Me - I'd just buy a few redheads, stick the diffuser on them and wash the screen with those. So much less trouble than what you propose, and perhaps even cheaper! I'm not even going to suggest that the horrible colour rendition of the cfls and the unpredictable beam quality from the units you intend knocking up might well leave you deeply unhappy. I've no problem at all with fluorescent tubes - in proper fittings, with well designed light properties and decent photometrics to back them up, but a pile of domestic lamps in an untested housing just seem so unlikely to produce quality light. I'd strongly advise you to take a single cfl, and point it at a screen and look at it with the video camera which will show you the beam evenness much better than the naked eye. Then you can see how much of the output is wasted going in the wrong direction and maybe try ways to contain and reflect it. Please try this first - because what you don't want are multiple gentle shadows, and that's so easy with random lamp placement. I've just noticed recently that for some really weird reason everyone is getting excited by using CFLs for video - I really expected white LEDs to be the craze for this year.

February 15th, 2010, 06:03 PM	#4
Paul Hudson Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Phoenix, AZ Posts: 37	A good point. View the white screen on my website. It was all lighted by 5k's and 4 bank 4 foot Kino Flo's Paul Hudson Lizardlandvideo.com Phoenix Video Production

February 16th, 2010, 06:48 PM	#7
Jaser Stockert Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: California Posts: 147	i just got access to 2-4 softboxes sized 24x24 or 32x32 ranging from 200w-300w. will this help in lighting of the white screen? i also have $500 to spend. anything close to the kino's at that price? or any suggestions to LED's mentioned? thanks again.

March 19th, 2010, 07:48 PM	#9
Jaser Stockert Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: California Posts: 147	will 2 of these cool lights 24x24 softboxes spread and be strong enough to light up an infinite white background? they're 800w equivalent. CL-SFT1 Softbox Kit 5600K (With Stand) - Cool Lights USA they're a couple hundred cheaper than their 4 bank flo lights. and coming from a reputable company and great customer service from Richard.

March 25th, 2010, 02:04 PM	#10
Jaser Stockert Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: California Posts: 147	anyone? would like to make purchase by next week. thanks.

March 25th, 2010, 02:31 PM	#11
Mike Watson Trustee Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 1,082	Personally, I'd rather see you get the longer lights, and orient them vertically, for a more even light on the backdrop. The CL-255's might work, the 455's would certainly work better. I think you will be displeased with 50 CFLs and 50 home depot scoops, but apparently (via the video), with enough positioning and post-processing, you can get the intended effect. If you do this correctly, you can set up two (or three - a 255 up top, if you have a C-stand) of the 455's in about ten minutes, set up the backdrop in 10 minutes, and do basically no post-processing - just have the "inifinity" look in-cam. Your 24x24 (or 36x36) would be a tremendous key or fill, and a workable backlight.