Coollights questions? at DVinfo.net

Stephen Eastwood · June 17th, 2008, 10:50 PM

Hello, I had a few questions about the coolights products and I know richard is on this forum answering, as well as many other users of the lights, so I figured it would be a great place to ask.

Anyway, I am starting to stock up a second production facility, so I am again beginning a new search for various equipment, as this is a secondary facility and will likely be more for fun and small shorts rather than full production commercials I am doing mainly now, I am attempting to keep it stocked with what I need to produce those with full gear so to minimize rental expenses and time delays. I have so far stocked on dolly and tracks, steadicams and vests, HD, HDV, XD cams, cranes, and most audio, post and other grip gear. Now I am turning to the actual lighting, which is where this all comes in. I have been long follower of your equipment, and am again looking at it for versatility and price to performance.

With that, I ask about a few items. First, the HMI's how well do the 3000 degree bulbs mix with the tungsten lighting? and are they the actual output as the daylight bulbs or are they different? Are there both 5400 and 3000 watt bulbs available for the 575 as well? What size are the fresnels (lens) of the 175 and 575? How long before you have them in stock? Of the tungsten units What size are the fresnels (lens) on the 650 and 1000 watt? and can the 1000watt use 650 and even 300watt bulbs, if not which can they use? Do you have stats on any of the HMI or tungsten at say full spot or full flood at a given amount of feet? Ideally that would be fstop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation.

Of the Florescent, Do you have any stats on the output, again, ideally that would be f-stop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation. So any number at given feet would be good. I am generally attempting to do two things, determine if the 2 light or 4 light model is better for my needs, and then determine if the studio is more effectively powerful than the portable model to make a final determination. And how well do the daylight and tungsten bulbs mix with the HMI daylight and tungsten bulbs, I am not a stickler for exact, so long as they are close enough to not look off its good for me. And what is the expected time for the florescent's (non dimming, 2 and 4 light banks, portable and studio) to be back in stock and ready for shipping?

Sorry I have so many questions, my normal work we do commercials, and I see so much waste and overage that is just totally useless, and makes the productions go so slow, bring a truck of gear that is too big and too much power for what we can use, mainly because , they don't know and they don't care its not there money, and I just want to be more on with what will actually be used in my own productions and what will be right to have and pack and carry, rather then just bring more and use whatever.

Thank you for any help.

Richard Andrewski · June 18th, 2008, 09:39 AM

I'll do my best. All your questions start with a hyphen and my answer comes just under it.

- First, the HMI's how well do the 3000 degree bulbs mix with the tungsten lighting?

By my tests just fine. I haven't noticed any green issues.

- and are they the actual output as the daylight bulbs or are they different?

Output is the same in terms of lumens.

- Are there both 5400 and 3000 watt bulbs available for the 575 as well?

No, HMI bulbs aren't available in the lower color temperature. I think there just hasn't been the demand there but they probably could produce it if they wanted to.

- What size are the fresnels (lens) of the 175 and 575?

The 150w CDM (same physical size as an Arri 650) has a 4 1/8" size lens and the 575w (same physical size as an Arri 575w HMI or 1000w tungsten) is 5".

- How long before you have them in stock?

The 150w CDMs should be in by end of June. The 575w HMI is still under beta test and won't be released any time soon or until I am comfortable with the results.

- Of the tungsten units What size are the fresnels (lens) on the 650 and 1000 watt?

4 1/8" for 650 and 5" for 1000, just like on the 150 CDM and 575 HMI.

- and can the 1000watt use 650 and even 300watt bulbs, if not which can they use?

You can only use a G22 base bulb in the 1000w unit. Anything 1000w or under you can find with a G22 base would work in there.

- Do you have stats on any of the HMI or tungsten at say full spot or full flood at a given amount of feet? Ideally that would be fstop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation.

I got ambitious today and took the following readings -- all in foot candles and ISO 100 on a Sekonic L758 Cine light meter.

CL-MF0150 150w CDM fresnel WIDE BEAM

3 foot 492
6 foot 122
9 foot 59

CL-MF0150 150w CDM fresnel NARROW BEAM

3 foot 492
6 foot 241
9 foot 168

CL-TF0650 650w Tungsten Fresnel WIDE BEAM

3 foot 675
6 foot 240
9 foot 118

CL-TF0650 650w Tungsten Fresnel NARROW BEAM

3 foot 2775
6 foot 472
9 foot 247

CL-MF0575 575w HMI Fresnel WIDE BEAM

3 foot 2690
6 foot 673
9 foot 362

CL-MF0575 575w HMI Fresnel NARROW BEAM

3 foot 5200
6 foot 2997
9 foot 942

Just for comparison sake, I took some readings on our new 600 LED panel. Consider this to be "hardwired" in spot mode since we used a 20 degree beam angle LED on the panel.

3 foot 489
6 foot 118
9 foot 44

The readings are very comparable to the MF0150. I think we can account for this by the fact that most all of the energy in an LED is directed out at whatever beam angle it is manufactured for. We used a 20 degree which should be very efficient at focusing light forward. In other words, while the output of LEDs seems weak in terms of lumens the usable light is very strong and efficient in terms of foot candles or lux because of the directed energy toward the subject whereas the tungsten or metal halide (or fluorescent for that matter) light has a 360 degree pattern around the bulb so some light is wasted even with a good reflector. The drawback of course is you don't have a focusing mechanism (nor can you make one) for this kind of light so you get what you get based on the beam angle of LEDs you choose. A wider beam would obviously fall off faster like a flo...

- Of the Florescent, Do you have any stats on the output, again, ideally that would be f-stop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation. So any number at given feet would be good.

CL-255 2x55watt fluorescent full intensity

3 foot 236
6 foot 77
9 foot 39

- And how well do the daylight and tungsten bulbs mix with the HMI daylight and tungsten bulbs, I am not a stickler for exact, so long as they are close enough to not look off its good for me.

We're pretty close on our color temperatures. I think you'll find it works very well mixing with tungsten or with HMIs.

- And what is the expected time for the florescent's (non dimming, 2 and 4 light banks, portable and studio) to be back in stock and ready for shipping?

Studio models should be mostly back in stock in early July. We still have a few CL-255P but the rest of the portables won't be back in stock until the fall sometime.

Hope this helps.

Stephen Eastwood · June 18th, 2008, 12:07 PM

Thank you for such a detailed answer. And I am adding a quick chart for footcandle to f-stop at a given iso/shutter speed for reference. I will go with the 100iso, 320 and 400 which I find are very close to a 0 gain setting for the following hd cameras, and I am sure many others as well. Hope this is helpful to some.

little canon hd cams hv20, hv30, hg10, hf10,hf100= 100iso
larger canon hd cameras xha1, gha1, xlh1=320iso
sony ex in 1080 mode=400iso

320 iso at 1/48th 24fps. 3 chip canon hd.
footcandle = f-stop
8 === 1.4
16 === 2.0
32 === 2.8
64 === 4.0
125 === 5.6
250 === 8.0
500 === 11.0

100iso at 1/48th 24fps 1 chip canon hd
footcandle = f-stop
40 === 1.4
80 === 2.0
160 === 2.8
320 === 4.0
640 === 5.6
1280 === 8.0

400iso at 1/48th 24fps sony ex1
footcandle = f-stop
6.4 === 1.4
13 === 2.0
25 === 2.8
50 === 4.0
100 === 5.6
200 === 8.0

Again thanks for the detailed response and taking the time to measure output so I have a great way to know just how much light I want and get from each.

Stephen Eastwood · June 18th, 2008, 02:18 PM

So I found these for the HMI and tungsten, I am thinking they all fit. I can only find a 575 for the HMI do they make any smaller that woudl work or is it only 575 for that?

750 G22 3200degree
http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGR/item.html

500 G22 3200degree
http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGN/item.html

1000 G22 3200degree
http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGT/item.html

575 HMI

http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt...FSEL/item.html

Richard Andrewski · June 18th, 2008, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Eastwood

So I found these for the HMI and tungsten, I am thinking they all fit. I can only find a 575 for the HMI do they make any smaller that woudl work or is it only 575 for that?

750 G22 3200degree
http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGR/item.html

500 G22 3200degree
http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGN/item.html

1000 G22 3200degree
http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGT/item.html

575 HMI

http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt...FSEL/item.html

I can't get to that site right now where I'm at but I'll be back in the states in a couple of days. It sounds like it should work though as long as its G22. On the 575w, thats also a G22 and an Osram Hot restrike type like the HMI 575 / SE. Of course, Philips and GE make a compatible as does Ushio and quite a few others. I've noticed that www.bulbman.com has some pretty good prices on some of these items too.

Dave Dodds · June 18th, 2008, 10:03 PM

Did I read that right? A CoolLights LED light? When will this be available?

~~Dave

Richard Andrewski · June 19th, 2008, 12:34 AM

We are working on an LED panel right now. Fixture size will be about 10" x 10". 600 LEDs. Powered from a 12v DC input to make it easy to work with a wall transformer or a battery.

I have a couple of other panels (one higher intensity and a smaller one too) I am going to add to but the 600 LED is out front. Its tough to say when it might happen as I'm putting it through extensive testing right now. I hope sometime in the fall along with a 70w metal halide CDM fresnel too. We might even fit in a 250w CDM fresnel too.

June 17th, 2008, 10:50 PM	#1
Stephen Eastwood Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Great Neck, NY Posts: 291	Coollights questions? Hello, I had a few questions about the coolights products and I know richard is on this forum answering, as well as many other users of the lights, so I figured it would be a great place to ask. Anyway, I am starting to stock up a second production facility, so I am again beginning a new search for various equipment, as this is a secondary facility and will likely be more for fun and small shorts rather than full production commercials I am doing mainly now, I am attempting to keep it stocked with what I need to produce those with full gear so to minimize rental expenses and time delays. I have so far stocked on dolly and tracks, steadicams and vests, HD, HDV, XD cams, cranes, and most audio, post and other grip gear. Now I am turning to the actual lighting, which is where this all comes in. I have been long follower of your equipment, and am again looking at it for versatility and price to performance. With that, I ask about a few items. First, the HMI's how well do the 3000 degree bulbs mix with the tungsten lighting? and are they the actual output as the daylight bulbs or are they different? Are there both 5400 and 3000 watt bulbs available for the 575 as well? What size are the fresnels (lens) of the 175 and 575? How long before you have them in stock? Of the tungsten units What size are the fresnels (lens) on the 650 and 1000 watt? and can the 1000watt use 650 and even 300watt bulbs, if not which can they use? Do you have stats on any of the HMI or tungsten at say full spot or full flood at a given amount of feet? Ideally that would be fstop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation. Of the Florescent, Do you have any stats on the output, again, ideally that would be f-stop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation. So any number at given feet would be good. I am generally attempting to do two things, determine if the 2 light or 4 light model is better for my needs, and then determine if the studio is more effectively powerful than the portable model to make a final determination. And how well do the daylight and tungsten bulbs mix with the HMI daylight and tungsten bulbs, I am not a stickler for exact, so long as they are close enough to not look off its good for me. And what is the expected time for the florescent's (non dimming, 2 and 4 light banks, portable and studio) to be back in stock and ready for shipping? Sorry I have so many questions, my normal work we do commercials, and I see so much waste and overage that is just totally useless, and makes the productions go so slow, bring a truck of gear that is too big and too much power for what we can use, mainly because , they don't know and they don't care its not there money, and I just want to be more on with what will actually be used in my own productions and what will be right to have and pack and carry, rather then just bring more and use whatever. Thank you for any help. __________________ Stephen Eastwood http://www.StephenEastwood.com

June 18th, 2008, 09:39 AM	#2
Richard Andrewski Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Shenzhen, China Posts: 781	I'll do my best. All your questions start with a hyphen and my answer comes just under it. - First, the HMI's how well do the 3000 degree bulbs mix with the tungsten lighting? By my tests just fine. I haven't noticed any green issues. - and are they the actual output as the daylight bulbs or are they different? Output is the same in terms of lumens. - Are there both 5400 and 3000 watt bulbs available for the 575 as well? No, HMI bulbs aren't available in the lower color temperature. I think there just hasn't been the demand there but they probably could produce it if they wanted to. - What size are the fresnels (lens) of the 175 and 575? The 150w CDM (same physical size as an Arri 650) has a 4 1/8" size lens and the 575w (same physical size as an Arri 575w HMI or 1000w tungsten) is 5". - How long before you have them in stock? The 150w CDMs should be in by end of June. The 575w HMI is still under beta test and won't be released any time soon or until I am comfortable with the results. - Of the tungsten units What size are the fresnels (lens) on the 650 and 1000 watt? 4 1/8" for 650 and 5" for 1000, just like on the 150 CDM and 575 HMI. - and can the 1000watt use 650 and even 300watt bulbs, if not which can they use? You can only use a G22 base bulb in the 1000w unit. Anything 1000w or under you can find with a G22 base would work in there. - Do you have stats on any of the HMI or tungsten at say full spot or full flood at a given amount of feet? Ideally that would be fstop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation. I got ambitious today and took the following readings -- all in foot candles and ISO 100 on a Sekonic L758 Cine light meter. CL-MF0150 150w CDM fresnel WIDE BEAM 3 foot 492 6 foot 122 9 foot 59 CL-MF0150 150w CDM fresnel NARROW BEAM 3 foot 492 6 foot 241 9 foot 168 CL-TF0650 650w Tungsten Fresnel WIDE BEAM 3 foot 675 6 foot 240 9 foot 118 CL-TF0650 650w Tungsten Fresnel NARROW BEAM 3 foot 2775 6 foot 472 9 foot 247 CL-MF0575 575w HMI Fresnel WIDE BEAM 3 foot 2690 6 foot 673 9 foot 362 CL-MF0575 575w HMI Fresnel NARROW BEAM 3 foot 5200 6 foot 2997 9 foot 942 Just for comparison sake, I took some readings on our new 600 LED panel. Consider this to be "hardwired" in spot mode since we used a 20 degree beam angle LED on the panel. 3 foot 489 6 foot 118 9 foot 44 The readings are very comparable to the MF0150. I think we can account for this by the fact that most all of the energy in an LED is directed out at whatever beam angle it is manufactured for. We used a 20 degree which should be very efficient at focusing light forward. In other words, while the output of LEDs seems weak in terms of lumens the usable light is very strong and efficient in terms of foot candles or lux because of the directed energy toward the subject whereas the tungsten or metal halide (or fluorescent for that matter) light has a 360 degree pattern around the bulb so some light is wasted even with a good reflector. The drawback of course is you don't have a focusing mechanism (nor can you make one) for this kind of light so you get what you get based on the beam angle of LEDs you choose. A wider beam would obviously fall off faster like a flo... - Of the Florescent, Do you have any stats on the output, again, ideally that would be f-stop at iso, at speed, but I can reverse figure foot-candles or lumens with some research again on the equation. So any number at given feet would be good. CL-255 2x55watt fluorescent full intensity 3 foot 236 6 foot 77 9 foot 39 - And how well do the daylight and tungsten bulbs mix with the HMI daylight and tungsten bulbs, I am not a stickler for exact, so long as they are close enough to not look off its good for me. We're pretty close on our color temperatures. I think you'll find it works very well mixing with tungsten or with HMIs. - And what is the expected time for the florescent's (non dimming, 2 and 4 light banks, portable and studio) to be back in stock and ready for shipping? Studio models should be mostly back in stock in early July. We still have a few CL-255P but the rest of the portables won't be back in stock until the fall sometime. Hope this helps. __________________ Richard Andrewski - Cool Lights USA - RED #114 http://www.coollights.biz Last edited by Richard Andrewski; June 18th, 2008 at 11:27 AM.

June 18th, 2008, 12:07 PM	#3
Stephen Eastwood Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Great Neck, NY Posts: 291	Thank you for such a detailed answer. And I am adding a quick chart for footcandle to f-stop at a given iso/shutter speed for reference. I will go with the 100iso, 320 and 400 which I find are very close to a 0 gain setting for the following hd cameras, and I am sure many others as well. Hope this is helpful to some. little canon hd cams hv20, hv30, hg10, hf10,hf100= 100iso larger canon hd cameras xha1, gha1, xlh1=320iso sony ex in 1080 mode=400iso 320 iso at 1/48th 24fps. 3 chip canon hd. footcandle = f-stop 8 === 1.4 16 === 2.0 32 === 2.8 64 === 4.0 125 === 5.6 250 === 8.0 500 === 11.0 100iso at 1/48th 24fps 1 chip canon hd footcandle = f-stop 40 === 1.4 80 === 2.0 160 === 2.8 320 === 4.0 640 === 5.6 1280 === 8.0 400iso at 1/48th 24fps sony ex1 footcandle = f-stop 6.4 === 1.4 13 === 2.0 25 === 2.8 50 === 4.0 100 === 5.6 200 === 8.0 Again thanks for the detailed response and taking the time to measure output so I have a great way to know just how much light I want and get from each. __________________ Stephen Eastwood http://www.StephenEastwood.com

June 18th, 2008, 02:18 PM	#4
Stephen Eastwood Major Player Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Great Neck, NY Posts: 291	So I found these for the HMI and tungsten, I am thinking they all fit. I can only find a 575 for the HMI do they make any smaller that woudl work or is it only 575 for that? 750 G22 3200degree http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGR/item.html 500 G22 3200degree http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGN/item.html 1000 G22 3200degree http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt.../EGT/item.html 575 HMI http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewIt...FSEL/item.html __________________ Stephen Eastwood http://www.StephenEastwood.com

June 19th, 2008, 12:34 AM	#7
Richard Andrewski Major Player Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Shenzhen, China Posts: 781	We are working on an LED panel right now. Fixture size will be about 10" x 10". 600 LEDs. Powered from a 12v DC input to make it easy to work with a wall transformer or a battery. I have a couple of other panels (one higher intensity and a smaller one too) I am going to add to but the 600 LED is out front. Its tough to say when it might happen as I'm putting it through extensive testing right now. I hope sometime in the fall along with a 70w metal halide CDM fresnel too. We might even fit in a 250w CDM fresnel too. __________________ Richard Andrewski - Cool Lights USA - RED #114 http://www.coollights.biz

June 18th, 2008, 10:03 PM	#6
Dave Dodds Major Player Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: New York Posts: 204	Did I read that right? A CoolLights LED light? When will this be available? ~~Dave