Kino Flow or Arri?

[Spencer Dickson]

Does anyone know of some good books to learn about different lighting techniques and/or some instructional dvds or internet resources? I can't wait to improve my video.

[Marco Leavitt]

Renting is good. Personally, I don't think you can go wrong buying a couple of 650 watt fresnels though. They won't do everything, and you'll still have to rent, but you'll use them on probably every shoot you ever have, so why not just get 'em and get it over with?

[Shaun Roemich]

Ross Lowell's "Matters of Light and Depth" is the de-facto standard tome for lighting.

http://www.lowel.com/book.html

[Christopher Witz]

for bang for buck.... par 64 cans are hard to beat.

http://www.fullcompass.com/product/286836.html

I have at least 10 of these and they work great for street scenes at night..... very light... focused 500w spot... cheap as a lap dance and take a beating and still work.

Also... I really don't think one could own enough lowel pro lights.... you can put a bunch of these little suckers in a bag and be ready for anything. They are so small that they don't need much of stand to sit on. Lowel also sells a daylight lens for them.

But... if you wanna impress the ladies.... a van full of Mole tweenies, solarspots, and zips and a rack of c-stands is like pull'n up wearing black cowboy boots in a 64 GTO with open headers. Moles will make any city street look like a hollywood budget set.... but they also might attract the permit cops.

[Spencer Dickson]

I will pick up a copy of Lowell's book asap.

As for Lowels...I hear nothing but negative things about them. Mostly that they break easily. Is there a difference in the actual light quality with the Lowels over the Arris? Or is it just that the Arris are way better built?

[Marco Leavitt]

Lowell is okay. Arri and Mole are on a whole other level though, and well worth the extra bucks. As far as breaking, yeah, Lowell products aren't as robust, but unless you abuse your gear you can certainly rely on them. It's decent enough stuff. I like Mole myself. Most small budget productions I've seen use Arri almost exclusively though. It has a reputation (not necessarily true) of being more compact and light than Mole.

[Seth Bloombaum]

If Lowel lights meet your needs they are fine for a single user owner/operator. They get low marks in multi-user environments because they are built very light. Rental companies hate them for this reason. However, many people use Lowels very successfully. They are engineered well.

The Pro is a very fine small fresnel-like light, about 300w. The Rifa is an excellent softbox, there's nothing quite like it on the market (Rifa 55 is the min. size I'd want). The Omni is about half the light an Arrilite is, small open face lights like that are usually used with reflectors or diffusion. It's OK. The Tota is a beast, hard to control, puts out a lot of light in a small package.

Arri is very popular in rental cos. because they are built well, perform well, and are generally accepted by renters. Arrilite is as good as a small open face light gets, likewise the Arri Fresnel 650 is a fine example of a small fresnel.

[Marco Leavitt]

I'll second the comment on the Rifa. If there's one Lowell product I wouldn't mind owning, that'd be it. As annoying as Totas are, they're cheap, and as mentioned throw tons of light for the price and size. They have limited use though -- in an umbrella, or bounced off the ceiling to raise ambient light. It's a good idea to keep a couple around, but don't try and make them do more than they're designed to do.

Hey Spencer, I was rereading your earlier post about wanting a "soft, creepy look," and you know many (most?) horror movies (and typical night scenes), are actually high contrast. There are no softbox-like practicals in the woods!

[Marco Leavitt]

One more thing, about renting. If you plan to shoot on weekends, that's when renting makes the most sense. You typically get a 1-day rental for a pickup Friday and a return early Monday. I know it seems like renting is just throwing money away, but at least you'll learn what you really need and don't. Buying just one piece of expensive gear that turns out to not be as useful as you thought it would can really mess up the budget.

[Spencer Dickson]

I see where you are coming from Marco...and that is why I want to find what I call a B&B kit. (bread and butter...not bed and breakfast). A kit that contains most of the absolutely requisite lights for most shooting situations.

Does anyone know if the actual quality of the light the Lowels give is lesser than the Arris, or is the difference only in build quality?

[Marco Leavitt]

Lighting design trumps build quality. Do Arri and Mole fresnels actually look better than Lowell? I kinda think so, but the big difference (as with everything) is how you use them. What would I consider a basic kit? It's already been mentioned in here. Two 650 watt fresnels, and two 1 K fixtures, either fresnel (big and heavy) or open faced (but must be focusable). Throw in lots of stands, gels, flags (especially flags), sandbags, etc. Remember you can lamp down the lights, so this same kit can convert into two 300 watt fixtures and two 500 watt fixtures, or something in between as needed. Personally, I prefer to buy stuff that will last a lifetime, so it's Arri or Mole for me. One word on the Lowell Pro -- as a sound person it has given me real problems lately. The one on the movie I'm currently wrapping on makes a steady tick, tick, tick sound as it heats up and cools down. Maybe this one has just been abused and if newer ones don't have that problem I apologize for making generalizations. Also, I don't like the scrims on the Omni. The round scrims for the Arri and Mole are just a lot easier to drop in and out of the front of the light. Little things like that can make a big difference on your stress level on a movie set.

[Spencer Dickson]

The cheap side of me is tempted by the Lowel kits...but the other side of me is still very interested in the Arri Softbank IV. If I do go with the Arris, what types of reflectors and other peripherals are going to be required? If you could list specific products that would be most fantastic.

[Spencer Dickson]

[QUOTE= you can lamp down the lights, so this same kit can convert into two 300 watt fixtures and two 500 watt fixtures, or something in between as needed.[/QUOTE]

So any Arri light will work in an Arri fixture as long as it is not exceeding the fixture's maximum wattage?

[Marco Leavitt]

"So any Arri light will work in an Arri fixture as long as it is not exceeding the fixture's maximum wattage?"

No. But you can buy different wattages for a given fixture, up to a point. I know more about Mole than Arri, as that's what I have, and you can only go down to 500 watts with the 1K Baby. One interesting light (my favorite light in fact) is the Mole midget. You can lamp that sucker all way down to 75 watts, or all the way up to 250 watts. Because the lens is so large (the same size as the 650s), you can change the intensity greatly by focusing in and out. I also like that it shares the same barn doors and scrims as my 650s.

But hey, I'm a sound guy! I don't want to come across like I'm an expert at lighting. It's an as needed kind of thing for me.

[Marco Leavitt]

You know, a softbox is a really big outlay. What about renting (that again) kinos for those days when you need them? You could buy the hardlights, minimizing your rental costs. Kinos are great. They don't heat up the place so much, and being way, way thinner are a lot easier to get in position. But man are they expensive. Also, I see most people shooting through large scrim fabrics when they want diffusion anyway. You could add some of those to your kit way more cheaply than buying a full-on softbox. Again, as mentioned, the Rifa is a great little low-cost softbox. It's a breeze to set up too, unlike pretty much anything else out there.