SDXC can you record longer than 4gb/12 mins? at DVinfo.net

Dave Morgan · October 29th, 2010, 01:01 AM

im going to be getting a sony a580 and am trying to find out if by using a SDXC card if you can record video longer than the normal using a SDHC card?

Daniel von Euw · October 29th, 2010, 04:39 AM

I have the same question about the 550D / T2i.

SDXC cards with exFAT filesystem should be able to do this.

regards
Daniel

Kin Lau · October 29th, 2010, 07:39 AM

For cameras with a 4gig limit, you have to work around it. The firmware is deliberately crippled, there's nothing you can do to change it.

Daniel von Euw · October 29th, 2010, 08:08 AM

The 4gig limit is not a problem of a "crippled" firmware - its a filesystem issue.

SD, SDHC und CF Cards use filesystems that support only files up to 4gig.

SDXC cards use exFAT filesystem that support files with over 4gig.

regards
Daniel

Perrone Ford · October 29th, 2010, 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daniel von Euw

The 4gig limit is not a problem of a "crippled" firmware - its a filesystem issue.

SD, SDHC und CF Cards use filesystems that support only files up to 4gig.

SDXC cards use exFAT filesystem that support files with over 4gig.

regards
Daniel

Sorry, not true at all. My EX1 uses FAT and I can record continuously until the card is full. Whether that be 1 hour or 20. The camera simply closes one file, then opens a new one for writing. This has been done since tapeless cameras were brought on the market. The makers of these cameras have chosen not to implement this. It is a deliberate choice.

Daniel von Euw · October 29th, 2010, 09:05 AM

@Perrone Ford:

My and Dave's question was not why the sony or canon DSLR's do not beginn a new file after reaching the 4gig filesize.

Our question is what happend with SDXC cards?

Will the camera write also only 4gig files tought no technical reason exists?

Or will it write up to 29:59 min if the camera does not overheat?

Have someone testet this with SDXC cards?

regards
Daniel

Kin Lau · October 29th, 2010, 09:37 AM

It's a _design_ decision. After stated many times before, file spanning works _fine_, Canon and others simply _chose_ not to implement it due to EU tax laws. Simple as that.

My Canon HF100 and Panasonic GH1 both work fine with SDHC and FAT file systems, and there's no software record limit.

Daniel von Euw · October 29th, 2010, 11:05 AM

I knew that file spanning works fine and that it's a design decision to do it or not.

But with SDXC and exFAT you don't need file spanning to record more than 12 min and due to EU tax laws its allow to record up to 29:59 min.

So you knew from personal experience that also with SDXC cards the camera stop by 4gig filesize?

regards
Daniel

Buba Kastorski · October 29th, 2010, 03:00 PM

I don't think it matters if SDXC supports files larger than 4Gb, I can format sd card with NTFS, pop it into EX1, and it will have to re-format it to FAT in order to be able to record, so the question is if your camera will support other tha FAT FS.

Chris Leong · November 13th, 2010, 10:48 PM

There's a sensor heating issue also at play here.
The DSLRs aren't optimised for video shooting and so they tend to run hot when the mirror's up and they're essentially in live view/video mode.
So the 12 / 20 minute clip limits have to do with that too.

But also:
Looking at the D7000 with its overflow capability, like the EX1/3, there's theoretically no limit to the length of shot that's possible, regardless of file size. With the overflow, as soon as one card gets full, writing switches over to the other card. While that's happening, in theory you could pull the first card, insert a fresh one, and keep going.
In the EX1 or 3 that's exactly what happens, no matter if you have a 2GB card in or a 32GB card in.
You can take one continuous clip that spans several card-loads. But even though, like the EX1, the D7000 has two card capacity, you can't exceed the recording time limit on each clip.

In theory, the same would be possible for a DSLR. However, two things, 1) the sensor heating, as I mentioned above and 2) the fact that they didn't pay royalties for proper AVC aquisitiion (or whatever the video compression system is) means that they've essentially crippled or cut off the maximum recording times to the lengths they are now.

Not that this should be a problem, of course. How many people actually watch single shots that last for 12 minutes without a cut?

C

Perrone Ford · November 13th, 2010, 10:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Leong

Not that this should be a problem, of course. How many people actually watch single shots that last for 12 minutes without a cut?

C

You ever film a press panel? A speech? A conference presentation? I've filmed all three with no breaks for over 45 minutes. Occasionally over an hour which is why I went tapeless in 2004. MiniDV proved too short for the panels I was assigned to shoot.

Eric Pascarelli · November 14th, 2010, 06:46 PM

I did an interview with my EX1 that lasted more than three hours. Definitely a shortcoming of DSLRs, that you can't do it.

October 29th, 2010, 01:01 AM	#1
Dave Morgan Major Player Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 293	SDXC can you record longer than 4gb/12 mins? im going to be getting a sony a580 and am trying to find out if by using a SDXC card if you can record video longer than the normal using a SDHC card?

October 29th, 2010, 03:00 PM	#9
Buba Kastorski Trustee Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Toronto Posts: 1,414	I don't think it matters if SDXC supports files larger than 4Gb, I can format sd card with NTFS, pop it into EX1, and it will have to re-format it to FAT in order to be able to record, so the question is if your camera will support other tha FAT FS. __________________ I love this place!

November 13th, 2010, 10:48 PM	#10
Chris Leong Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Los Angeles CA USA Posts: 507	There's a sensor heating issue also at play here. The DSLRs aren't optimised for video shooting and so they tend to run hot when the mirror's up and they're essentially in live view/video mode. So the 12 / 20 minute clip limits have to do with that too. But also: Looking at the D7000 with its overflow capability, like the EX1/3, there's theoretically no limit to the length of shot that's possible, regardless of file size. With the overflow, as soon as one card gets full, writing switches over to the other card. While that's happening, in theory you could pull the first card, insert a fresh one, and keep going. In the EX1 or 3 that's exactly what happens, no matter if you have a 2GB card in or a 32GB card in. You can take one continuous clip that spans several card-loads. But even though, like the EX1, the D7000 has two card capacity, you can't exceed the recording time limit on each clip. In theory, the same would be possible for a DSLR. However, two things, 1) the sensor heating, as I mentioned above and 2) the fact that they didn't pay royalties for proper AVC aquisitiion (or whatever the video compression system is) means that they've essentially crippled or cut off the maximum recording times to the lengths they are now. Not that this should be a problem, of course. How many people actually watch single shots that last for 12 minutes without a cut? C __________________ "The content, not the container."

October 29th, 2010, 04:39 AM	#2
Daniel von Euw Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Köln, NRW, Germany Posts: 70	I have the same question about the 550D / T2i. SDXC cards with exFAT filesystem should be able to do this. regards Daniel

October 29th, 2010, 07:39 AM	#3
Kin Lau Major Player Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Ottawa, ON Posts: 385	For cameras with a 4gig limit, you have to work around it. The firmware is deliberately crippled, there's nothing you can do to change it.

October 29th, 2010, 08:08 AM	#4
Daniel von Euw Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Köln, NRW, Germany Posts: 70	The 4gig limit is not a problem of a "crippled" firmware - its a filesystem issue. SD, SDHC und CF Cards use filesystems that support only files up to 4gig. SDXC cards use exFAT filesystem that support files with over 4gig. regards Daniel

October 29th, 2010, 09:05 AM	#6
Daniel von Euw Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Köln, NRW, Germany Posts: 70	@Perrone Ford: My and Dave's question was not why the sony or canon DSLR's do not beginn a new file after reaching the 4gig filesize. Our question is what happend with SDXC cards? Will the camera write also only 4gig files tought no technical reason exists? Or will it write up to 29:59 min if the camera does not overheat? Have someone testet this with SDXC cards? regards Daniel

October 29th, 2010, 09:37 AM	#7
Kin Lau Major Player Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Ottawa, ON Posts: 385	It's a _design_ decision. After stated many times before, file spanning works _fine_, Canon and others simply _chose_ not to implement it due to EU tax laws. Simple as that. My Canon HF100 and Panasonic GH1 both work fine with SDHC and FAT file systems, and there's no software record limit.

October 29th, 2010, 11:05 AM	#8
Daniel von Euw Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Köln, NRW, Germany Posts: 70	I knew that file spanning works fine and that it's a design decision to do it or not. But with SDXC and exFAT you don't need file spanning to record more than 12 min and due to EU tax laws its allow to record up to 29:59 min. So you knew from personal experience that also with SDXC cards the camera stop by 4gig filesize? regards Daniel

November 14th, 2010, 06:46 PM	#12
Eric Pascarelli Major Player Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 498	I did an interview with my EX1 that lasted more than three hours. Definitely a shortcoming of DSLRs, that you can't do it.