Downconverting with After Effects or other methods? at DVinfo.net

Shawn Alyasiri · May 20th, 2007, 09:25 PM

I've picked up the HPX2000. Incredible HD images.

I'm having quite a time downconverting the files for SD playback. I'd like to shoot/edit in Edius Broadcast SP as DVCPRO 1080 60i (1280x1080), upres to 1920x1080i for a master & file for BluRay, and send that file for downconversion for SD DVD's.

I've shot a lot of 1080 60i footage to test with. Again - HD settings in Edius SP look incredible (either DVCPRO HD or Full HD (1920x1080). I can't seem to get it to play on my Edius SP system in SD mode without edge tearing, warbling, moire, etc. I've tried changing the project settings from HD to SD, tried swapping the fields, tried ProCoder 2 Mpeg 2 exports from HD & SD timelines, etc.

Now I'm trying to downconvert in After Effects with an Canopus Lossless 1920x1080i file. I've tried upper/lower fields, fitting the input to the comp (DV Widescreen), etc.

Those files still look scrubby when brought back into a Canopus SD timeline.

Does anyone have any specific advice, settings, After Effects comp tips (or other advice).

Thanks all.

Kenn Christenson · May 21st, 2007, 11:44 AM

In AE you have to make certain you've interpreted the footage to upper field dominant (as all HD formats are.) Put your footage into a DV Widescreen Comp and make a movie straight from that composition.

Do not try to stretch a high def comp down to size in the output module - I've had very unsatisfactory results using that method.

I'd also look for an Edius specific forum to pose your question. Bear in mind that HD shrunk to SD may have to be blurred a bit to avoid the nasty line twitter and moire that always accompanies high resolution images shrunk down for use in standard def.

Shawn Alyasiri · May 22nd, 2007, 11:19 AM

Thanks for your response.

Do you have any specifics on the scaling? I had tried a 50% of original, as well as fitting the input to the 720x480 comp. Both looked pretty sketchy.

Any specific scaling, anchoring, and 'blurring' would be very beneficial to me.

I'm currently testing the P2 to DV function on the HVX200 - it's providing a nice hardware conversion for footage shot on the 200. Maybe it will help on the 2000 as well - although, that'd be a pretty crummy workflow...

Kenn Christenson · May 22nd, 2007, 12:08 PM

In AE if you want to preserve the widescreen aspect ratio, you'll want to set the composition to "DV Widescreen" this will give you a squeezed image in your comp window but should look fine when played back on a monitor capable of showing 16:9.

When you drop your footage into the comp you'll have to scale the footage in the "Layer" pulldown. Set the units to % of composition, set preserve to none and check the "include Pixel Aspect Ratio." Type 100 in each of the boxes, this will accurately scale your footage for the composition.

If you, instead, want to do a "pan and scan" of your footage, change your comp to the DV NTSC preset, then drop your footage into the comp. You'll have to scale the footage again. This time you'll want to preserve the current aspect ratio as well as the pixel aspect ratio. In the height column type in 100 and leave the other column alone.

As far as blurring goes, it's really up to you. Make sure you have a fairly large video monitor to judge your footage. I use a 20" Sony. Look for parts of the image that are flickering - I will use either Fast Blur or Reduce Interlace Flicker to reduce the line twitter. In fast blur, I set the blur for vertical and start with a very small amount, say .5. I will do the same thing if I'm using the Reduce Interlace Flicker filter. It's really a balance between how much flicker you're willing to live with vs. how much softening of the image.

Best of Luck.

May 20th, 2007, 09:25 PM	#1
Shawn Alyasiri Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 256	Downconverting with After Effects or other methods? I've picked up the HPX2000. Incredible HD images. I'm having quite a time downconverting the files for SD playback. I'd like to shoot/edit in Edius Broadcast SP as DVCPRO 1080 60i (1280x1080), upres to 1920x1080i for a master & file for BluRay, and send that file for downconversion for SD DVD's. I've shot a lot of 1080 60i footage to test with. Again - HD settings in Edius SP look incredible (either DVCPRO HD or Full HD (1920x1080). I can't seem to get it to play on my Edius SP system in SD mode without edge tearing, warbling, moire, etc. I've tried changing the project settings from HD to SD, tried swapping the fields, tried ProCoder 2 Mpeg 2 exports from HD & SD timelines, etc. Now I'm trying to downconvert in After Effects with an Canopus Lossless 1920x1080i file. I've tried upper/lower fields, fitting the input to the comp (DV Widescreen), etc. Those files still look scrubby when brought back into a Canopus SD timeline. Does anyone have any specific advice, settings, After Effects comp tips (or other advice). Thanks all.

May 21st, 2007, 11:44 AM	#2
Kenn Christenson Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Medford Oregon Posts: 152	In AE you have to make certain you've interpreted the footage to upper field dominant (as all HD formats are.) Put your footage into a DV Widescreen Comp and make a movie straight from that composition. Do not try to stretch a high def comp down to size in the output module - I've had very unsatisfactory results using that method. I'd also look for an Edius specific forum to pose your question. Bear in mind that HD shrunk to SD may have to be blurred a bit to avoid the nasty line twitter and moire that always accompanies high resolution images shrunk down for use in standard def.

May 22nd, 2007, 11:19 AM	#3
Shawn Alyasiri Major Player Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Bloomington, IL Posts: 256	Thanks for your response. Do you have any specifics on the scaling? I had tried a 50% of original, as well as fitting the input to the 720x480 comp. Both looked pretty sketchy. Any specific scaling, anchoring, and 'blurring' would be very beneficial to me. I'm currently testing the P2 to DV function on the HVX200 - it's providing a nice hardware conversion for footage shot on the 200. Maybe it will help on the 2000 as well - although, that'd be a pretty crummy workflow...

May 22nd, 2007, 12:08 PM	#4
Kenn Christenson Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Medford Oregon Posts: 152	In AE if you want to preserve the widescreen aspect ratio, you'll want to set the composition to "DV Widescreen" this will give you a squeezed image in your comp window but should look fine when played back on a monitor capable of showing 16:9. When you drop your footage into the comp you'll have to scale the footage in the "Layer" pulldown. Set the units to % of composition, set preserve to none and check the "include Pixel Aspect Ratio." Type 100 in each of the boxes, this will accurately scale your footage for the composition. If you, instead, want to do a "pan and scan" of your footage, change your comp to the DV NTSC preset, then drop your footage into the comp. You'll have to scale the footage again. This time you'll want to preserve the current aspect ratio as well as the pixel aspect ratio. In the height column type in 100 and leave the other column alone. As far as blurring goes, it's really up to you. Make sure you have a fairly large video monitor to judge your footage. I use a 20" Sony. Look for parts of the image that are flickering - I will use either Fast Blur or Reduce Interlace Flicker to reduce the line twitter. In fast blur, I set the blur for vertical and start with a very small amount, say .5. I will do the same thing if I'm using the Reduce Interlace Flicker filter. It's really a balance between how much flicker you're willing to live with vs. how much softening of the image. Best of Luck.