Pal Camera Speculation at DVinfo.net

Sergio Perez · January 14th, 2006, 05:11 PM

This is for the fellow Pal users out there. Since the Pal camera was so long delayed after the Ntsc version, it is legitimate for us to think that there was some "fine tuning" of the camera for the Pal market. So what do you think was added to the camera performance for the Pal release? Here's my take:

1- 50i HD is a bit Higher resolution than 60i HD, so I expect a small resolution bump in the Pal camera

2- Maybe one more cinegamma setting (original cinegamma? This is just hopeful thinking :)

3- Not as noisy picture (0r at least camera's default settings already come with Barry's optimal -5 detail)

Now, what I really wanted to be included, but feel that it's not happening:

1- 24P, even without audio
2- 60P for slow motion
3- Ntsc comparable price?
4-image flip for 35mm adapters
5- magic bullet editors included like in the us dvx :) !

What else do you think will be revised?

Peter Jefferson · January 15th, 2006, 06:22 AM

Since the Pal camera was so long delayed after the Ntsc version, it is legitimate for us to think that there was some "fine tuning" of the camera for the Pal market.

((Meh.. in PAL land were always behind.. this isnt for any other reason apart from market share... if there were more PAL users out there, then wed see PAL models coming out before NTSC... on top of that, the unit is designed and built in Japan, so they look after their own first... its always been this way with almost EVERY camera on the market.. not jsut this one.. ))

1- 50i HD is a bit Higher resolution than 60i HD, so I expect a small resolution bump in the Pal camera

((I dont... ))

2- Maybe one more cinegamma setting (original cinegamma? This is just hopeful thinking :)

((This is all firmware.. on top of that, firmware can now be installed through SD card, so irrespective of what one unit has they will al eventually run the same firmware (based on framerate locale of course) But to be honest, i dont see PAL gettin any "bonus' for coming second in line....))

3- Not as noisy picture (0r at least camera's default settings already come with Barry's optimal -5 detail)

((In Pal, its common to have a cleaner image in SD simply due to resolution and our voltage/framerate count as well as our colour space vs NTSC colour space. One thing to note is that progressive scan ISNT as senstive to light as is interlaced, and even the DVX was a little noisy when it came to shootin gin progressive mode...hell even the XL2 was noisy.... But i trully dont see noise being an issue considering that if it was THAT noisy, Pana would NOT have released the product... Good lighting is key ;)
Either way, i dont doubt that there wil be firmware tweaks here and there adjusting the way the HVX manages its colours and "noise" levels... among other things which can be tweaked... such as cinegamma configs etc etc....
With these firmware tweaks, id LOVE to be able to draw in my own Gamma curves and import THEM into the HVX to save having to do it in post..
Imagine running a Kodak 5279 curve straight out of the camera...
Now having teh ability to import your own curves would be pretty cool if u ask me.. but i doubt that will happen..
Scene file swapping from cam to cam, yes, anything else.. nup...
Thats jsut my assumption for what ive seen so far..
On top of that with regard to noise, im yet to see footage whch really shows off this noise everyone is talking about... ))

Now, what I really wanted to be included, but feel that it's not happening:
((heheheheh))

1- 24P, even without audio
((Itll never happen, or maybe it will.. i mean the HD100e has 24p, 25p, 50p, 50i.... either way... I just dont see Pana doing this.. ))

2- 60P for slow motion
((50p yes i can see that, but not 60p.... ))

3- Ntsc comparable price?
((HAHAHAH NEVER!! ITs against their religion...;)~ ))

4-image flip for 35mm adapters
((as far as theyre concerned, the Leica lense itself is good enough.. i doubt this will ever see the light of day... I could be wrong on that with a firmware update though.. lol))

5- magic bullet editors included like in the us dvx :) !
((err.. why?? Magic bullet isnt the be all and end all... id rather a codec/media management tool for each NLE on the market... but i dont see Pana ever doing this.. ))

What else do you think will be revised?
((Ummm.. NOTHING... apart from frame rate... also dont forget that with 25p, we wont have the capacity as our 24p buddies, so we'll need to recalculate our work... umm.. what else.. i cant think right now.. its 1130 and i need sleep...

January 14th, 2006, 05:11 PM	#1
Sergio Perez Major Player Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Macau Posts: 331	Pal Camera Speculation This is for the fellow Pal users out there. Since the Pal camera was so long delayed after the Ntsc version, it is legitimate for us to think that there was some "fine tuning" of the camera for the Pal market. So what do you think was added to the camera performance for the Pal release? Here's my take: 1- 50i HD is a bit Higher resolution than 60i HD, so I expect a small resolution bump in the Pal camera 2- Maybe one more cinegamma setting (original cinegamma? This is just hopeful thinking :) 3- Not as noisy picture (0r at least camera's default settings already come with Barry's optimal -5 detail) Now, what I really wanted to be included, but feel that it's not happening: 1- 24P, even without audio 2- 60P for slow motion 3- Ntsc comparable price? 4-image flip for 35mm adapters 5- magic bullet editors included like in the us dvx :) ! What else do you think will be revised? __________________ If you don't believe in your film, no one else will.

January 15th, 2006, 06:22 AM	#2
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Since the Pal camera was so long delayed after the Ntsc version, it is legitimate for us to think that there was some "fine tuning" of the camera for the Pal market. ((Meh.. in PAL land were always behind.. this isnt for any other reason apart from market share... if there were more PAL users out there, then wed see PAL models coming out before NTSC... on top of that, the unit is designed and built in Japan, so they look after their own first... its always been this way with almost EVERY camera on the market.. not jsut this one.. )) 1- 50i HD is a bit Higher resolution than 60i HD, so I expect a small resolution bump in the Pal camera ((I dont... )) 2- Maybe one more cinegamma setting (original cinegamma? This is just hopeful thinking :) ((This is all firmware.. on top of that, firmware can now be installed through SD card, so irrespective of what one unit has they will al eventually run the same firmware (based on framerate locale of course) But to be honest, i dont see PAL gettin any "bonus' for coming second in line....)) 3- Not as noisy picture (0r at least camera's default settings already come with Barry's optimal -5 detail) ((In Pal, its common to have a cleaner image in SD simply due to resolution and our voltage/framerate count as well as our colour space vs NTSC colour space. One thing to note is that progressive scan ISNT as senstive to light as is interlaced, and even the DVX was a little noisy when it came to shootin gin progressive mode...hell even the XL2 was noisy.... But i trully dont see noise being an issue considering that if it was THAT noisy, Pana would NOT have released the product... Good lighting is key ;) Either way, i dont doubt that there wil be firmware tweaks here and there adjusting the way the HVX manages its colours and "noise" levels... among other things which can be tweaked... such as cinegamma configs etc etc.... With these firmware tweaks, id LOVE to be able to draw in my own Gamma curves and import THEM into the HVX to save having to do it in post.. Imagine running a Kodak 5279 curve straight out of the camera... Now having teh ability to import your own curves would be pretty cool if u ask me.. but i doubt that will happen.. Scene file swapping from cam to cam, yes, anything else.. nup... Thats jsut my assumption for what ive seen so far.. On top of that with regard to noise, im yet to see footage whch really shows off this noise everyone is talking about... )) Now, what I really wanted to be included, but feel that it's not happening: ((heheheheh)) 1- 24P, even without audio ((Itll never happen, or maybe it will.. i mean the HD100e has 24p, 25p, 50p, 50i.... either way... I just dont see Pana doing this.. )) 2- 60P for slow motion ((50p yes i can see that, but not 60p.... )) 3- Ntsc comparable price? ((HAHAHAH NEVER!! ITs against their religion...;)~ )) 4-image flip for 35mm adapters ((as far as theyre concerned, the Leica lense itself is good enough.. i doubt this will ever see the light of day... I could be wrong on that with a firmware update though.. lol)) 5- magic bullet editors included like in the us dvx :) ! ((err.. why?? Magic bullet isnt the be all and end all... id rather a codec/media management tool for each NLE on the market... but i dont see Pana ever doing this.. )) What else do you think will be revised? ((Ummm.. NOTHING... apart from frame rate... also dont forget that with 25p, we wont have the capacity as our 24p buddies, so we'll need to recalculate our work... umm.. what else.. i cant think right now.. its 1130 and i need sleep...