The Notorious P2 F.U.D. Thread

Zack Birlew · March 8th, 2005, 03:01 PM

Ugh, you guys are making me sick! Here are some facts:

- Memory prices are falling drastically, just give it some time.

- The camera most likely won't be released until a few months or so after NAB2005. This supports the above fact.

- Laptop shooting isn't necessary, Panasonic has the external HDD option for P2 card layoff. Also, we know little about this device as well. Perhaps we can swap out the HDD with another one instead of buying more of the same device?

- If using a laptop, most instances will call for an extra battery and/or extra HDD at most. If shooting indoors, AC power can be used to alleviate shooting length worries.

- 4 minutes. That's all we've got for DVCPROHD recording for awhile and that's all that we need for single takes in most instances. Quit complaining and just have your talent practice more! >=D Lazies! Shoot Clint Eastwood-style, it's just so professional.

- The camera doesn't shoot just DVCPROHD, it shoots DVCPRO25 and DVCPRO50 (whether it can shoot 24p for all modes or not is still up in the air if I'm not mistaken).

- Documentary people aren't who this camera's primarily for, as of yet, this camera, right now, is meant for indie filmmakers. If need be, documentarists that need longer shooting times can shoot the DVCPRO modes instead of DVCPROHD. Or use another camera altogether! >=D

- The price hasn't been officially announced yet, just the figure that Panasonic is aiming for. Regardless of the camera price, yes, an investment will need to be made towards upgrading for HD. Software and hardware most likely need to be upgraded and ATM, only AVID and FCP support DVCPROHD (yet again, if I'm not mistaken). So for all those people spouting, "Oh this thing's gonna be too expensive, I may as well just jump the gun and buy a $20,000 procamera!" or "Shoot, I'll just buy a (insert prosumer camera here) instead!", just be quiet, you don't know how much it's going to cost. None of us do. Wait until we get an exact price at NAB2005.

So, everyone just quit griping and wait and see. Maybe someone can try to come up with another question about this camera for another thread? So far we've only got one page of thread going, doesn't anyone have any other questions?

Chris Hurd · March 8th, 2005, 03:05 PM

Alexey Morvin:

<< Guys, are you working for Panasonic or something? >>

No more so than you're working against them.

There is only one person actively participating in this forum who works for Panasonic, and she is Jan Crittenden. She is clearly identified as "Panasonic Broadcast" in the user title below here name. We welcome her presence here warmly, just as we do for any other manufacturer's representatives who care to post here at DV Info Net.

Speaking only for myself, but I'm sure this goes for most everyone else here, I am keenly interested in new digital video technolgies and formats of all kinds, including P2 as well as HDV. And just like all the other discussion boards I have here at DV Info Net, I set up this one so that I can interact with other interested folks and learn as much as I can about it.

<< I can't understand this love to extra problems (laptops, 4 mins flash cards...) >>

Understanding P2 requires some degree of forward thinking. These are solutions, not problems. And we're not talking about four minutes on a flash card; we're talking about hours worth of HD recording on a flash card array.

Your posts so far are highly suspicious in that they are attempting to cast F.U.D. (fear, uncertainty and doubt). This is contrary to the way we operate around here and is highly detrimental to the learning process. Please think about that very carefully. Thanks,

Chris Hurd · March 8th, 2005, 03:09 PM

For Ignacio Rodriguez, Jesse Bekas, Michael Struthers, Claude Isbell and Jack Felis: thanks a bunch for your excellent input at the tail end of this thread, guys. Your thoughtful viewpoints were right on target and have made me feel a lot less alone! For awhile it seemed like I was kind of single-handed there.

Jack,

<< Maybe someone can try to come up with another question about this camera for another thread? >>

Thanks, this is the same thing I was trying to say about fifteen or twenty posts back!

I really think this thread is done for; please folks, take Jack's advice (and mine) and steer any further discussion to a *new* topic. Thanks in advance,

Barry Green · March 8th, 2005, 05:03 PM

Quote:

BUT, someone will shoot a doc with this cam, because they'll have multiple cards and a laptop handy. Which will become more and more commonplace on a shoot as time goes on.

And don't forget, Panasonic has already announced that they're going to be building a tiny portable hard disk P2 card reader device, which will be like a little FireStore, but instead of needing to be cabled to the camera you just put a card in and it sucks the data off it and copies it to the hard disk. So for the cost of a little 60gb hard disk about 3" x 4" or so, you can have hours of storage.

Shoot to the cards. When they're full, pop 'em in the disk reader and it quaffs 'em at a rate of about 4x realtime or something. Then continue shooting.

Is this really a big deal here? Seems like a nearly *ideal* workflow. Instant acquisition, instant editing, ability to delete/manage clips on the card right away, ability to store 'em on the hard disk for longer-form recording... you don't *need* a laptop or anything like that, you can just use this P2 card reader disk drive thing for that, and it's no more inconvenient than using a FireStore (one of the hottest accessories for tape-based cameras), and in some ways it's even more convenient (in that the P2 card reader drive doesn't need to be tethered to the camera by a fragile firewire cable!)

Chris Hurd · March 9th, 2005, 12:09 AM

Howdy from Texas,

And there you have it... an excersize in F.U.D. (fear, uncertainty & doubt), and how to defeat it, with an excellent closing statement from Barry Green.

This thread was a malignant, overgrown cancerous tumor which has been surgically excized from Kurth Brouseman's original Panasonic AJ-HDX100 topic. It's closed because there's really nothing that needs to be added to it. In short, we don't do F.U.D. at DV Info Net. Thanks,

March 8th, 2005, 03:01 PM	#46
Zack Birlew Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 613	Ugh, you guys are making me sick! Here are some facts: - Memory prices are falling drastically, just give it some time. - The camera most likely won't be released until a few months or so after NAB2005. This supports the above fact. - Laptop shooting isn't necessary, Panasonic has the external HDD option for P2 card layoff. Also, we know little about this device as well. Perhaps we can swap out the HDD with another one instead of buying more of the same device? - If using a laptop, most instances will call for an extra battery and/or extra HDD at most. If shooting indoors, AC power can be used to alleviate shooting length worries. - 4 minutes. That's all we've got for DVCPROHD recording for awhile and that's all that we need for single takes in most instances. Quit complaining and just have your talent practice more! >=D Lazies! Shoot Clint Eastwood-style, it's just so professional. - The camera doesn't shoot just DVCPROHD, it shoots DVCPRO25 and DVCPRO50 (whether it can shoot 24p for all modes or not is still up in the air if I'm not mistaken). - Documentary people aren't who this camera's primarily for, as of yet, this camera, right now, is meant for indie filmmakers. If need be, documentarists that need longer shooting times can shoot the DVCPRO modes instead of DVCPROHD. Or use another camera altogether! >=D - The price hasn't been officially announced yet, just the figure that Panasonic is aiming for. Regardless of the camera price, yes, an investment will need to be made towards upgrading for HD. Software and hardware most likely need to be upgraded and ATM, only AVID and FCP support DVCPROHD (yet again, if I'm not mistaken). So for all those people spouting, "Oh this thing's gonna be too expensive, I may as well just jump the gun and buy a $20,000 procamera!" or "Shoot, I'll just buy a (insert prosumer camera here) instead!", just be quiet, you don't know how much it's going to cost. None of us do. Wait until we get an exact price at NAB2005. So, everyone just quit griping and wait and see. Maybe someone can try to come up with another question about this camera for another thread? So far we've only got one page of thread going, doesn't anyone have any other questions? __________________ "Babs Do or Babs Do not, there is no try." - Zack Birlew www.BabsDoProductions.com

March 8th, 2005, 03:05 PM	#47
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Alexey Morvin: << Guys, are you working for Panasonic or something? >> No more so than you're working against them. There is only one person actively participating in this forum who works for Panasonic, and she is Jan Crittenden. She is clearly identified as "Panasonic Broadcast" in the user title below here name. We welcome her presence here warmly, just as we do for any other manufacturer's representatives who care to post here at DV Info Net. Speaking only for myself, but I'm sure this goes for most everyone else here, I am keenly interested in new digital video technolgies and formats of all kinds, including P2 as well as HDV. And just like all the other discussion boards I have here at DV Info Net, I set up this one so that I can interact with other interested folks and learn as much as I can about it. << I can't understand this love to extra problems (laptops, 4 mins flash cards...) >> Understanding P2 requires some degree of forward thinking. These are solutions, not problems. And we're not talking about four minutes on a flash card; we're talking about hours worth of HD recording on a flash card array. Your posts so far are highly suspicious in that they are attempting to cast F.U.D. (fear, uncertainty and doubt). This is contrary to the way we operate around here and is highly detrimental to the learning process. Please think about that very carefully. Thanks, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

March 8th, 2005, 03:09 PM	#48
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	For Ignacio Rodriguez, Jesse Bekas, Michael Struthers, Claude Isbell and Jack Felis: thanks a bunch for your excellent input at the tail end of this thread, guys. Your thoughtful viewpoints were right on target and have made me feel a lot less alone! For awhile it seemed like I was kind of single-handed there. Jack, << Maybe someone can try to come up with another question about this camera for another thread? >> Thanks, this is the same thing I was trying to say about fifteen or twenty posts back! I really think this thread is done for; please folks, take Jack's advice (and mine) and steer any further discussion to a new topic. Thanks in advance, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

March 9th, 2005, 12:09 AM	#50
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Howdy from Texas, And there you have it... an excersize in F.U.D. (fear, uncertainty & doubt), and how to defeat it, with an excellent closing statement from Barry Green. This thread was a malignant, overgrown cancerous tumor which has been surgically excized from Kurth Brouseman's original Panasonic AJ-HDX100 topic. It's closed because there's really nothing that needs to be added to it. In short, we don't do F.U.D. at DV Info Net. Thanks, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!