Press Release: Panasonic Announces 4K Mirrorless DMC-GH4

[Phil Lee]

Hi

Originally Posted by Noa Put

The biggest advantage the gh4 has is that you have a lot of control over your image right in camera. An 8 bit image does fall apart much quicker in post so you would have the most benefit getting it right from the start. For some shoots where you would have to shoot high contrast scenes with very bright sun a very dark shadows the gh4 will give a you a lot more flexibility getting more detail out of the shadows and prevent the highlights from blowing out.

Another I would add is 0-255 video capture, this provides extra latitude for post, factor that in with the options to adjust all manner of the picture capture settings the GH4 is very flexible. The higher video bit-rates also allow for better grading.

The GH4 and AX100 are as different as chalk and cheese, for a start one is a mirrorless digital camera with a 4/3rds sensor and interchangeable lenses, the other is a traditional (even if rather big and heavy for 2014) camcorder. Different tools for different jobs aren't they?

Regards

Phil

[Noa Put]

Anyone experiencing any lockups while recording in 4K? I have seen several reports from users appearing about the camera locking up during record, you can see it here: https://twitter.com/miggohoo/statuse...32171712946176

That's the last thing I would expect to happen during a live event, not very reassuring.

[Ronald Jackson]

Is this for relatively prolonged recording? I read of somebody who left the cam in 4K record mode for it to "lock up" after about 10 minutes continual recording.
Wonder if there is also a problem shooting series of short duration clips, as I do with wildlife videoing.

All a bit hypothetical yet 'cos I don't know when my ordered GH4 will be available here in UK.

Ron

[Willard Hill]

I haven't had it lock up while recording, but had it lock up several times while sitting in stand-by mode during the first week or so I had it.. I had to remove and replace the battery to restore operation. You couldn't even get the camera to power down by turning off the switch. It hasn't happened lately. I use the camera most every day to film wildlife, but haven't been doing a lot of actual filming--usually just a few short clips each day.

[Noa Put]

Well that is not good at all, quite alarming really, imagine having the gh4 on a steadicam in standby waiting for that shot you cannot miss (the couples entrance in the venue, the wedding cake, the first dance) and the camera locks up, or it locks up during record. If one of my current camera's would lock up more then once I"d sell it right away. Lets hope Panasonic will fix this, the camera is useless if it doesn't record when you want it to.

[Ronald Jackson]

I had one of my GH3s lock up a few weeks back. At the time I just assumed it was connected with the SDHC card, maybe a write problem. Had to remove then replace the battery and the problem hasn't occurred since in spite of some fairly concentrated use.


Ron

[Jack Zhang]

Is it exclusive to C4K mode or does it happen in the 16:9 4K modes too?

[Bryce Comer]

Can anyone here with a GH4 tell me if the ETC mode works in 4K, or is it just in the 1080 mode? I'm thinking of this camera for wildlife, just not sure if it will be the right camera for me yet. If anyone has both the GH3 & GH4 would you maybe try the crop modes in both settings. I am hoping to get super tele shots if it is possible. The GH3 is pretty much there, but if the GH4 has even great reach by using the crop mode in 4k, then that is probably the best way to go. Would be using lenses up to 400mm.
On another subject. For those people shooting wildlife with either the GH3 or 4, how do you go without an ND filter?
Thanks in advance,
Bryce

[Steve Siegel]

Bryce,

What sort of numbers are you talking about in "super-tele" with these cameras in crop mode. The Sony EX3/PMW 300 (1/2 inch chip) have a crop factor of 5.4, and in the old Canon XL series it was 7 or even 9.
Are these GH cameras able to compete in that range? Does crop mode employ only the mid section of the chip to record, or are you just shooting and cropping down later on to get the telephoto?

[Bryce Comer]

Hi Steve,
I am currently using an EX3. The longest lens i use with it is a Nikon 80-400mm, so if i can get close to that, i would be very happy. I know the GH3 is not quite there, i was wondering though, if the GH4 can do the same sort of electronic crop with a 4k image & then be able to crop further in post down to a 1080 size to get me that little bit more. Not sure if that is how it works though. Not sure if the 4k image is taken from the sensor pixel for pixel or if it is also down sampled from a larger pixel count.
Regards,
Bryce

[Pat Reddy]

Bryce, I haven't tried all the permutations, but what seems to me to be the best solution is to shoot 4K with the digital zoom set to 2. With the affordable 100 to 300 panny lens this gets you 2 x 2.2 x 300 or 1320 mm equivalent max. In 4K mode, the 2 x digital zoom is quite well resolved, it seems like something between 4K and 1080p in effective resolution. ETC works only in 1080p mode but it seems to give you less overall resolution. I think you could still crop 4K some with the 2x digital zoom for 1080p delivery or use it uncropped as 4k.

Pat

[Steve Siegel]

But when you are talking about electronic cropping, isn't that just the old digital zoom? I hope that's not what they are talking about with their crop factors. I was looking at a review The evolving review of the Panasonic GH4 – EDIT: Now with 96fps Video test | Philip Bloom where the guy was demonstrating the zoom or crop factor or whatever of the GH4 with a series of eyes in close-up, and although he was impressed, the results are horribly out of focus at higher magnification.

I guess what I would like to see is a comparison of the Panasonic GH4 and the Sony PMW300, each with 400mm glass on the front. That 96 fps feature is really tempting.

Another factor to keep in mind, especially if you are over 50, or wear glasses, is that warbler in the middle of the image you think is in focus as you shoot full-frame turns out not to be when you crop it later at home. That's why I put a 4- diopter lens in my PMW300 viewfinder, to get a bigger, easier to focus, image in the EVF. (If you didn't know, the EX3 offers that, too. It's not well publicized.)

[Bryce Comer]

Thanks Pat,
Sounds like there are certainly some options. So when you say that the ETC mode in 1080 gives less overall resolution, do you mean less than the 1080 without the ETC mode turned on? Or less than the resolution of the 4K image with the 2x crop?
Thanks,
Bryce

[Willard Hill]

As for the camera locking up, mine was set for 4K 100mbs 30P and it was what I understand is actually UHD at 3840x2160 instead of the C4k Mode.

My lock-ups may have been caused by this: I have the camera setup to shoot 4K as listed above in creative movie mode and had the C1 custom setting configured to shoot 1080P in ETC mode. With this i could shift between the two just by moving the dial and I was doing so without powering the camera off. This works OK most of the time, but it could have been the cause in the few instances it has happened or I could have inadvertent bumped another button in the heat of action which caused a conflict that locked the camera up. Whatever the cause, I was not actually filming when the camera locked up, but I was changing settings and trying to set a shot up. At any rate it has not happened for over two weeks.

Image quality is very hard to describe or show objectively, but on my equipment the 1080P in ETC mode looks extremely good. In fact I can tell little if any difference between it and 4K, but that is likely a limitation of what I am looking at it on. I also think that either 1080P or 4K from the GH4 looks better than footage from my GH3, but again that is very subjective.

Cropping 4K in post to get the equivalent of 1080P in ETC mode seems to work well, but a downside with shooting wildlife at long range is that it may not appear very large in the finder at long range in 4K, but will look much larger in ETC mode which makes the actual filming more exciting as it seems up close and personal instead of so small and so far and of course makes it easier to manual focus if you are doing that.

As for long range ability, I will not go into the mathematical comparisons, but suffice it to say that I have never felt a sense of loss in going from the Canon XL cameras such as the XL-1s and the XL-H1 for long range work. One may not be able to obtain as much effective focal length from these cameras, but it is enough for serious long range work.

The biggest problem from my perspective is that the lenses that work with auto-focus such as the Lumix 100-300 are a bit short on the long end. For real long range work I have used the Canon 500mm F4 with a Redrock Micro adapter, on the GH2, and GH3 but it is a bit clunky to change apertures and there is no auto-focus. On the other hand, we had to manual focus the L lenses with the XL series anyway so that is not a downside compared to them. I haven't used the Canon telephotos on the GH4 yet, but would expect them to do as well or better on the GH4.

[Bryce Comer]

Very informative post thanks Willard! The more i look at this camera, the more i like it.
I am however, still wondering how people are shooting without a built in ND filter. Do you use a variable nd filter to control light, or are you able to get exposure right with a combination of a smaller aperture & higher shutter speed? While in most cases i want all the light i can get filming in the golden hours of the day, there are certainly times when filming in much harsher light necessitates stopping down &/or use nd filters to reduce the light coming in.
Regards,
Bryce