Two quick questions: DVX100A's "marker" and "-50/-60 mic sensitivity" at DVinfo.net

Bogdan Apetri · July 1st, 2004, 05:01 AM

So, quick as I promised:

Is the "marker" option on the A model a reliable light meter? And, from 0 to 99, that means in fact the IRE values? What is the correspondence (if any)?

Second, the -50 or -60 mic sensitivity... what is the nest to use with the Sennheiser ME67? Any ideas, people who have already tried this? Based on the mic's brochure, I would say use -50, but I'm no audio expert (yet...).

Thanks a lot again!

Bogdan

PS This camera is very, very nice. I got the PAL one and if you twikle all things to your taste, it's amazing, I would say. For a miniDV camera, I should also add.

Ken Tanaka · July 2nd, 2004, 12:34 AM

Bogdan,

>> Is the "marker" option on the A model a reliable light meter? And, from 0 to 99, that means in fact the IRE values? What is the correspondence (if any)? <<

I assume you mean the camera's spot-meter mode. Reliable? Well, yes, if you want to judge your exposure on a very specific area. I do not, however, believe that the index figures correspond to anything globally. I think they're just exposure values relative to the camera's internal system. I've not seen anything indicating that they refer to IRE or any other standard.

I'll leave the ME67 question to someone else. I have a 67 but have never used it with my DVX100A. I -believe- -50 would be correct but do not know this authoritatively.

Have fun!

Matt Gettemeier · July 6th, 2004, 07:38 AM

-50 has got to be the setting with the HOT Sennheiser mics... plug in your mic and point it at something noisy... I've got a DVX and I had an me66... it would blow the inputs at the drop of a hat... same goes for the AT4073a... If you just listen while the mic is pointed at a source, then switch the menu between the two (-50 and -60) you'll notice that the -60 is like turning the volume dial 90 degrees! Normal recording should leave the dials around center with some room to tweak up and down as needed... If you go to -60 then you'll be left with a few degrees of DOWN and 3/4ths of the dial to go UP.

Greg Matty · July 8th, 2004, 11:58 AM

The K6 power module is way too hot for DV cameras. If you are in a loud environment, it is easy to overload the mic. You can hear my tests of this here:

http://www.rk-productions.net/mach1.html

You'll need QT 6 to view the MPEG4 but if you listen to the cars rev up and down, you can hear the audio distorting. Note that it won't register as clipping, but you'll the distortion.

To solve this I have had two custom XLR cables built. One with a 10db attenuator and one with an 18. Sennheiser also sells the K6 as the K6CL which is also attenuated by 18db. However, if you ever upgrade camera's to a real pro model, you'll need to go back to the K6. The custom cables were made in Canada and cost about $50 Canadian shipped to my US address.

You can also buy an Audio Technica in-line barrel attenuator but I prefer the cable method. I'll post the place where I had it made if you are interested.

Greg

Bogdan Apetri · July 9th, 2004, 01:55 AM

Hmmmm... Thanks Greg...

I must say I've noticed this myself. I bought the K6+ME67 for their well-know quality, but I didn't know they are so hot for the DVX100A. They are. Well, I was also lucky to have the Azden X-2 shotgun, and I've used it so far. But I'd like to be able to use the ME67 with the camera soon.

How much would the Audio Technica in-line cost? I'm in Romania so far for the summer... any other solutions you might think of?

Thanks for all the other replies, by the way...

PS I have read (regarding my first questions) someplace else on the forum that the marker's values are indeed IRE values. Can anyone confirm?

Greg Matty · July 9th, 2004, 07:58 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Bogdan Apetri : Hmmmm... Thanks Greg...

I must say I've noticed this myself. I bought the K6+ME67 for their well-know quality, but I didn't know they are so hot for the DVX100A. They are. Well, I was also lucky to have the Azden X-2 shotgun, and I've used it so far. But I'd like to be able to use the ME67 with the camera soon.

How much would the Audio Technica in-line cost? I'm in Romania so far for the summer... any other solutions you might think of?

Thanks for all the other replies, by the way...

PS I have read (regarding my first questions) someplace else on the forum that the marker's values are indeed IRE values. Can anyone confirm? -->>>

I bought the in-line barrel attenuator from B&H. If you search for their site for Audio Technica attenuator, it should bring it up.

I don't know about Romania's economy or the status of any production houses, but the XL-R cable's I had made are probably pretty easy to fabricate. Maybe you could ask around. Just tell them you need a cable with a 10db pad and see what they say.

What kind of project are you working on that takes you to Romania? Just curious.

Greg

Bogdan Apetri · July 11th, 2004, 06:12 AM

Hey Gregg.

I'm actually Romanian. I am a Graduate student at Columbia University's film school. I'm doing two summer projects here back home.

I have bought the DVX100 and the ME67 from NY, together with other accessories, XLR cables etc.

I will look at the Audio-Technica on B&H's web-site right now. Fortunately, my girlfriend (also Romanian, also Graduate student in NY but at the Med School) is coming back home this Thursday! If it's not too expensive, I will ask her to buy it :-) I'll let you know.

Bogdan

Bogdan Apetri · July 13th, 2004, 04:17 AM

Gregg,

I had my girlfriend buy the in-line XLR barrel. I should have it by this coming Friday. Costed about 50 bucks. I hope it's the right one, it attaches on both ends on XLR cables, right?

It has 3 attenuator levels: -10, -20 and -30db.

What is the level that you would recommend?

Thanks!

Bogdan

Greg Matty · July 13th, 2004, 07:55 AM

Bogdan,

That is the same one I use. I would NOT plug it into the camera as it is too easy to break off. Instead, plug it into the microphone and run an XLR cable from that to your DVX-100. For dialog and the like, I use the -10 db setting. If I am sampling louder sounds, like motocross bikes or loud cars, I use the -20db.

It works well for me and I am sure you will be pleased.

Greg Matty

Bogdan Apetri · July 13th, 2004, 01:14 PM

Greg,

Thanks a lot for your advice, I will listen to it. I got an XLR splitter anyway, to feed both channels on my camera, one lower than the other. I will connect it one end on the camera, the other on the attenuator.

I just hope too many XLR cables and connectors won't influence on the sound quality.

And sorry for spelling your name with two Gs, previously...

Bogdan

Ian Poirier · July 13th, 2004, 01:25 PM

What makes the ME67 so hot for the DVX100a? I just today ordered a Sanken CS3e and was worried it woundn't be hot enough looking at the specs of the output. I'm no expert though. What is the sensitivity of the ME67? Finding any real specs for sound on the DVX100a is impossible in my experience so I just went for the best mic for my application and was gonna go from there.

Greg Matty · July 13th, 2004, 07:59 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Ian Poirier : What makes the ME67 so hot for the DVX100a? I just today ordered a Sanken CS3e and was worried it woundn't be hot enough looking at the specs of the output. I'm no expert though. What is the sensitivity of the ME67? Finding any real specs for sound on the DVX100a is impossible in my experience so I just went for the best mic for my application and was gonna go from there. -->>>

Ian,

Part of why I say the ME67/K6 is so hot is because folks more experienced than me say that. I know that isn't much to go on but rest assured, these folks know what they are referring to. If you go to www.kenstone.net and look at his Final Cut Pro section, he has an article about low-cost shotgun mics. The hot output of the K6 is mentioned there. Also, you can do a search for ME66/ME67/K6 at www.2-pop.com under the production audio board and you'll see many threads about this.

Also, Sennheiser makes the K6 in an attenuated version called the K6 CL. That module is specifically designed for DV cameras and one would assume that if Sennheiser makes an attenuated version, there must be a reason for it.

If you would like to hear what I refer to as audio that is overloading my DVX100, click below. That is a page about installing an exhaust on a Mach 1 mustang. At the bottom of the page is an MPEG 4 where you can hear two cars rev up an down. You may not be a car expert, but you can probably still hear the way the audio is distorting. You will need the latest Quicktime or Windows Media Player to view and hear the file.

http://www.rk-productions.net/mach1.html

Greg

July 1st, 2004, 05:01 AM	#1
Bogdan Apetri Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New York, USA Posts: 117	Two quick questions: DVX100A's "marker" and "-50/-60 mic sensitivity" So, quick as I promised: Is the "marker" option on the A model a reliable light meter? And, from 0 to 99, that means in fact the IRE values? What is the correspondence (if any)? Second, the -50 or -60 mic sensitivity... what is the nest to use with the Sennheiser ME67? Any ideas, people who have already tried this? Based on the mic's brochure, I would say use -50, but I'm no audio expert (yet...). Thanks a lot again! Bogdan PS This camera is very, very nice. I got the PAL one and if you twikle all things to your taste, it's amazing, I would say. For a miniDV camera, I should also add.

July 2nd, 2004, 12:34 AM	#2
Ken Tanaka Retired DV Info Net Almunus Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,943	Re: Two quick questions: DVX100A's "marker" and "-50/-60 mic sensitivity" Bogdan, >> Is the "marker" option on the A model a reliable light meter? And, from 0 to 99, that means in fact the IRE values? What is the correspondence (if any)? << I assume you mean the camera's spot-meter mode. Reliable? Well, yes, if you want to judge your exposure on a very specific area. I do not, however, believe that the index figures correspond to anything globally. I think they're just exposure values relative to the camera's internal system. I've not seen anything indicating that they refer to IRE or any other standard. I'll leave the ME67 question to someone else. I have a 67 but have never used it with my DVX100A. I -believe- -50 would be correct but do not know this authoritatively. Have fun! __________________ Lady X Films: A lady with a boring wardrobe...and a global mission. Hey, you don't have enough stuff! Buy with confidence from our sponsors. Hand-picked as the best in the business...Really! See some of my work one frame at a time: www.KenTanaka.com

July 6th, 2004, 07:38 AM	#3
Matt Gettemeier Major Player Join Date: May 2003 Location: St. Louis, Missouri Posts: 936	-50 has got to be the setting with the HOT Sennheiser mics... plug in your mic and point it at something noisy... I've got a DVX and I had an me66... it would blow the inputs at the drop of a hat... same goes for the AT4073a... If you just listen while the mic is pointed at a source, then switch the menu between the two (-50 and -60) you'll notice that the -60 is like turning the volume dial 90 degrees! Normal recording should leave the dials around center with some room to tweak up and down as needed... If you go to -60 then you'll be left with a few degrees of DOWN and 3/4ths of the dial to go UP.

July 8th, 2004, 11:58 AM	#4
Greg Matty Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Kirkland, WA Posts: 177	The K6 power module is way too hot for DV cameras. If you are in a loud environment, it is easy to overload the mic. You can hear my tests of this here: http://www.rk-productions.net/mach1.html You'll need QT 6 to view the MPEG4 but if you listen to the cars rev up and down, you can hear the audio distorting. Note that it won't register as clipping, but you'll the distortion. To solve this I have had two custom XLR cables built. One with a 10db attenuator and one with an 18. Sennheiser also sells the K6 as the K6CL which is also attenuated by 18db. However, if you ever upgrade camera's to a real pro model, you'll need to go back to the K6. The custom cables were made in Canada and cost about $50 Canadian shipped to my US address. You can also buy an Audio Technica in-line barrel attenuator but I prefer the cable method. I'll post the place where I had it made if you are interested. Greg

July 9th, 2004, 01:55 AM	#5
Bogdan Apetri Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New York, USA Posts: 117	Hmmmm... Thanks Greg... I must say I've noticed this myself. I bought the K6+ME67 for their well-know quality, but I didn't know they are so hot for the DVX100A. They are. Well, I was also lucky to have the Azden X-2 shotgun, and I've used it so far. But I'd like to be able to use the ME67 with the camera soon. How much would the Audio Technica in-line cost? I'm in Romania so far for the summer... any other solutions you might think of? Thanks for all the other replies, by the way... PS I have read (regarding my first questions) someplace else on the forum that the marker's values are indeed IRE values. Can anyone confirm?

July 9th, 2004, 07:58 AM	#6
Greg Matty Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Kirkland, WA Posts: 177	<<<-- Originally posted by Bogdan Apetri : Hmmmm... Thanks Greg... I must say I've noticed this myself. I bought the K6+ME67 for their well-know quality, but I didn't know they are so hot for the DVX100A. They are. Well, I was also lucky to have the Azden X-2 shotgun, and I've used it so far. But I'd like to be able to use the ME67 with the camera soon. How much would the Audio Technica in-line cost? I'm in Romania so far for the summer... any other solutions you might think of? Thanks for all the other replies, by the way... PS I have read (regarding my first questions) someplace else on the forum that the marker's values are indeed IRE values. Can anyone confirm? -->>> I bought the in-line barrel attenuator from B&H. If you search for their site for Audio Technica attenuator, it should bring it up. I don't know about Romania's economy or the status of any production houses, but the XL-R cable's I had made are probably pretty easy to fabricate. Maybe you could ask around. Just tell them you need a cable with a 10db pad and see what they say. What kind of project are you working on that takes you to Romania? Just curious. Greg

July 11th, 2004, 06:12 AM	#7
Bogdan Apetri Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New York, USA Posts: 117	Hey Gregg. I'm actually Romanian. I am a Graduate student at Columbia University's film school. I'm doing two summer projects here back home. I have bought the DVX100 and the ME67 from NY, together with other accessories, XLR cables etc. I will look at the Audio-Technica on B&H's web-site right now. Fortunately, my girlfriend (also Romanian, also Graduate student in NY but at the Med School) is coming back home this Thursday! If it's not too expensive, I will ask her to buy it :-) I'll let you know. Bogdan

July 13th, 2004, 04:17 AM	#8
Bogdan Apetri Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New York, USA Posts: 117	Gregg, I had my girlfriend buy the in-line XLR barrel. I should have it by this coming Friday. Costed about 50 bucks. I hope it's the right one, it attaches on both ends on XLR cables, right? It has 3 attenuator levels: -10, -20 and -30db. What is the level that you would recommend? Thanks! Bogdan

July 13th, 2004, 07:55 AM	#9
Greg Matty Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Kirkland, WA Posts: 177	Bogdan, That is the same one I use. I would NOT plug it into the camera as it is too easy to break off. Instead, plug it into the microphone and run an XLR cable from that to your DVX-100. For dialog and the like, I use the -10 db setting. If I am sampling louder sounds, like motocross bikes or loud cars, I use the -20db. It works well for me and I am sure you will be pleased. Greg Matty

July 13th, 2004, 01:14 PM	#10
Bogdan Apetri Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New York, USA Posts: 117	Greg, Thanks a lot for your advice, I will listen to it. I got an XLR splitter anyway, to feed both channels on my camera, one lower than the other. I will connect it one end on the camera, the other on the attenuator. I just hope too many XLR cables and connectors won't influence on the sound quality. And sorry for spelling your name with two Gs, previously... Bogdan

July 13th, 2004, 01:25 PM	#11
Ian Poirier Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Rhode Island Posts: 82	What makes the ME67 so hot for the DVX100a? I just today ordered a Sanken CS3e and was worried it woundn't be hot enough looking at the specs of the output. I'm no expert though. What is the sensitivity of the ME67? Finding any real specs for sound on the DVX100a is impossible in my experience so I just went for the best mic for my application and was gonna go from there.

July 13th, 2004, 07:59 PM	#12
Greg Matty Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Kirkland, WA Posts: 177	<<<-- Originally posted by Ian Poirier : What makes the ME67 so hot for the DVX100a? I just today ordered a Sanken CS3e and was worried it woundn't be hot enough looking at the specs of the output. I'm no expert though. What is the sensitivity of the ME67? Finding any real specs for sound on the DVX100a is impossible in my experience so I just went for the best mic for my application and was gonna go from there. -->>> Ian, Part of why I say the ME67/K6 is so hot is because folks more experienced than me say that. I know that isn't much to go on but rest assured, these folks know what they are referring to. If you go to www.kenstone.net and look at his Final Cut Pro section, he has an article about low-cost shotgun mics. The hot output of the K6 is mentioned there. Also, you can do a search for ME66/ME67/K6 at www.2-pop.com under the production audio board and you'll see many threads about this. Also, Sennheiser makes the K6 in an attenuated version called the K6 CL. That module is specifically designed for DV cameras and one would assume that if Sennheiser makes an attenuated version, there must be a reason for it. If you would like to hear what I refer to as audio that is overloading my DVX100, click below. That is a page about installing an exhaust on a Mach 1 mustang. At the bottom of the page is an MPEG 4 where you can hear two cars rev up an down. You may not be a car expert, but you can probably still hear the way the audio is distorting. You will need the latest Quicktime or Windows Media Player to view and hear the file. http://www.rk-productions.net/mach1.html Greg