24p questions

[John Jay]

filmstrip format is uncompressed, be prepared for humongous filesizes

[Liam Lawlor]

not a problem.. this will be for very brief clip rotoscoping. i just can't have any interlaced or blended frames to do motion study.

[John Jay]

does FCP output filmstrip?, I know Premiere does

[Liam Lawlor]

fcp has no filmstrip export option that i know of

[Russell Pond]

I'm starting work on this surreal, dreamlike sequence. In it, I want to run the speed a little slower than normal. Here's what I'd like to do. I'd like to shoot with the DVX100 at 30p and then slow it down by playing it back at 24p. So, here are my questions:

1. When the camera is set for 30p, does it really shoot exactly 30 frames per second or 29.97 fps? The DV format requires 29.97 fps, and I assume it plays back exactly 29.97 progressive frames per second. Is that correct?

2. Using After Effects or Final Cut Pro, does anyone know how to take 30 (or 29.97) progressive frames per second and play them back at 24 fps to slow down the speed? Interpret footage? Time remap?

Thanks,
Russell

[Bill Ravens]

Video actually plays back at exactly 30 FPS. The fact that the average framerate is 29.97 accounts for embedded data in the stream that's not video data, that still has to stay in sync with the audio track...but that's just a technicality.

VirtualDub and AviSynth have great frame rate subroutines. They will also telecine and do a 3;2 pulldown on the video. A great deal of the method of approach depends on whether you've acquire interlaced(60i) or progressive(24p). Avisynth will take a 60i datastream and convert it to 60p by making each field a frame.Once done, slowing the framerate to 24 frames per sec is rather trivial. In Vegas 4, a velocity envelope will change the framerate to whatever you wish. Dunno about AE. After slowing, a video resampling helps to remove the jitters.

[Todd Mattson]

So you're in Euless? I'm down in Austin. Anyway, that is one way to do slow motion, shooting 30P but bringing it into a 24P project. Another, and probably the best way, would be by using Twixtor, a plug in for After Effects. Twixtor, by interpolating entirely new frames in between existing frame, like a 3D program (tweening), creates most possibly the smoothest slow motion you can get for DV. That way you can slow it down by any speed you want to, and it will still look smooth, especially on locked down shots. Looks just as if you had overcranked on a film camera, without the stuttering effect of doubled up frames that most video slow motion has. If you're shooting 24P, do remember to remove the dummy frames first so that it will process the slow motion right. Also a neat tool for that weird just in case situation where you shot something 30P and need to change it back to 60i. It's definitely worth the $400.

[John Puffs]

Hi - I make surfing movies that are sold on DVD and VHS. Going to film is not something that is an issue for us. I currently shoot with an XL1S. With that considered what do any of you think of the DVX100 for surfing footage. Will the 24p produce a cleaner image? Is there a zoom extender for the DVX100. 10 times optical is not enough..

[Stephen van Vuuren]

I think the image is much cleaner than the XL1s and the progressive move produces nice images if you like the way film looks.

Per telephoto, Century Optics (www.centuryoptics.com) just started selling a 1.6X adapter, so that's as much as you can get.

[Todd Mattson]

waz12345,

Do remember though that this means fewer points of action, so sudden camera movements aren't going to look all that pretty. I would suggest watching some of the old surfing documentaries from the 60's and 70's for type of shots that will work best with 24 fps material....

[Jeff Donald]

The DVX100 with a 1.6X tele convertor is not near enough magnification for long range sports like surfing. The XL1, while perhaps not having the look of the DVX100 is capable of much greater magnification through the use of EF XL adapter. This allows you to put on the far superior Canon EOS EF 35mm lenses. You will still have optical image stabilization with several of the EOS lenses and magnification that will put you right in the action.

The DVX100 with a tele convertor will be a poor substitute. However, we all have budgets to live within. The ideal combination would be the EF adapter and the Canon 100-400 IS zoom. But your in the range of $2,000or so. For about $1,000 you can get the adapter and 70-300 IS zoom. There are links to footage with that combination if you search some of Steve Nunez posts. Also search surfing. That topic has been covered several times, but not in the context of the DVX100.

[Kevin Merker]

Info on outputing 24p or 24p advanced to SVCD. OK her I go. I have just shot my first 10 min. of 24p & 24p Advanced. I captured using an AG -DV2000 deck to Vegas 4 at 24 fps. I also captured ScLive, Premiere 6.5 and Avid ExpressDV 3.5 all at standard 29.97 ntsc. I did a side by side shoot with a Sony VX2000 in 29.97 ntsc. I could not believe the difference! The richness in color and the look of film was striking. I am so very happy that I didn't go with and XL1s for the interchangable lens. Though I still wish the zoom was a bit more powerful. But gladly give it up for the film look.

So how do I get the best SVCD out of a 24p or 24p advanced. footage. I use CCE SP 2.66 and Avisynth. In the past I would use this script on 29.97 720 x 480 source

LoadPlugin("decomb.dll")

DirectShowSource("AG-DVX100.avi")

BilinearResize(480,480)

Telecide(guide=1).Decimate(cycle=5)

ConvertToYUY2()

ResampleAudio(44100)

When I used Decimate() it would drop the frame rate to ntsc film rate 23.976 fps from 29.97 fps source. I would then do a pulldown to the m2v encoded file to bring the rate back up to 29.92 fps compliant SVCD frame rate.

But I am at 24p or 24p Advanced to start. Decimate(cycle=5) in the script made one hell of a difference in the outputted encode. So much that I would not think of not using it on a regular interlaced source. So here I am. Is this a truely non-interlaced capture that I get from Vegas Video 4? Can the decomb plugin, Telecide(guide=1).Decimate(cycle=5) help me with a better finished quality encode? What is the best way for me to use CCE SP 2.66 and Avisynth 2.50 for SVCD from 24 fps source?

Here is one for you experts that really know your stuff.


Thanks


Kevin

[John Klein]

http://www.panasonic.com/PBDS/subcat..._ag-dvc80.html

...and it's cheaper, too.

[Rob Easler]

I haven't found any place to buy it yet. I want to know it's street price and availability. I am shopping for a new cam now.

[Stephen van Vuuren]

DVX without 24p is like the chocolate cake without the chocolate...