Are there noticable picture quality differences between DVX100 & Canon XL-1? at DVinfo.net

Kathy Kegley-Moore · June 22nd, 2003, 10:41 AM

We currently own 2 Canon XL-1's and 1 Canon GL-1. I am selling my Canon GL-1 and am looking at purchasing the DVX100.

Question: Will I be able to tell a difference concerning the video quality between what was shot on the XL-1's to the DVX100?

Currently, we can tell a slight diff. between the XL-1's and GL-1's.

Any input, positive or negative, would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

Kathy

Chris Hurd · June 22nd, 2003, 11:09 AM

Hi Kathy,

You will notice a substantial difference between the XL1 and DVX100, primarily because the XL1 is built on 1997 technology and the DVX100 on 2002 technology. There's a five year difference between the cameras, which is a lifetime in the DV world. Video from the DVX100 will appear sharper and cleaner than the XL1. The "flavor" of the image will be different as well because the XL1 and DVX100 have different color signatures.

A similar difference exists between the XL1 and XL1S. However, they have identical color signatures and the XL1S can be "dialed down" within the internal menu to match the XL1 and GL1. Likewise, the same holds true with the GL2: same color as XL1 and GL1, can be dialed to match those older cams.

The DVX100 has an internal scene store and I'm pretty sure it can be set up to match the older cameras.

To answer your question, though, any newer 3-chip DV camcorder such as the DVX100, DVC80, XL1S, VX2000, TRV950 etc. will give you better, cleaner, sharper video than any older 3-chip DV camcorder such as the XL1, GL1, VX1000, TRV900, etc. Hope this helps,

Peter Jefferson · June 22nd, 2003, 11:16 AM

Yes.
picture resolution, depth of field (if auto) and lens configurations make a big difference..
the DVX give a sunburst flare whereas the Canon has a little more distortion with lens flares and rings.
The DVX has a built in wideangled lense which is a godsend as well...

also there is no canonflavoured image.. hard to describe, but when u see footage shot on an XL, u KNOW its an XL.. whereas with the DVX, it could easily pass of as something a little higher than what it is...
Wierd i know... but this is from a PAL perspective though and different units have diffrerent configs... so i would say the frame mode processing would most likely be a little more advanced than the XL due to age of each unit..

Oh and that would most likely go with low light comparisons and audio as well...

Im sure there are afew people here who have immediate access to both units and can outline it alot better than I, as im only goin with what i remember when i compared my footage to an XL1s...
the DVX DID look alot more "broadcasty" even when i wasnt trying...

Stephen van Vuuren · June 22nd, 2003, 12:03 PM

What about the GL2? Here's why you might want to go GL2...

If you have been shooting frame mode on your GL-1 and XL-1 and the shoot progessive 30P mode on the DVX100, the resolution improvement is huge. Not only to you get the 120 lines of vertical resolution back that the Canon's drop in frame mode, but you also get the sharper, better CCD's of the DVX100.

Particularly on wide shots, the difference would be noticable to even a casual user.

I would not mix XL1/GL1/XL1s/GL2 frame mode with DVX100 progressive mode (especially 24p) as a). it would be hard to dial the DVX100 down enough to match the Canons, and b), you would sell your Canons as well (as did I my XL1 and 3 lenses) and be a DVX100 head :)

If you have a large investment in XL1 accessories, etc. and plan on carrying them over to XL1s successor (I assume canon will allow you to - it would be foolish not to), I would buy a GL2 to replace the GL1.

If you only shoot 60i, then a PD150, JVC300, or DVC80 might be a possibility though the GL2 holds it's own against these cams.

But if frame mode is the reason you shoot with the canons, I would seriously consider jumping ship to true full rez progressive scan on the DVX100.

It's possible the new XL2 will offer this feature, but then again, nothing is for sure.

Chris Hurd · June 22nd, 2003, 12:39 PM

<< It's possible the new XL2 will offer this feature, but then again, nothing is for sure. >>

To this I would add, that if you have work to be shot now, then now is always the right time to buy. I can never recommend waiting for the "next big thing" whether it's the XL2 or whatever.

Kathy Kegley-Moore · June 22nd, 2003, 01:50 PM

Thank you for all the responses!

Well, here was our game plan. We just weren't happy with the GL-1 picture quality compared to our XL-1's. It was our third camera and very handy to grab and go while our other two remained set up.

We have a serious suitor for the GL-1 so we were going to upgrade to this Panasonic. Obviously, this is more than a simple upgrade. We have read about how this camera is great and fantastic, but maybe we need to rethink and dump our XL-1's too.

I know 2 XL-1's and 1 GL-1 would cover the price of 2 new DVX100's and some accessories.

Hmmmm......

Kathy

Glen Elliott · June 22nd, 2003, 08:42 PM

I actually shot a wedding with my DVX along side with my friends XL-1s. I always loved the results the XL-1s yielded untill I tried to intercut with my DVX footage. There is a huge difference in "quality" if thats what you wanna call it. For one the color representation is way different from the DVX's. Canon tends to yeild brighter move vivid colors. My DVX had more muted, accurate, colors and a softer gamma curve (though all that can be adjusted in camera). The XL-1S seemed to have more saturation and contrast overall but lacked a great deal of detail when compared side by side with the DVX's shots. It litterally looked like the shots where a hair out of focus comparitve to the ultra sharp DVX shots.

I'm thinking it's better to shoot with my GL-1 along side of my friend's XL-1s next time. They seemed to match up better in terms of the overal look regarding tonality and clarity.
You have no idea what your missing until you stack footage shot at the same location back to back. Has anyone else had the opportunity to do this with XL1 and DVX footage. Tell me I'm not crazy for thinking so!

June 22nd, 2003, 10:41 AM	#1
Kathy Kegley-Moore Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Fredericktown, Missouri Posts: 47	Are there noticable picture quality differences between DVX100 & Canon XL-1? We currently own 2 Canon XL-1's and 1 Canon GL-1. I am selling my Canon GL-1 and am looking at purchasing the DVX100. Question: Will I be able to tell a difference concerning the video quality between what was shot on the XL-1's to the DVX100? Currently, we can tell a slight diff. between the XL-1's and GL-1's. Any input, positive or negative, would be greatly appreciated. Thank you, Kathy

June 22nd, 2003, 11:09 AM	#2
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	Hi Kathy, You will notice a substantial difference between the XL1 and DVX100, primarily because the XL1 is built on 1997 technology and the DVX100 on 2002 technology. There's a five year difference between the cameras, which is a lifetime in the DV world. Video from the DVX100 will appear sharper and cleaner than the XL1. The "flavor" of the image will be different as well because the XL1 and DVX100 have different color signatures. A similar difference exists between the XL1 and XL1S. However, they have identical color signatures and the XL1S can be "dialed down" within the internal menu to match the XL1 and GL1. Likewise, the same holds true with the GL2: same color as XL1 and GL1, can be dialed to match those older cams. The DVX100 has an internal scene store and I'm pretty sure it can be set up to match the older cameras. To answer your question, though, any newer 3-chip DV camcorder such as the DVX100, DVC80, XL1S, VX2000, TRV950 etc. will give you better, cleaner, sharper video than any older 3-chip DV camcorder such as the XL1, GL1, VX1000, TRV900, etc. Hope this helps, __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

June 22nd, 2003, 12:03 PM	#4
Stephen van Vuuren Space Hipster Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Greensboro, NC Posts: 1,508	What about the GL2? Here's why you might want to go GL2... If you have been shooting frame mode on your GL-1 and XL-1 and the shoot progessive 30P mode on the DVX100, the resolution improvement is huge. Not only to you get the 120 lines of vertical resolution back that the Canon's drop in frame mode, but you also get the sharper, better CCD's of the DVX100. Particularly on wide shots, the difference would be noticable to even a casual user. I would not mix XL1/GL1/XL1s/GL2 frame mode with DVX100 progressive mode (especially 24p) as a). it would be hard to dial the DVX100 down enough to match the Canons, and b), you would sell your Canons as well (as did I my XL1 and 3 lenses) and be a DVX100 head :) If you have a large investment in XL1 accessories, etc. and plan on carrying them over to XL1s successor (I assume canon will allow you to - it would be foolish not to), I would buy a GL2 to replace the GL1. If you only shoot 60i, then a PD150, JVC300, or DVC80 might be a possibility though the GL2 holds it's own against these cams. But if frame mode is the reason you shoot with the canons, I would seriously consider jumping ship to true full rez progressive scan on the DVX100. It's possible the new XL2 will offer this feature, but then again, nothing is for sure. __________________ stephen v2 www.insaturnsrings.com

June 22nd, 2003, 12:39 PM	#5
Chris Hurd Obstreperous Rex Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: San Marcos, TX Posts: 27,368 Images: 513	<< It's possible the new XL2 will offer this feature, but then again, nothing is for sure. >> To this I would add, that if you have work to be shot now, then now is always the right time to buy. I can never recommend waiting for the "next big thing" whether it's the XL2 or whatever. __________________ CH Search DV Info Net \| 20 years of DVi \| ...Tuesday is Soylent Green Day!

June 22nd, 2003, 01:50 PM	#6
Kathy Kegley-Moore Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Fredericktown, Missouri Posts: 47	WoW! Thank you for all the responses! Well, here was our game plan. We just weren't happy with the GL-1 picture quality compared to our XL-1's. It was our third camera and very handy to grab and go while our other two remained set up. We have a serious suitor for the GL-1 so we were going to upgrade to this Panasonic. Obviously, this is more than a simple upgrade. We have read about how this camera is great and fantastic, but maybe we need to rethink and dump our XL-1's too. I know 2 XL-1's and 1 GL-1 would cover the price of 2 new DVX100's and some accessories. Hmmmm...... Kathy

June 22nd, 2003, 11:16 AM	#3
Peter Jefferson Inner Circle Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Aus Posts: 3,884	Yes. picture resolution, depth of field (if auto) and lens configurations make a big difference.. the DVX give a sunburst flare whereas the Canon has a little more distortion with lens flares and rings. The DVX has a built in wideangled lense which is a godsend as well... also there is no canonflavoured image.. hard to describe, but when u see footage shot on an XL, u KNOW its an XL.. whereas with the DVX, it could easily pass of as something a little higher than what it is... Wierd i know... but this is from a PAL perspective though and different units have diffrerent configs... so i would say the frame mode processing would most likely be a little more advanced than the XL due to age of each unit.. Oh and that would most likely go with low light comparisons and audio as well... Im sure there are afew people here who have immediate access to both units and can outline it alot better than I, as im only goin with what i remember when i compared my footage to an XL1s... the DVX DID look alot more "broadcasty" even when i wasnt trying...

June 22nd, 2003, 08:42 PM	#7
Glen Elliott Wrangler Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 2,898	I actually shot a wedding with my DVX along side with my friends XL-1s. I always loved the results the XL-1s yielded untill I tried to intercut with my DVX footage. There is a huge difference in "quality" if thats what you wanna call it. For one the color representation is way different from the DVX's. Canon tends to yeild brighter move vivid colors. My DVX had more muted, accurate, colors and a softer gamma curve (though all that can be adjusted in camera). The XL-1S seemed to have more saturation and contrast overall but lacked a great deal of detail when compared side by side with the DVX's shots. It litterally looked like the shots where a hair out of focus comparitve to the ultra sharp DVX shots. I'm thinking it's better to shoot with my GL-1 along side of my friend's XL-1s next time. They seemed to match up better in terms of the overal look regarding tonality and clarity. You have no idea what your missing until you stack footage shot at the same location back to back. Has anyone else had the opportunity to do this with XL1 and DVX footage. Tell me I'm not crazy for thinking so!