Advice needed on a MX500 / PV-DV953 Purchase at DVinfo.net

Adam Folickman · November 29th, 2003, 02:28 PM

Hello everybody,

I need some advice on a purchse I will make in the next week.

I live in the USA so it is a NTSC country.

However, I am currently in Europe and will be here for the next 6 months or more.

If I can buy a PAL MX 500 for around the same price as a PV-DV953 (NTSC), are there any advantages in buying the MX 500 ?

In the future, I plan to transfer all my DV tapes to my notebok computer and burn DVDs. Can I do this with a PAL MX500 and then watch the DVDs on a NTSC DVD player and NTSC television ?

Or would I have to use a NTSC/PAL DVD player and NTSC/DVD television ?

Any advice is appreciated....

Adam Folickman · November 29th, 2003, 02:32 PM

Mistake made on the second to last line.

I meant to say:

Or would I have to use a NTSC/PAL DVD player and NTSC/PAL television ?

Frank Granovski · November 29th, 2003, 03:41 PM

Hopefully someone will address your concerns. If not, I'll post late this evening. I've got 6 VCRs working on over-time right now. I just popped in to see what's up.

Frank Granovski · November 30th, 2003, 04:08 AM

That's a tough question(s). Are you planning to keep this PAL DVD footage for yourself? If that is the case, and you start with PAL, then all you would need is a DVD player that reads the different regional codes and/or PAL/NTSC. This way your NTSC television will be able to view the PAL DVDs created.

Once you move back to the USA with your PAL MX500, you will other issues, such as lighting created flickering, and incompatibility with some eqiupment (monitors, some lower-end software).

Some people have expressed that they prefer shooting PAL and in frame mode for their DVDs, even though they live in an NTSC region.

On the other hand, NTSC is usually not an issue in Europe since many TVS, VCRs etc are multi-system.

I don't know what else to suggest in your case other than if it were me, I would buy a PAL cam while I lived in Europe (but planned to eventually come back to N.A.).

Adam Folickman · November 30th, 2003, 08:43 AM

Frank,

The DVD footage would be for my own personal use here in Europe and then when I return to the USA.

I am probably going to buy a PANASONIC portable DVD player (LX9). This is a PAL/NTSC all-region DVD player.

Something I don't quite understand is, if I transfer PAL DV footage (from the MX500) to a computer and burn a DVD, is that DVD created in a PAL format or NTSC format ?

I have bought DVDs here in Europe, then played them back in the USA on my NTSC DVD player and NTSC TV and had no problem. The DVDs however were all region DVDs. They would have to be to play in North America (region 1). I don't understand if these DVDs would be PAL format or NTSC format. They were actually made in Germany so my guess is PAL.

If my DV footage was created in PAL format and played on a multi system all-region DVD player, or played directly from the MX500 into the TV, wouldn't my TV (back in the USA) also need to support both PAL and NTSC ?

I don't quite understand what you meant with "you will other issues, such as lighting created flickering, and incompatibility with some eqiupment (monitors, some lower-end software)".

Do you mean I could have these problems on a NTSC only TV back in the USA ?

Thanks for the response.

Adam

Guy Bruner · November 30th, 2003, 03:35 PM

Adam,
If you capture the footage in PAL, you will create a PAL DVD unless you convert it to NTSC. PAL captures video at 25 frames per second (FPS) (50 fields/second interlaced) while NTSC captures video at 30 FPS (60 fields/second interlaced). It takes some special software to make the conversion. You might want to check here for more information on how to convert using a PC and freeware.

I'm not sure how you got a PAL DVD to play on an NTSC TV unless you used a DVD player that could output PAL and your TV was a PC monitor.

Frank Granovski · November 30th, 2003, 03:59 PM

You won't need a PAL TV to view PAL DVDs with a multi-ststem DVD player. It does the conversion for you as the DVD is played.

Some lower end software only edits PAL or NTSC and not both.

Shooting PAL indoors with house-hold lighting in NTSC land will cause flicking or pulses in your video; and it looks awful.

Bogdan Vaglarov · November 30th, 2003, 06:40 PM

Check out this thread discussing the International DVD distribution:

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17029

If you purchased Region 1 DVD it should be originally NTSC for USA - nothing written on the case?

After research on the net it seems there are much more DVDs even in Japan that can play both NTSC and PAL (on NTSC TV) including the brand names. Other can be made region free or even macro free (free of Macrovision or other protection). I found good page explaining all the possibilities but it's in Japanese for Japanese market players.

Frank Granovski · November 30th, 2003, 07:16 PM

I can always give you a list of good makes/models of multi-system/region free DVD players, if you want. There is a shop not too far from where I live that sells them, so I can easily find out.

Adam Folickman · December 1st, 2003, 02:06 AM

Thanks guys.

Frank,

"Some lower end software only edits PAL or NTSC and not both "
and especially "Shooting PAL indoors with house-hold lighting in NTSC land will cause flicking or pulses in your video; and it looks awful."

Sounds like more trouble than it is worth to buy a PAL camcorder if I live in NTSC land over the long-term....

What Bogdan said about DVDs playing on both PAL and NTSC is true from my expierence.

How can this be done ? I would have tended to agree with what Guy said ("If you capture the footage in PAL, you will create a PAL DVD unless you convert it to NTSC").

The DVDs I bought in Europe on the plastic case say "All Regions" but do not specify specifically PAL or NTSC.

Frank, if you happen to have handy a list of Multi System, Multi Region DVD players (or know of a link where I could find more info) that would help me out.

Thanks.

Adam

Frank Granovski · December 1st, 2003, 04:50 AM

Adam, I'll post tomorrow with some recommended models. I have to call the local specialist on this one.

Guy Bruner · December 1st, 2003, 08:40 AM

Adam,
If you record your footage in PAL, then the DVD will be in PAL format (25 FPS). Since PAL is close to film (24 FPS), it is possible to do 3:2 pulldown with the right DVD player and play the video on NTSC TVs. I suspect this is what is happening.

BTW, the Region codes are only applicable to commercial DVDs. What you produce at home can be played anywhere.

Carlos E. Martinez · December 1st, 2003, 09:33 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Frank Granovski :
Shooting PAL indoors with house-hold lighting in NTSC land will cause flicking or pulses in your video; and it looks awful. -->>>

That will only happen if the house-hold lights are fluorescent. Regular incandescents, which I think are the most used ones, are no problem whatever the country frequency.

There are also some high frequency fluorescents that cause no flicker.

Carlos

Frank Granovski · December 1st, 2003, 05:14 PM

A good multi-system/regional free DVD player is the Phillips model #616 - international version. This unit comes with a 1-year international warranty. It can be used with any NTSC and PAL TV (it does not require a multi-system TV, like with many other players). The price is also very good. It costs $200 Canadian at the dealer here in Vancouver. IN USA Dollars, that would be about $150. This dealer ships internationally as well. Here is the info:

Foreign Electronics
Vancouver, BC
Ph: 604.879.1189
E-mail: foreign@telus.net - for full details and/or concerns.

PS: I've bought from them before. They are an excellent dealer. They also sell PAL cams with international warranties (and with English menus)

Adam Folickman · December 3rd, 2003, 02:28 AM

Thanks for the info Frank.

I decided to purchase the NTSC PV-DV953.

By the way, if anybody is interested, B & H just dropped their price $100 yesterday on the DV953. It is now at $1099.

Thanks to everybody on this forum who have been helpful.

November 29th, 2003, 02:28 PM	#1
Adam Folickman Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New Hampshire, USA Posts: 125	Advice needed on a MX500 / PV-DV953 Purchase Hello everybody, I need some advice on a purchse I will make in the next week. I live in the USA so it is a NTSC country. However, I am currently in Europe and will be here for the next 6 months or more. If I can buy a PAL MX 500 for around the same price as a PV-DV953 (NTSC), are there any advantages in buying the MX 500 ? In the future, I plan to transfer all my DV tapes to my notebok computer and burn DVDs. Can I do this with a PAL MX500 and then watch the DVDs on a NTSC DVD player and NTSC television ? Or would I have to use a NTSC/PAL DVD player and NTSC/DVD television ? Any advice is appreciated....

November 29th, 2003, 02:32 PM	#2
Adam Folickman Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New Hampshire, USA Posts: 125	Mistake made on the second to last line. I meant to say: Or would I have to use a NTSC/PAL DVD player and NTSC/PAL television ?

November 29th, 2003, 03:41 PM	#3
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	Hopefully someone will address your concerns. If not, I'll post late this evening. I've got 6 VCRs working on over-time right now. I just popped in to see what's up.

November 30th, 2003, 04:08 AM	#4
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	That's a tough question(s). Are you planning to keep this PAL DVD footage for yourself? If that is the case, and you start with PAL, then all you would need is a DVD player that reads the different regional codes and/or PAL/NTSC. This way your NTSC television will be able to view the PAL DVDs created. Once you move back to the USA with your PAL MX500, you will other issues, such as lighting created flickering, and incompatibility with some eqiupment (monitors, some lower-end software). Some people have expressed that they prefer shooting PAL and in frame mode for their DVDs, even though they live in an NTSC region. On the other hand, NTSC is usually not an issue in Europe since many TVS, VCRs etc are multi-system. I don't know what else to suggest in your case other than if it were me, I would buy a PAL cam while I lived in Europe (but planned to eventually come back to N.A.).

November 30th, 2003, 08:43 AM	#5
Adam Folickman Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New Hampshire, USA Posts: 125	Frank, The DVD footage would be for my own personal use here in Europe and then when I return to the USA. I am probably going to buy a PANASONIC portable DVD player (LX9). This is a PAL/NTSC all-region DVD player. Something I don't quite understand is, if I transfer PAL DV footage (from the MX500) to a computer and burn a DVD, is that DVD created in a PAL format or NTSC format ? I have bought DVDs here in Europe, then played them back in the USA on my NTSC DVD player and NTSC TV and had no problem. The DVDs however were all region DVDs. They would have to be to play in North America (region 1). I don't understand if these DVDs would be PAL format or NTSC format. They were actually made in Germany so my guess is PAL. If my DV footage was created in PAL format and played on a multi system all-region DVD player, or played directly from the MX500 into the TV, wouldn't my TV (back in the USA) also need to support both PAL and NTSC ? I don't quite understand what you meant with "you will other issues, such as lighting created flickering, and incompatibility with some eqiupment (monitors, some lower-end software)". Do you mean I could have these problems on a NTSC only TV back in the USA ? Thanks for the response. Adam

November 30th, 2003, 03:35 PM	#6
Guy Bruner Major Player Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Ashford, AL Posts: 937	Adam, If you capture the footage in PAL, you will create a PAL DVD unless you convert it to NTSC. PAL captures video at 25 frames per second (FPS) (50 fields/second interlaced) while NTSC captures video at 30 FPS (60 fields/second interlaced). It takes some special software to make the conversion. You might want to check here for more information on how to convert using a PC and freeware. I'm not sure how you got a PAL DVD to play on an NTSC TV unless you used a DVD player that could output PAL and your TV was a PC monitor.

November 30th, 2003, 03:59 PM	#7
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	You won't need a PAL TV to view PAL DVDs with a multi-ststem DVD player. It does the conversion for you as the DVD is played. Some lower end software only edits PAL or NTSC and not both. Shooting PAL indoors with house-hold lighting in NTSC land will cause flicking or pulses in your video; and it looks awful.

November 30th, 2003, 06:40 PM	#8
Bogdan Vaglarov Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Yokohama, Japan Posts: 366	Check out this thread discussing the International DVD distribution: http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17029 If you purchased Region 1 DVD it should be originally NTSC for USA - nothing written on the case? After research on the net it seems there are much more DVDs even in Japan that can play both NTSC and PAL (on NTSC TV) including the brand names. Other can be made region free or even macro free (free of Macrovision or other protection). I found good page explaining all the possibilities but it's in Japanese for Japanese market players.

November 30th, 2003, 07:16 PM	#9
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	I can always give you a list of good makes/models of multi-system/region free DVD players, if you want. There is a shop not too far from where I live that sells them, so I can easily find out.

December 1st, 2003, 02:06 AM	#10
Adam Folickman Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New Hampshire, USA Posts: 125	Thanks guys. Frank, "Some lower end software only edits PAL or NTSC and not both " and especially "Shooting PAL indoors with house-hold lighting in NTSC land will cause flicking or pulses in your video; and it looks awful." Sounds like more trouble than it is worth to buy a PAL camcorder if I live in NTSC land over the long-term.... What Bogdan said about DVDs playing on both PAL and NTSC is true from my expierence. How can this be done ? I would have tended to agree with what Guy said ("If you capture the footage in PAL, you will create a PAL DVD unless you convert it to NTSC"). The DVDs I bought in Europe on the plastic case say "All Regions" but do not specify specifically PAL or NTSC. Frank, if you happen to have handy a list of Multi System, Multi Region DVD players (or know of a link where I could find more info) that would help me out. Thanks. Adam

December 1st, 2003, 04:50 AM	#11
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	Adam, I'll post tomorrow with some recommended models. I have to call the local specialist on this one.

December 1st, 2003, 08:40 AM	#12
Guy Bruner Major Player Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Ashford, AL Posts: 937	Adam, If you record your footage in PAL, then the DVD will be in PAL format (25 FPS). Since PAL is close to film (24 FPS), it is possible to do 3:2 pulldown with the right DVD player and play the video on NTSC TVs. I suspect this is what is happening. BTW, the Region codes are only applicable to commercial DVDs. What you produce at home can be played anywhere.

December 1st, 2003, 09:33 AM	#13
Carlos E. Martinez Trustee Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Rio de Janeiro, Brasil Posts: 1,138	<<<-- Originally posted by Frank Granovski : Shooting PAL indoors with house-hold lighting in NTSC land will cause flicking or pulses in your video; and it looks awful. -->>> That will only happen if the house-hold lights are fluorescent. Regular incandescents, which I think are the most used ones, are no problem whatever the country frequency. There are also some high frequency fluorescents that cause no flicker. Carlos

December 1st, 2003, 05:14 PM	#14
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	A good multi-system/regional free DVD player is the Phillips model #616 - international version. This unit comes with a 1-year international warranty. It can be used with any NTSC and PAL TV (it does not require a multi-system TV, like with many other players). The price is also very good. It costs $200 Canadian at the dealer here in Vancouver. IN USA Dollars, that would be about $150. This dealer ships internationally as well. Here is the info: Foreign Electronics Vancouver, BC Ph: 604.879.1189 E-mail: foreign@telus.net - for full details and/or concerns. PS: I've bought from them before. They are an excellent dealer. They also sell PAL cams with international warranties (and with English menus)

December 3rd, 2003, 02:28 AM	#15
Adam Folickman Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: New Hampshire, USA Posts: 125	Thanks for the info Frank. I decided to purchase the NTSC PV-DV953. By the way, if anybody is interested, B & H just dropped their price $100 yesterday on the DV953. It is now at $1099. Thanks to everybody on this forum who have been helpful.