First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo

Lou Bruno · November 9th, 2012, 05:07 PM

I have mine a few days now....lots to learn. Different than my AG AC-130 due to the touch screen menus.

Check out a very fast test....look at the lowlight capability....no electronic grain.

Noa Put · November 9th, 2012, 06:27 PM

How does it compare to your ac130 Lou? Does it have less noise at higher gains and can it produce a cleaner image in very lowlight?
The youtube compression doesn't show it that good but how is the highlight handling, I saw that in the snow recording the highlights in the snow seemed blown out.

Chris Harding · November 9th, 2012, 07:39 PM

Hi Noa

The big difference with this camera is the backlit sensors and a very efficient noise reduction!! The image is actually remarkably sharp at 24 db gain (which on my HMC's would be full of noise) and according to Barry Green who is writing the AC-90 book and has done tests (obviously) on the camera the image at 30db is quite usuable ..it's still noise free which is amazing but the image does go a little soft at that gain.

I don't think I could even use footage that I shot on my HMC's at 30db gain (I start getting unacceptable noise from 18db upwards) so the low light is going to be a big selling point.

When the PAL models come out I will definately grab one and use it for my Realty shoots as it's less tiring than the shoulder mount cameras and then I can also try it at a dull and dingy wedding reception. As you already know receptions are the pits for low light so I think the 90 with an LED light just to brighten the highlights will be pretty magic. So far all that have one have had no negative comments at all which is brilliant.

It would be interesting to see how it performs against your little Sony (there has been rumours that they use sensors from Sony but that's only a rumour!!)

Chris

Lou Bruno · November 10th, 2012, 06:48 AM

The 130 appears to be sharper in higher gain but the AC-90 has No visible grain in the lowlight conditions albeit somewhat softer. The 130 is not menu driven like the 90. Personally, I will probably use the 90 more due to the size and form factor. However, I think the 130 is a more pro camera. Both cameras compliment each other. It is really a tough call.

The snow blew out as I had it on auto while trudging through the snow. I am a manual shooter and use my zebras. I also think this camera may need an external ND filter by virtue of the small chips vs. contrast.

Btw: No time stamp for legal use. No way to save scene files to a SD card. No way to write the name of the scene files either. Basically. This camera is the little brother.

Lou Bruno · November 14th, 2012, 06:40 PM

Chris Harding · November 15th, 2012, 02:02 AM

Hi Lou

Brilliant fall footage there!! I do notice that the background trees in the wide shots seem to look "smudgy" and the big expanses of lawn also look the same...I'm assuming that on original footage they are sharp as a tack and the effect is simply YouTube compression???

The stabilizer certainly works well doesn't it?? I could almost ditch my stedicam and just handhold the camera for walking movement shots..on a rig it would probably be even smoother as the OIS wouldn't need to work so hard!!

Nice test!!

Chris

Lou Bruno · November 16th, 2012, 08:06 AM

LOL! I knew someone would pick the smudge. My fault. That was my fingerprint on the ND filter. I saw that during editing. With that said. I think half of visual issues is associated with YOU TUBE compression.

I also deinterlaced the 60i. I will try to post true progressive in the future @60P.

Tim Akin · November 16th, 2012, 04:49 PM

lol I thought it was my 10 year old laptop.

Chris Harding · November 16th, 2012, 09:52 PM

Hi Lou

Were your scene files set at default or did you tweak them first? I found using the 130 on F1 (at default) with everything set to zero as the camera is shipped the image is really awful!!!

The thing that still concerns me greatly is recording live music that's LOUD!! With the AC-130 set on ALC the level is simply kept high and the audio board just clips the top of the waveform ..All the HMC cams actually reduce the signal without clipping set on auto level. On ALC the 130 audio really sucks big time and at weddings trying to keep a manual level with constantly varying ambient and music levels is almost impossible. If the 90 uses the same audio ALC as the 130 then it's a no go in my books as I don't want clipped audio during the dancing!!

Chris

Lou Bruno · November 17th, 2012, 07:03 AM

I used STYLIN. A custom setting located on the Panny website or the 130.

The first scene file or the default setting is muted to allow correction in post.

Robert Rinkewich · December 20th, 2012, 04:29 PM

Hi,

Can anyone tell me when you set the AC90 to Standard Def, what type of file is created? Mpeg2? etc.

Thanks
Rob

Chris Harding · December 20th, 2012, 10:35 PM

Hi Rob

I looked on my suppliers site and it just lists the format as 9mbps AVCHD ..surely that's not correct??
My HMC82's do SD and the files on the card are AVI and they are huge ..a lot bigger than the AVCHD files

I think Sony tend to use MPEG for their cameras that shoot HD/SD but so far Panasonics all should be AVI files ..then again the AC-90 might be different!

Chris

Tim Akin · December 21st, 2012, 07:54 AM

Robert, I thought it was mpeg but I just looked it up in the manual and the way it reads it's AVCHD.

Tim

Robert Rinkewich · December 21st, 2012, 08:27 PM

Thanks Tim. I thought that might be the case. Im basically looking for a camera in the $2000 range that can record Standard def wide screen to an mpeg2 file. And has two SD slots. I currently use a Sony nx5u and need a backup for it. All the Sony cameras in the $2000 and under record in mpeg2 but have only 1 sd slot

Thanks
Rob

Phil Gadd · January 30th, 2013, 02:40 AM

Hi Guys

After speaking to Chris (on another forum thread), I am really liking the look of this camera. Am I to assume that my Rode videomic pro cannot be used with this camera (or can i use a converting connector to xlr)?

Also, will I need to purchase any accessories i.e. the suppliers website has 32gb SDHC cards at £135 which seems a little expensive to me?

I need a quick purchase and turnaround as I may have to use this in 2 weeks time for interviews (indoor)

Thanks

PS forgot to say, I have a zoom H4N so maybe I could use that on the camera to record audio and sync it with internal audio in post edit?

November 9th, 2012, 05:07 PM	#16
Lou Bruno Go Cycle Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Huntington, NY Posts: 815	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo I have mine a few days now....lots to learn. Different than my AG AC-130 due to the touch screen menus. Check out a very fast test....look at the lowlight capability....no electronic grain. Panasonic AG AC-90 Test - YouTube __________________ Lou Bruno

November 9th, 2012, 06:27 PM	#17
Noa Put Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Belgium Posts: 9,510	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo How does it compare to your ac130 Lou? Does it have less noise at higher gains and can it produce a cleaner image in very lowlight? The youtube compression doesn't show it that good but how is the highlight handling, I saw that in the snow recording the highlights in the snow seemed blown out.

November 9th, 2012, 07:39 PM	#18
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Hi Noa The big difference with this camera is the backlit sensors and a very efficient noise reduction!! The image is actually remarkably sharp at 24 db gain (which on my HMC's would be full of noise) and according to Barry Green who is writing the AC-90 book and has done tests (obviously) on the camera the image at 30db is quite usuable ..it's still noise free which is amazing but the image does go a little soft at that gain. I don't think I could even use footage that I shot on my HMC's at 30db gain (I start getting unacceptable noise from 18db upwards) so the low light is going to be a big selling point. When the PAL models come out I will definately grab one and use it for my Realty shoots as it's less tiring than the shoulder mount cameras and then I can also try it at a dull and dingy wedding reception. As you already know receptions are the pits for low light so I think the 90 with an LED light just to brighten the highlights will be pretty magic. So far all that have one have had no negative comments at all which is brilliant. It would be interesting to see how it performs against your little Sony (there has been rumours that they use sensors from Sony but that's only a rumour!!) Chris

November 10th, 2012, 06:48 AM	#19
Lou Bruno Go Cycle Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Huntington, NY Posts: 815	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo The 130 appears to be sharper in higher gain but the AC-90 has No visible grain in the lowlight conditions albeit somewhat softer. The 130 is not menu driven like the 90. Personally, I will probably use the 90 more due to the size and form factor. However, I think the 130 is a more pro camera. Both cameras compliment each other. It is really a tough call. The snow blew out as I had it on auto while trudging through the snow. I am a manual shooter and use my zebras. I also think this camera may need an external ND filter by virtue of the small chips vs. contrast. Btw: No time stamp for legal use. No way to save scene files to a SD card. No way to write the name of the scene files either. Basically. This camera is the little brother. __________________ Lou Bruno

November 14th, 2012, 06:40 PM	#20
Lou Bruno Go Cycle Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Huntington, NY Posts: 815	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Panasonic AG AC-90 Field Test - YouTube __________________ Lou Bruno

November 15th, 2012, 02:02 AM	#21
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Hi Lou Brilliant fall footage there!! I do notice that the background trees in the wide shots seem to look "smudgy" and the big expanses of lawn also look the same...I'm assuming that on original footage they are sharp as a tack and the effect is simply YouTube compression??? The stabilizer certainly works well doesn't it?? I could almost ditch my stedicam and just handhold the camera for walking movement shots..on a rig it would probably be even smoother as the OIS wouldn't need to work so hard!! Nice test!! Chris

November 16th, 2012, 08:06 AM	#22
Lou Bruno Go Cycle Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Huntington, NY Posts: 815	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo LOL! I knew someone would pick the smudge. My fault. That was my fingerprint on the ND filter. I saw that during editing. With that said. I think half of visual issues is associated with YOU TUBE compression. I also deinterlaced the 60i. I will try to post true progressive in the future @60P. __________________ Lou Bruno

November 16th, 2012, 04:49 PM	#23
Tim Akin Major Player Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Newbern, TN Posts: 414	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo lol I thought it was my 10 year old laptop. __________________ Tim

November 16th, 2012, 09:52 PM	#24
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Hi Lou Were your scene files set at default or did you tweak them first? I found using the 130 on F1 (at default) with everything set to zero as the camera is shipped the image is really awful!!! The thing that still concerns me greatly is recording live music that's LOUD!! With the AC-130 set on ALC the level is simply kept high and the audio board just clips the top of the waveform ..All the HMC cams actually reduce the signal without clipping set on auto level. On ALC the 130 audio really sucks big time and at weddings trying to keep a manual level with constantly varying ambient and music levels is almost impossible. If the 90 uses the same audio ALC as the 130 then it's a no go in my books as I don't want clipped audio during the dancing!! Chris

November 17th, 2012, 07:03 AM	#25
Lou Bruno Go Cycle Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Huntington, NY Posts: 815	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo I used STYLIN. A custom setting located on the Panny website or the 130. The first scene file or the default setting is muted to allow correction in post. __________________ Lou Bruno

December 20th, 2012, 04:29 PM	#26
Robert Rinkewich Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 46	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Hi, Can anyone tell me when you set the AC90 to Standard Def, what type of file is created? Mpeg2? etc. Thanks Rob

December 20th, 2012, 10:35 PM	#27
Chris Harding Inner Circle Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 8,441	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Hi Rob I looked on my suppliers site and it just lists the format as 9mbps AVCHD ..surely that's not correct?? My HMC82's do SD and the files on the card are AVI and they are huge ..a lot bigger than the AVCHD files I think Sony tend to use MPEG for their cameras that shoot HD/SD but so far Panasonics all should be AVI files ..then again the AC-90 might be different! Chris

December 21st, 2012, 07:54 AM	#28
Tim Akin Major Player Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Newbern, TN Posts: 414	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Robert, I thought it was mpeg but I just looked it up in the manual and the way it reads it's AVCHD. Tim __________________ Tim

December 21st, 2012, 08:27 PM	#29
Robert Rinkewich Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 46	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Thanks Tim. I thought that might be the case. Im basically looking for a camera in the $2000 range that can record Standard def wide screen to an mpeg2 file. And has two SD slots. I currently use a Sony nx5u and need a backup for it. All the Sony cameras in the $2000 and under record in mpeg2 but have only 1 sd slot Thanks Rob

January 30th, 2013, 02:40 AM	#30
Phil Gadd Regular Crew Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: liverpool, England Posts: 143	Re: First Look, Panasonic AG-AC90 at DV Expo Hi Guys After speaking to Chris (on another forum thread), I am really liking the look of this camera. Am I to assume that my Rode videomic pro cannot be used with this camera (or can i use a converting connector to xlr)? Also, will I need to purchase any accessories i.e. the suppliers website has 32gb SDHC cards at £135 which seems a little expensive to me? I need a quick purchase and turnaround as I may have to use this in 2 weeks time for interviews (indoor) Thanks PS forgot to say, I have a zoom H4N so maybe I could use that on the camera to record audio and sync it with internal audio in post edit?