Industry Standard for Bars and tone at DVinfo.net

Stefan Scherperel · April 26th, 2007, 03:27 PM

So we have been working with this local duping house for over a year when just a couple days ago we get dinged with a $50 service charge for having the audio too hot. Of course I call them up and ask them what's up. They tell me that the spot itself was fine, but the bars and tone auido level was too hot by about 8db. I'm trying to figure out how this happens when all of a sudden he tells me that they have there machines set at -20db for bars and tone, while I have been using -12db for the longest time. Now my question is this, am I wrong in submitting my DV tape masters to be duped with -12db for the tone level? Maybe they havn't decided to charge the service charge until now, but I want to make sure that before I set the DB level to -20 that I'm not going to be setting it too low and therefore have our spots blasting the audio when broadcast. Anyone with some insight into this would be greatly appreciated for your help.

David W. Jones · April 26th, 2007, 03:32 PM

-20 is correct for broadcast.

Stefan Scherperel · April 26th, 2007, 03:40 PM

Thanks David for the quick reply. I guess I have to ask then why do my cameras and NLE's all export tone at -12db? To be honest I'm not really an editor, but I do end up doing alot of the editing lately, so I want to make sure I have this stuff right.

Andrew Kimery · April 26th, 2007, 04:46 PM

Different peeps have different specs you just have to make sure the delivery requirements are clear on what is desired. I've worked on shows where tone was level X and nothing could peak above level Y.

-A

Nate Weaver · April 26th, 2007, 05:18 PM

-12 is the standard for DV/DVCAM.

-20 is the standard all other pro digital formats like digibeta, DVCPRO50.

I've done a lot of dubbing here in L.A with various duplication companies, and never had them charge for something so petty. I think I'd have a little talk with them.

Glenn Chan · April 26th, 2007, 07:14 PM

1- I thought the standard for DVCAM was -20dBFS?? (Though I don't remember the decks too well.)

The standard tone level for many consumer formats would be -12dBFS... which is why a lot of NLEs default to -12.

2- I'd agree with Nate that this charge seems petty... especially when they did not communicate it to you beforehand.

Bill Davis · April 26th, 2007, 08:14 PM

Yeah, I've got to tell you that if someone tried to bill me for something like that, I'd immediately cut a check for $75 bucks and send it right to them with a note telling them how sorry I am that their business is going though such hard financial circumstances.

A lovely little note expressing my DEEP concern about their business - and a suggestion that I'm making it a point to TELL EVERYONE I COME IN CONTACT WITH IN THE INDUSTRY to please consider adding a "donation" to THEIR bills in the hopes that we could keep the poor facility from going under would probably do the trick.

For what it's worth.

Stefan Scherperel · April 26th, 2007, 10:24 PM

Bill that's not a half bad idea. I luckily am not the one that foots the bill on this thing, but I will be sure to pass it along to my producers.

April 26th, 2007, 03:27 PM	#1
Stefan Scherperel Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Seattle WA Posts: 209	Industry Standard for Bars and tone So we have been working with this local duping house for over a year when just a couple days ago we get dinged with a $50 service charge for having the audio too hot. Of course I call them up and ask them what's up. They tell me that the spot itself was fine, but the bars and tone auido level was too hot by about 8db. I'm trying to figure out how this happens when all of a sudden he tells me that they have there machines set at -20db for bars and tone, while I have been using -12db for the longest time. Now my question is this, am I wrong in submitting my DV tape masters to be duped with -12db for the tone level? Maybe they havn't decided to charge the service charge until now, but I want to make sure that before I set the DB level to -20 that I'm not going to be setting it too low and therefore have our spots blasting the audio when broadcast. Anyone with some insight into this would be greatly appreciated for your help. __________________ Stefan Scherperel SSE Productions http://www.stefweb.net

April 26th, 2007, 03:40 PM	#3
Stefan Scherperel Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Seattle WA Posts: 209	Thanks David for the quick reply. I guess I have to ask then why do my cameras and NLE's all export tone at -12db? To be honest I'm not really an editor, but I do end up doing alot of the editing lately, so I want to make sure I have this stuff right. __________________ Stefan Scherperel SSE Productions http://www.stefweb.net

April 26th, 2007, 05:18 PM	#5
Nate Weaver Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 2,100	-12 is the standard for DV/DVCAM. -20 is the standard all other pro digital formats like digibeta, DVCPRO50. I've done a lot of dubbing here in L.A with various duplication companies, and never had them charge for something so petty. I think I'd have a little talk with them. __________________ My Work: nateweaver.net

April 26th, 2007, 10:24 PM	#8
Stefan Scherperel Major Player Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Seattle WA Posts: 209	Bill that's not a half bad idea. I luckily am not the one that foots the bill on this thing, but I will be sure to pass it along to my producers. __________________ Stefan Scherperel SSE Productions http://www.stefweb.net

April 26th, 2007, 03:32 PM	#2
David W. Jones Trustee Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Little Rock Posts: 1,383	-20 is correct for broadcast.

April 26th, 2007, 04:46 PM	#4
Andrew Kimery Major Player Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 352	Different peeps have different specs you just have to make sure the delivery requirements are clear on what is desired. I've worked on shows where tone was level X and nothing could peak above level Y. -A

April 26th, 2007, 07:14 PM	#6
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	1- I thought the standard for DVCAM was -20dBFS?? (Though I don't remember the decks too well.) The standard tone level for many consumer formats would be -12dBFS... which is why a lot of NLEs default to -12. 2- I'd agree with Nate that this charge seems petty... especially when they did not communicate it to you beforehand.

April 26th, 2007, 08:14 PM	#7
Bill Davis Trustee Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Scottsdale, AZ 85260 Posts: 1,538	Yeah, I've got to tell you that if someone tried to bill me for something like that, I'd immediately cut a check for $75 bucks and send it right to them with a note telling them how sorry I am that their business is going though such hard financial circumstances. A lovely little note expressing my DEEP concern about their business - and a suggestion that I'm making it a point to TELL EVERYONE I COME IN CONTACT WITH IN THE INDUSTRY to please consider adding a "donation" to THEIR bills in the hopes that we could keep the poor facility from going under would probably do the trick. For what it's worth.