DV thrue SDI at DVinfo.net

Tim Commeijne · February 19th, 2006, 05:16 PM

When I capture DV matherial thrue SDI in Avid, or same thing when I make a copy thrue SDI from DV to Digibeta, I am left with a kind of VITC on top of my image. Anyone know how to avoid this?

Tim

Ian Stuart Lynn · February 28th, 2006, 09:30 AM

I just had a BIG problem with VITC and I was looking for help here when I saw your post. I edited a project on FCP, capturing over FireWire from a DigiBeta player. No problems there, everything looked great, all the timcodes imported correctly.

I made a DVCAM tape from FCP using my Sony Z1. This was transferred to DigiBeta at a London facilities house. The DigiBeta then went to another London facility for mastering on DVD. The problem was that when this DVD was viewed as letterbox on a 4 x 3 monitor, something looking like VITC appeared on the top left of the visible picture.

The second facilities house re-mastered in FCP to get rid of this, but investigation revealed that the VITC could be seen on my DVCAM - I was not present, so I don't know how they viewed this. I was told this is a 'common' problem and that the VITC was the code from my DVCAM being transposed into the top visible picture line by the transfer to DigiBeta. They said it appeared underneath the DigiBeta VITC, ie two different VITC codes, the lower of which was now on a visible line.

Worst of all, my client is blaming me for something I could never have seen. I am fairly sure that the transfer from DVCAM to DigiBeta would have been via SDI, which agrees with your problem. There seems to be something here which Sony should address.

However, this occurs in other circumstances as well; I happened to be watching analogue terrestrial TV in the south of England last week. This is mostly 14 x 9 (the accepted compromise here for showing 16 x 9 material over the old system) and on the live weather broadcast I saw (static) VITC in frame, top left of the active picture. If broadcasters can't get it right, I wonder how humble self-employed editors are supposed to???

Sorry this does not solve your problem, but you are not alone here.

Tim Commeijne · February 28th, 2006, 03:40 PM

Seems like the same. It's like a VITC, unless its not moving (VITC is moving)
Tried the other thing, copied Digibeta to DVCAM. NO PROBLEM. I think it's something that DV camera's generate. Because the footage from the digibeta tape came from a digibeta camera. BTW: all the fuss about tape formats: that footage kopied from digibeta on the DVCAM tape looked verry good. There was no difference visable between that footage on a digibeta tape and on a DVCAM tape. Only when paused, and vieuwed on a good Barco monitor thrue SDI, you can see artifacts (from the DV compression), but on a monitor thrue composite cable, you have to have a verry good eye to notice a difference.
Seems DV's 4:4:1 color, 5:1 compression is not all that bad. It all depends on what camera (and CCD block) It came from. plus DVCAM uses verry fragile tapes (does still feel like a consumer tape)
I think The XDCAM camera's (who record MPEG IMX and DVCAM) have a reel future. Great CCD block (same as new Digibeta and MPEG IMX camera's), and record on a Pro disk. So no dropouts with this camera ever! Plus disks can be reused. I think MPEG IMX will be used by companies were mony is not an isue, and the DVCAM only versions of these camera's will be used by smaller companies.

Compression (DVcam 5:1 or Digibeta 2:1) doesn't make the difference! It's the camera that it's recorded with!

February 19th, 2006, 05:16 PM	#1
Tim Commeijne Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Europe, Belgium, Oostende Posts: 44	DV thrue SDI When I capture DV matherial thrue SDI in Avid, or same thing when I make a copy thrue SDI from DV to Digibeta, I am left with a kind of VITC on top of my image. Anyone know how to avoid this? Tim

February 28th, 2006, 09:30 AM	#2
Ian Stuart Lynn New Boot Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Shanklin, England Posts: 8	VITC in vision - DV > DigiBeta I just had a BIG problem with VITC and I was looking for help here when I saw your post. I edited a project on FCP, capturing over FireWire from a DigiBeta player. No problems there, everything looked great, all the timcodes imported correctly. I made a DVCAM tape from FCP using my Sony Z1. This was transferred to DigiBeta at a London facilities house. The DigiBeta then went to another London facility for mastering on DVD. The problem was that when this DVD was viewed as letterbox on a 4 x 3 monitor, something looking like VITC appeared on the top left of the visible picture. The second facilities house re-mastered in FCP to get rid of this, but investigation revealed that the VITC could be seen on my DVCAM - I was not present, so I don't know how they viewed this. I was told this is a 'common' problem and that the VITC was the code from my DVCAM being transposed into the top visible picture line by the transfer to DigiBeta. They said it appeared underneath the DigiBeta VITC, ie two different VITC codes, the lower of which was now on a visible line. Worst of all, my client is blaming me for something I could never have seen. I am fairly sure that the transfer from DVCAM to DigiBeta would have been via SDI, which agrees with your problem. There seems to be something here which Sony should address. However, this occurs in other circumstances as well; I happened to be watching analogue terrestrial TV in the south of England last week. This is mostly 14 x 9 (the accepted compromise here for showing 16 x 9 material over the old system) and on the live weather broadcast I saw (static) VITC in frame, top left of the active picture. If broadcasters can't get it right, I wonder how humble self-employed editors are supposed to??? Sorry this does not solve your problem, but you are not alone here.

February 28th, 2006, 03:40 PM	#3
Tim Commeijne Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Europe, Belgium, Oostende Posts: 44	Seems like the same. It's like a VITC, unless its not moving (VITC is moving) Tried the other thing, copied Digibeta to DVCAM. NO PROBLEM. I think it's something that DV camera's generate. Because the footage from the digibeta tape came from a digibeta camera. BTW: all the fuss about tape formats: that footage kopied from digibeta on the DVCAM tape looked verry good. There was no difference visable between that footage on a digibeta tape and on a DVCAM tape. Only when paused, and vieuwed on a good Barco monitor thrue SDI, you can see artifacts (from the DV compression), but on a monitor thrue composite cable, you have to have a verry good eye to notice a difference. Seems DV's 4:4:1 color, 5:1 compression is not all that bad. It all depends on what camera (and CCD block) It came from. plus DVCAM uses verry fragile tapes (does still feel like a consumer tape) I think The XDCAM camera's (who record MPEG IMX and DVCAM) have a reel future. Great CCD block (same as new Digibeta and MPEG IMX camera's), and record on a Pro disk. So no dropouts with this camera ever! Plus disks can be reused. I think MPEG IMX will be used by companies were mony is not an isue, and the DVCAM only versions of these camera's will be used by smaller companies. Compression (DVcam 5:1 or Digibeta 2:1) doesn't make the difference! It's the camera that it's recorded with!