The gigantic "which camera should I buy" thread!

Riley Harmon · December 10th, 2003, 03:54 PM

yes....but the sony does not have frame mode, 20x zoom, etc....

Riley Harmon · December 10th, 2003, 03:57 PM

also is my computer suffiecient for editing and after effects rendering

Glenn Chan · December 10th, 2003, 04:15 PM

You should be able to run Vegas fine on your computer. Premiere Pro may not run depending on whether or not your AMD processor has the SSE instruction set.

Make sure your monitor can run at a high resolution (1280X___) or have 2 monitors (need a video card that supports dual monitors [most do] with the right connectors). No NLE works well at 800X600, while 1024X768 is quite cramped. Try a high resolution and see how your eyes take it.

A faster computer will of course render faster. For After Effects you can setup a render node/farm to render faster. I don't have any experience with that program though.

Quote:

yes....but the sony does not have frame mode, 20x zoom, etc....

frame mode may not be too important (more vertical resolution, worse looking motion, progressive images)
20X zoom isn't too useful unless you're using a tripod. For controlled shooting situations, it might help you get more depth of field, but the VX2000 has bigger chips. Not sure which is better.
The VX2000 has a lot better low light, but that isn't particularly useful for movie making. It would be useful for documentaries and weddings though.
To me the VX2000 gives slightly nicer images. There are some image comparisons over at http://babelfish.altavista.com/babel....html&lp=ja_en.

You'll probably be happy with either. The only major difference I see is that the VX2000 has superior low light.

Bill Pryor · December 10th, 2003, 04:24 PM

The main difference is that bigger chips give you a cleaner, sharper image. If you play the same footage from a 1/4" chip camera next to that from a 1/3" chip camera the 1/4" chip stuff will appear soft. Frame mode and a longer zoom are not relevant in most TV spots. You want the highest resolution and cleanest picture you can get.

Riley Harmon · December 10th, 2003, 05:00 PM

i do have a render farm setup, its quite nice, i just have to turn on the node and it starts up AE upon OS boot

Riley Harmon · December 10th, 2003, 05:15 PM

shoot the vx2100 is only 2400 at B&H, if i could get 1400 for christmas (Doubtful) i could get one, i have a while, i could save.....

with the render farm of the 2400 and the 1 ghz duron i can render 1 min of magic bullet footage with look suite applied in an hour...not too shabby....

Adrian Douglas · December 10th, 2003, 11:41 PM

Riley, I'd be looking at the best camera possible. You computer set-up sound pretty good and you can upgrade computers gradually as money comes in. You wouldn't be dissaapointed in either the VX2100 or the GL2, or the 953 for that matter in terms of image quality but the VX/GL win in terms of image control.

Jason Gatti · December 22nd, 2003, 05:02 PM

I'm sure I'll get many opinions on this subject, but here it goes anyway. I'm looking to purchase my first DV mini cam. What camera would you say would be the best overall camera? Take price,performance,reliability and everything into account. Right now I shoot mainly outdoor sporting events, hockey games, and some other thing's. I've had many people try and sell me on the Canon XL1-s but $4,600 is a little out of my range at this time. Besides, I've read reviews saying this is not the camera to be carried around in the way I would use it. ANy help would be great. Also I really like the Sony's. So anyone with any of the Sony camera's I'd really like to hear what you have and how you like it. Thanks

Adrian Douglas · December 22nd, 2003, 07:00 PM

Check out the Panasonic 953, it's a very popular, well featured entry level priced 3CCD camera.

Dylan Couper · December 22nd, 2003, 07:08 PM

What's your budget?
The Panny 953 that Adrian suggests is certainly a good choice. I'd also consider a Canon GL2 if you have the $2300 to spend.

Frank Granovski · December 22nd, 2003, 07:09 PM

You mentioned sports - hockey games. Don't consider a PV-DV953 because it requires more LUX than most other 3 chip hand-held cams. Though larger, I would look at the Sony VX2000. It's a very good buy right now.

Richard James · December 22nd, 2003, 10:56 PM

The GL2 (or XM2 as its called in PAL land) is a top camcorder, you should consider it for sure.

After a lot of research, i have decided to go with the XM2(GL2) for myself, if you can afford it i would go with it...
(asuming you don't need the ability to change lenses).

It has many of the great features of the XL1s (frame movie mode, clearscan, great lens) It also has a very simular image quality to the XL1s, some prefer the image quality of the GL2/XM2, some prefer the image quality of the XL1s.
It competes strongly with the camcorders that are $1000-$2000 dollars more (xl1s, vx2000) Often compared to those cameras in reviews/forum posts...
Also the GL2 is smaller and lighter than the XL1s.

However, it depends if your looking for a consumer style cam for a first purchase, or a semi-pro camera.
But if its a semipro camera your looking for, the GL2 is by far the best in the price range, and even outdoes some of the more expensive cams in some areas:) (although i agree the VX2000 should also be considered if you have the money, depends what features you are looking for) Personally even if i had the money for the VX2000 i would go for the XM2 (frame mode is a very important feature IMO)

Your really need to work out exactly what you wan't out of your camera, But with any of the above cams, there all well above the quality of average consumer MDV cams.
The 953 won't be as good as the canon xm2/gl2/xl1s, or as good as the vx2000, but it does , from as far as i can see, offer good quality video, but pretty bad low light performance.

Kaifoong Kok · January 1st, 2004, 01:47 PM

Dear all,

I'm looking for a camera that can tolerate heavy duty (such as mountain climbing (shaky), asia forest (hot), winter snowing (cold) etc.). XL1s probably a bad choice for this purpose since it needs good care and it's sensitive. PD150 is a good choice I think. How about DVX100 and VX2000?

Don Bloom · January 1st, 2004, 03:26 PM

Any camera you choose is going to need to be taken good care of. Remember you are dealing with a piece of sensitive electronic gear that has glass and electronics and little rollers all stuffed tightly inside.

Having said that, the camera you choose is up to you but I can only tell you that most of the cameras that US newspeople and video journalists used while covering the "war in Iraq" were PD150's. Of course the networks bought them by the dozens and the camerapeople had to clean them daily or more AND take take careful care of them.

I personally like the Sony but thats me, perhaps others will have a different choice but whichever you choose, take good care of it.
Good Luck in your choice,
Don

Glenn Chan · January 1st, 2004, 03:31 PM

The PD150 shoots in DVCAM mode which may or may not make a difference in hot/cold shooting environments (heat affects the length of the tape slightly). DVCAM uses 50% more tape to record which makes should make it more robust.

Reporters in Iraq I believe had a lot of problems with dust killing their equipment although lots of equipment there have that problem.

December 10th, 2003, 11:41 PM	#292
Adrian Douglas Trustee Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Chigasaki, Japan. Posts: 1,660	Riley, I'd be looking at the best camera possible. You computer set-up sound pretty good and you can upgrade computers gradually as money comes in. You wouldn't be dissaapointed in either the VX2100 or the GL2, or the 953 for that matter in terms of image quality but the VX/GL win in terms of image control. __________________ Adrian DVInfo.net Search for quick answers Where to buy? From the best in the business...DVInfo.net sponsors

December 22nd, 2003, 05:02 PM	#293
Jason Gatti Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Michigan Posts: 48	A good first DV mini cam? I'm sure I'll get many opinions on this subject, but here it goes anyway. I'm looking to purchase my first DV mini cam. What camera would you say would be the best overall camera? Take price,performance,reliability and everything into account. Right now I shoot mainly outdoor sporting events, hockey games, and some other thing's. I've had many people try and sell me on the Canon XL1-s but $4,600 is a little out of my range at this time. Besides, I've read reviews saying this is not the camera to be carried around in the way I would use it. ANy help would be great. Also I really like the Sony's. So anyone with any of the Sony camera's I'd really like to hear what you have and how you like it. Thanks

December 22nd, 2003, 07:00 PM	#294
Adrian Douglas Trustee Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Chigasaki, Japan. Posts: 1,660	Check out the Panasonic 953, it's a very popular, well featured entry level priced 3CCD camera. __________________ Adrian DVInfo.net Search for quick answers Where to buy? From the best in the business...DVInfo.net sponsors

December 22nd, 2003, 07:08 PM	#295
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	What's your budget? The Panny 953 that Adrian suggests is certainly a good choice. I'd also consider a Canon GL2 if you have the $2300 to spend. __________________ Need to rent camera gear in Vancouver BC? Check me out at camerarentalsvancouver.com

January 1st, 2004, 01:47 PM	#298
Kaifoong Kok Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Malaysia Posts: 57	suitable camera for heavy duty? Dear all, I'm looking for a camera that can tolerate heavy duty (such as mountain climbing (shaky), asia forest (hot), winter snowing (cold) etc.). XL1s probably a bad choice for this purpose since it needs good care and it's sensitive. PD150 is a good choice I think. How about DVX100 and VX2000? __________________ KaiF

December 10th, 2003, 03:54 PM	#286
Riley Harmon Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 424	yes....but the sony does not have frame mode, 20x zoom, etc....

December 10th, 2003, 03:57 PM	#287
Riley Harmon Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 424	also is my computer suffiecient for editing and after effects rendering

December 10th, 2003, 04:24 PM	#289
Bill Pryor Contributor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 4,449	The main difference is that bigger chips give you a cleaner, sharper image. If you play the same footage from a 1/4" chip camera next to that from a 1/3" chip camera the 1/4" chip stuff will appear soft. Frame mode and a longer zoom are not relevant in most TV spots. You want the highest resolution and cleanest picture you can get.

December 10th, 2003, 05:00 PM	#290
Riley Harmon Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 424	i do have a render farm setup, its quite nice, i just have to turn on the node and it starts up AE upon OS boot

December 10th, 2003, 05:15 PM	#291
Riley Harmon Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 424	shoot the vx2100 is only 2400 at B&H, if i could get 1400 for christmas (Doubtful) i could get one, i have a while, i could save..... with the render farm of the 2400 and the 1 ghz duron i can render 1 min of magic bullet footage with look suite applied in an hour...not too shabby....

December 22nd, 2003, 07:09 PM	#296
Frank Granovski Outer Circle Join Date: May 2002 Location: Hope, BC Posts: 7,524	You mentioned sports - hockey games. Don't consider a PV-DV953 because it requires more LUX than most other 3 chip hand-held cams. Though larger, I would look at the Sony VX2000. It's a very good buy right now.

December 22nd, 2003, 10:56 PM	#297
Richard James Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: England, london. Posts: 31	The GL2 (or XM2 as its called in PAL land) is a top camcorder, you should consider it for sure. After a lot of research, i have decided to go with the XM2(GL2) for myself, if you can afford it i would go with it... (asuming you don't need the ability to change lenses). It has many of the great features of the XL1s (frame movie mode, clearscan, great lens) It also has a very simular image quality to the XL1s, some prefer the image quality of the GL2/XM2, some prefer the image quality of the XL1s. It competes strongly with the camcorders that are $1000-$2000 dollars more (xl1s, vx2000) Often compared to those cameras in reviews/forum posts... Also the GL2 is smaller and lighter than the XL1s. However, it depends if your looking for a consumer style cam for a first purchase, or a semi-pro camera. But if its a semipro camera your looking for, the GL2 is by far the best in the price range, and even outdoes some of the more expensive cams in some areas:) (although i agree the VX2000 should also be considered if you have the money, depends what features you are looking for) Personally even if i had the money for the VX2000 i would go for the XM2 (frame mode is a very important feature IMO) Your really need to work out exactly what you wan't out of your camera, But with any of the above cams, there all well above the quality of average consumer MDV cams. The 953 won't be as good as the canon xm2/gl2/xl1s, or as good as the vx2000, but it does , from as far as i can see, offer good quality video, but pretty bad low light performance.

January 1st, 2004, 03:26 PM	#299
Don Bloom Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago, IL Posts: 6,609	Any camera you choose is going to need to be taken good care of. Remember you are dealing with a piece of sensitive electronic gear that has glass and electronics and little rollers all stuffed tightly inside. Having said that, the camera you choose is up to you but I can only tell you that most of the cameras that US newspeople and video journalists used while covering the "war in Iraq" were PD150's. Of course the networks bought them by the dozens and the camerapeople had to clean them daily or more AND take take careful care of them. I personally like the Sony but thats me, perhaps others will have a different choice but whichever you choose, take good care of it. Good Luck in your choice, Don

January 1st, 2004, 03:31 PM	#300
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	The PD150 shoots in DVCAM mode which may or may not make a difference in hot/cold shooting environments (heat affects the length of the tape slightly). DVCAM uses 50% more tape to record which makes should make it more robust. Reporters in Iraq I believe had a lot of problems with dust killing their equipment although lots of equipment there have that problem.