Sony DSR-570 vs XL2/DVX at DVinfo.net

Michael Best · July 29th, 2004, 06:11 AM

No, not head to head competition but the Sony
doesn't shoot 24p so it wouldn't be as 'filmic' looking?
Are the Sony's just broadcast camera's or can they be used
for short film? Other than an actual film camera what would
you consider in the $7k - $14k range for doing short films?

Kevin Lee · July 29th, 2004, 06:31 AM

For what it's worth. I just had my first short film
shot recently with the Sony570WS.

Michael Best · July 29th, 2004, 06:42 AM

Nice, what mode was it shot in? Is the 'film look' (really beginning
to burn out on that phrase) done in post?

Kevin Lee · July 29th, 2004, 06:52 AM

Mode? Was shot PAL interlaced. It does not have progressive.

Tried de-interlacing in post but because i had a lot of fast movements, the results were not good. Leaving it interlaced.

Did quite a bit of colour correction to enhance the shots, not neccessarily to "look like film". Still looks like video to me but is appropriate for the story.

The 570 is a good cam.

Bill Pryor · July 29th, 2004, 11:24 AM

When Jennifer Jason Leigh and Alan Cumming produced "The Anniversary Party," our local film critic here said it looked more like it had been shot with film than anything he had seen up to that point. They used DSR500s. I personally thought "The King Is Alive" was the best looking video-to-film thing I've seen, which was shot with PD150s. The DSR500/570 had true 16:9 chips, and they're 2/3" chips. With some experience you can tweak the camera to give you the look you want. The mere fact of shooting something at 24fps is not going to magically make it look as if it had been shot in film.

Frederic Segard · July 29th, 2004, 11:31 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Lee : The 570 is a good cam. -->>>

Considering the price, except for the obvious 16:9, 2/3", and low light capability, is the 570 really worth it over the Sony DSR390 which is a 4:3 1/2"?

Kevin Lee · July 29th, 2004, 11:34 AM

If you're interested, here are some behind-scenes-pics of the 570 in action.
http://www.noodlem.com/bubblegum/behindscenes.html

I also shot with the pd150 as a Bcam.

Mike Rehmus · July 29th, 2004, 12:15 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Frederic Segard : <<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Lee : The 570 is a good cam. -->>>

Considering the price, except for the obvious 16:9, 2/3", and low light capability, is the 570 really worth it over the Sony DSR390 which is a 4:3 1/2"? -->>>

Not if you are going to shoot in 4:3 according to a Sony rep I talked with.

Plus the 390 has it all over the 570 with regards to low light sensitivity.

Still, the 500/570 are very impressive cameras.

Bill Pryor · July 29th, 2004, 12:24 PM

What sort of comparison did you do with the 390 and 570? They're the same chips as their earlier model, aren't they, with only minor modifications to other things in the camera. When I was doing a 2-camera shoot with a 500 and a 300, the 500 was shooting at a 5.6 while the 300 wanted a little more than an f4 for the same area. The 390 only has 1/2" chips. Granted, it's the best looking 1/2" chip camera made, in my opinion. But in a subjective comparison side by side, the bigger chips look better, to me.

Michael Best · July 29th, 2004, 02:05 PM

Kevin - I think those shots look great, very nice.

Michael Best · July 29th, 2004, 02:06 PM

I'd still like to know what people would buy camera wise in the
original price range, not 2 cameras, not tripods etc, just what
one camera.

Bill Pryor · July 29th, 2004, 02:30 PM

In the 7-$14K range...that would most likely be the 1/2" chip cameras. However, JVC does make a 2/3" 16:9 chip one that sells for around $11K. So you might be able to get a cheap lens and batteries for around $14K, in which case I would definitely go with that, even if it says JVC on it (you can always cover it up with gaffer tape). For a 1/2" chip camera, I think the DSR390 is the best thing out there, and that's what I would go with in that price range next to the JVC 2/3".

Kevin Lee · July 29th, 2004, 08:04 PM

The xl2 is coming out next month.
And from first impressions, that camera would interest me a lot.

Next probable step up would be the SDX900, in my opinion.

Mike Rehmus · July 29th, 2004, 09:15 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Bill Pryor : What sort of comparison did you do with the 390 and 570? They're the same chips as their earlier model, aren't they, with only minor modifications to other things in the camera. When I was doing a 2-camera shoot with a 500 and a 300, the 500 was shooting at a 5.6 while the 300 wanted a little more than an f4 for the same area. The 390 only has 1/2" chips. Granted, it's the best looking 1/2" chip camera made, in my opinion. But in a subjective comparison side by side, the bigger chips look better, to me. -->>>

The 390, in the latest test I read, came out better in low light than the 570 the reviewer normally shoots wedding with. If you can get a copy of the last WEVA newsletter, it was in there. Since she (the author) is on the WEVA camera committee for interaction with Sony and I've exchanged information with her, I think she knows what she's talking about.

Mike Rehmus · July 29th, 2004, 09:24 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by Michael Best : I'd still like to know what people would buy camera wise in the
original price range, not 2 cameras, not tripods etc, just what
one camera. -->>>

For $14,000, you will probably have to accept the package lens with the 390 which isn't so bad. Might be able to move up to a slightly wider lens and still stay in budget. Then you will have money for batteries and a charger.

Here's the description of a new kit for sale on ebay. I have no idea of the reputation of the seller or anything other than what is written.

You'll have to find it yourself if you are interested. Just do a Google search for Sony DSR-390

INCLUDED IN THIS PACKAGE:

Sony DSR-390, NTSC version
Fujinon 20x6.4 IF Servo Lens
2: IDX 80S Batteries and IDX Dual Charger/Power Supply
the latest Century Optics .8x IF Pro Wide Angle Converter and Step Ring
Schneider 4x4 Clear Filter
Schneider 4x4 UV Haze Filter
Schneider 4x4 Tru-Pol Polarizer Filter
Schneider 4x4 .9 Graduated Neutral Density Filter
Bogen Manfrotto 515MVW/ 510 Kit Tripod kit consisting of 510 Pro Video Fluid Head, 515MVW 3 stage Tripod, Spreader, and deluxe padded carrying case
Bogen 3198 Pro Cine Dolly
Thermodyne LC424TH Deluxe Hard Carrying and Shipping Case
Anton Bauer UltraLight 2 on camera video light
Audio Technica AT-897 shotgun mic w/XLR Cable, Windscreen, and Hard Case
Porta Brace Quick Draw carrying Case
Schneider Lens Cleaner Kit
5 Sony DVCAM184N Tapes

It is listed as a $14,500 Buy it Now

Re-reading the ad, I'm not certain if he's selling a 300, 300A 370 or 390.

July 29th, 2004, 06:11 AM	#1
Michael Best Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Oceanside Harbor, CA Posts: 446	Sony DSR-570 vs XL2/DVX No, not head to head competition but the Sony doesn't shoot 24p so it wouldn't be as 'filmic' looking? Are the Sony's just broadcast camera's or can they be used for short film? Other than an actual film camera what would you consider in the $7k - $14k range for doing short films?

July 29th, 2004, 12:15 PM	#8
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	<<<-- Originally posted by Frederic Segard : <<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Lee : The 570 is a good cam. -->>> Considering the price, except for the obvious 16:9, 2/3", and low light capability, is the 570 really worth it over the Sony DSR390 which is a 4:3 1/2"? -->>> Not if you are going to shoot in 4:3 according to a Sony rep I talked with. Plus the 390 has it all over the 570 with regards to low light sensitivity. Still, the 500/570 are very impressive cameras. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

July 29th, 2004, 09:15 PM	#14
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	<<<-- Originally posted by Bill Pryor : What sort of comparison did you do with the 390 and 570? They're the same chips as their earlier model, aren't they, with only minor modifications to other things in the camera. When I was doing a 2-camera shoot with a 500 and a 300, the 500 was shooting at a 5.6 while the 300 wanted a little more than an f4 for the same area. The 390 only has 1/2" chips. Granted, it's the best looking 1/2" chip camera made, in my opinion. But in a subjective comparison side by side, the bigger chips look better, to me. -->>> The 390, in the latest test I read, came out better in low light than the 570 the reviewer normally shoots wedding with. If you can get a copy of the last WEVA newsletter, it was in there. Since she (the author) is on the WEVA camera committee for interaction with Sony and I've exchanged information with her, I think she knows what she's talking about. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

July 29th, 2004, 09:24 PM	#15
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	<<<-- Originally posted by Michael Best : I'd still like to know what people would buy camera wise in the original price range, not 2 cameras, not tripods etc, just what one camera. -->>> For $14,000, you will probably have to accept the package lens with the 390 which isn't so bad. Might be able to move up to a slightly wider lens and still stay in budget. Then you will have money for batteries and a charger. Here's the description of a new kit for sale on ebay. I have no idea of the reputation of the seller or anything other than what is written. You'll have to find it yourself if you are interested. Just do a Google search for Sony DSR-390 INCLUDED IN THIS PACKAGE: Sony DSR-390, NTSC version Fujinon 20x6.4 IF Servo Lens 2: IDX 80S Batteries and IDX Dual Charger/Power Supply the latest Century Optics .8x IF Pro Wide Angle Converter and Step Ring Schneider 4x4 Clear Filter Schneider 4x4 UV Haze Filter Schneider 4x4 Tru-Pol Polarizer Filter Schneider 4x4 .9 Graduated Neutral Density Filter Bogen Manfrotto 515MVW/ 510 Kit Tripod kit consisting of 510 Pro Video Fluid Head, 515MVW 3 stage Tripod, Spreader, and deluxe padded carrying case Bogen 3198 Pro Cine Dolly Thermodyne LC424TH Deluxe Hard Carrying and Shipping Case Anton Bauer UltraLight 2 on camera video light Audio Technica AT-897 shotgun mic w/XLR Cable, Windscreen, and Hard Case Porta Brace Quick Draw carrying Case Schneider Lens Cleaner Kit 5 Sony DVCAM184N Tapes It is listed as a $14,500 Buy it Now Re-reading the ad, I'm not certain if he's selling a 300, 300A 370 or 390. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

July 29th, 2004, 06:31 AM	#2
Kevin Lee Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 224	For what it's worth. I just had my first short film shot recently with the Sony570WS.

July 29th, 2004, 06:42 AM	#3
Michael Best Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Oceanside Harbor, CA Posts: 446	Nice, what mode was it shot in? Is the 'film look' (really beginning to burn out on that phrase) done in post?

July 29th, 2004, 06:52 AM	#4
Kevin Lee Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 224	Mode? Was shot PAL interlaced. It does not have progressive. Tried de-interlacing in post but because i had a lot of fast movements, the results were not good. Leaving it interlaced. Did quite a bit of colour correction to enhance the shots, not neccessarily to "look like film". Still looks like video to me but is appropriate for the story. The 570 is a good cam.

July 29th, 2004, 11:24 AM	#5
Bill Pryor Contributor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 4,449	When Jennifer Jason Leigh and Alan Cumming produced "The Anniversary Party," our local film critic here said it looked more like it had been shot with film than anything he had seen up to that point. They used DSR500s. I personally thought "The King Is Alive" was the best looking video-to-film thing I've seen, which was shot with PD150s. The DSR500/570 had true 16:9 chips, and they're 2/3" chips. With some experience you can tweak the camera to give you the look you want. The mere fact of shooting something at 24fps is not going to magically make it look as if it had been shot in film.

July 29th, 2004, 11:31 AM	#6
Frederic Segard Major Player Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Montreal, Canada Posts: 209	<<<-- Originally posted by Kevin Lee : The 570 is a good cam. -->>> Considering the price, except for the obvious 16:9, 2/3", and low light capability, is the 570 really worth it over the Sony DSR390 which is a 4:3 1/2"?

July 29th, 2004, 11:34 AM	#7
Kevin Lee Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 224	If you're interested, here are some behind-scenes-pics of the 570 in action. http://www.noodlem.com/bubblegum/behindscenes.html I also shot with the pd150 as a Bcam.

July 29th, 2004, 12:24 PM	#9
Bill Pryor Contributor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 4,449	What sort of comparison did you do with the 390 and 570? They're the same chips as their earlier model, aren't they, with only minor modifications to other things in the camera. When I was doing a 2-camera shoot with a 500 and a 300, the 500 was shooting at a 5.6 while the 300 wanted a little more than an f4 for the same area. The 390 only has 1/2" chips. Granted, it's the best looking 1/2" chip camera made, in my opinion. But in a subjective comparison side by side, the bigger chips look better, to me.

July 29th, 2004, 02:05 PM	#10
Michael Best Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Oceanside Harbor, CA Posts: 446	Kevin - I think those shots look great, very nice.

July 29th, 2004, 02:06 PM	#11
Michael Best Major Player Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Oceanside Harbor, CA Posts: 446	I'd still like to know what people would buy camera wise in the original price range, not 2 cameras, not tripods etc, just what one camera.

July 29th, 2004, 02:30 PM	#12
Bill Pryor Contributor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 4,449	In the 7-$14K range...that would most likely be the 1/2" chip cameras. However, JVC does make a 2/3" 16:9 chip one that sells for around $11K. So you might be able to get a cheap lens and batteries for around $14K, in which case I would definitely go with that, even if it says JVC on it (you can always cover it up with gaffer tape). For a 1/2" chip camera, I think the DSR390 is the best thing out there, and that's what I would go with in that price range next to the JVC 2/3".

July 29th, 2004, 08:04 PM	#13
Kevin Lee Major Player Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Canada Posts: 224	The xl2 is coming out next month. And from first impressions, that camera would interest me a lot. Next probable step up would be the SDX900, in my opinion.