s-video vs. component illustrated at DVinfo.net

Gints Klimanis · January 7th, 2004, 01:45 PM

Here's a good page describing and depicting the differences among the various video cabling methods:

http://www.hifi-writer.com/he/video/index.htm

Ben Wiens · January 7th, 2004, 07:02 PM

Thanks for the link. My TV doesn't have AVin or S-video or anything else. I use AVout from my camcorder to AVin on my VCR. So does this meand that my TV is really only seeing RF which is the poorest quality of the signals?

Boyd Ostroff · January 7th, 2004, 07:14 PM

Yep. You'd be amazed at what you're missing as compared to component video on an LCD screen. That's a good link, but the photos don't really do justice to the overall picture quality that you can see on a progressive scan component input device at 480p...

Ben Wiens · January 7th, 2004, 08:12 PM

Now that link did not include Firewire input. I understand that some of the newer TVs (maybe HDTV) have Firewire input on the TV. Would that result in as good or better quality than component? Also why do TVs use component and not just Firewire?

Jeff Smallwood · January 7th, 2004, 08:44 PM

Yeah, thanks for the link, I was never quite sure on some of those facts.

Gints Klimanis · January 7th, 2004, 09:11 PM

>Would that result in as good or better quality than component?

It depends on the signal path for the Firewire input. I think that most of these connectors are for MPEG2 signals from satellite boxes, HDTV tuners, D-VHS and the like. Has anyone
ever plugged a camcorder Firewire output to a
Firewire connector on a TV?

>Also why do TVs use component and not just Firewire?

There seems to be a digital interface war. A few TVs (notably Mitsubishi) include a Firewire connector but most provide some sort of DVI. Mind you, this isn't always the same DVI used by computer video cards for LCD monitors. A friend of mine is driving a plasma display with the DVI output of an ATI video card, though.

Also, a word of warning about Firewire inputs/outputs on DVD recorders. Many will recompress the DV25 stream to MPEG2 before converting to analog. Jeez !

Boyd Ostroff · January 8th, 2004, 08:47 AM

Transcoding firewire to component video using a DVD recorder has been discussed in a couple other threads, and this same point was raised. I have a Sony RDR-GX7 DVD recorder which I use for this purpose. I use a 17" Sony 16:9 LCD monitor connected via component, and I feed firewire from my Mac running FCP to the DVD recorder. I have no way to tell if some MPEG conversion is taking place, but the results look phenomenal on the LCD panel; it's considerably cleaner looking than s-video. I can't see any hint of MPEG artifacts, but when I burn DVD's at the highest quality setting (1 hour per disk) I really can't see any difference between the original DV either. But the GX7 is one of the more expensive DVD recorders, so maybe the cheap ones don't do as good a job?

Greg Boston · January 10th, 2004, 03:13 AM

Gints,

I tried to do this very thing with my panasonic and mitsubishi hdtv and it doesn't work. As someone already noted, and what I found by reading the manual afterwards is that it only recognizes MPEG-2 stream on the firewire port.

I think I read somewhere that this was to prevent pirating HD onto your camcorder. I can however, control the camcorder through the firewire link (the tv recognizes the pana when I plug it in), but the audio and video links have to be analog or the device must recognize MPEG-2( ie: DVHS). Of course, the camcorder only recognizes the DV stream format so all I get is blue screen when I put the camcorder in VCR mode. I thought I would finally be able to record OTA signals to my camcorder to play back in high def but nope, can't do that.

regards,

-gb-

Andre De Clercq · January 10th, 2004, 06:24 AM

The link posted by Gints is very interesting. A few remarks however:
- the last picture with its color fringing in the multiburst path, shows why it is not allways adviseable to transport/process video in RGB format and it is better to convert into YUV and keep it until just before displaying. The problem with RGB is that all differential delays and amplitude/bandwidth differences show up in the luma channel where the eye is very sensitive for. That why pro's love YUV..
- there is often confusion w.r.t. "components"...also RGB belongs to the component world.
- most of the time RGB signals inputted in consumer TV's are at least converted first to YUV (in order to be able to adjust saturation) and then again decoded into RGB for displaying. Some European TV brands even reencode the RGB signal again in the PAL format, decode and convert again into rgb for displaying.
So, if you go for RGB first compaire to S-video interconnection

January 7th, 2004, 01:45 PM	#1
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	s-video vs. component illustrated Here's a good page describing and depicting the differences among the various video cabling methods: http://www.hifi-writer.com/he/video/index.htm

January 7th, 2004, 07:02 PM	#2
Ben Wiens Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 56	Thanks Thanks for the link. My TV doesn't have AVin or S-video or anything else. I use AVout from my camcorder to AVin on my VCR. So does this meand that my TV is really only seeing RF which is the poorest quality of the signals?

January 7th, 2004, 08:12 PM	#4
Ben Wiens Regular Crew Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 56	Firewire TV input Now that link did not include Firewire input. I understand that some of the newer TVs (maybe HDTV) have Firewire input on the TV. Would that result in as good or better quality than component? Also why do TVs use component and not just Firewire?

January 10th, 2004, 03:13 AM	#8
Greg Boston Wrangler Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: DFW area, TX Posts: 6,117 Images: 1	firewire on hdtv/camcorder Gints, I tried to do this very thing with my panasonic and mitsubishi hdtv and it doesn't work. As someone already noted, and what I found by reading the manual afterwards is that it only recognizes MPEG-2 stream on the firewire port. I think I read somewhere that this was to prevent pirating HD onto your camcorder. I can however, control the camcorder through the firewire link (the tv recognizes the pana when I plug it in), but the audio and video links have to be analog or the device must recognize MPEG-2( ie: DVHS). Of course, the camcorder only recognizes the DV stream format so all I get is blue screen when I put the camcorder in VCR mode. I thought I would finally be able to record OTA signals to my camcorder to play back in high def but nope, can't do that. regards, -gb-

January 7th, 2004, 07:14 PM	#3
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Yep. You'd be amazed at what you're missing as compared to component video on an LCD screen. That's a good link, but the photos don't really do justice to the overall picture quality that you can see on a progressive scan component input device at 480p...

January 7th, 2004, 08:44 PM	#5
Jeff Smallwood New Boot Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: St. James, Missouri Posts: 23	Yeah, thanks for the link, I was never quite sure on some of those facts.

January 7th, 2004, 09:11 PM	#6
Gints Klimanis Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,222	>Would that result in as good or better quality than component? It depends on the signal path for the Firewire input. I think that most of these connectors are for MPEG2 signals from satellite boxes, HDTV tuners, D-VHS and the like. Has anyone ever plugged a camcorder Firewire output to a Firewire connector on a TV? >Also why do TVs use component and not just Firewire? There seems to be a digital interface war. A few TVs (notably Mitsubishi) include a Firewire connector but most provide some sort of DVI. Mind you, this isn't always the same DVI used by computer video cards for LCD monitors. A friend of mine is driving a plasma display with the DVI output of an ATI video card, though. Also, a word of warning about Firewire inputs/outputs on DVD recorders. Many will recompress the DV25 stream to MPEG2 before converting to analog. Jeez !

January 8th, 2004, 08:47 AM	#7
Boyd Ostroff Wrangler Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Mays Landing, NJ Posts: 11,802	Transcoding firewire to component video using a DVD recorder has been discussed in a couple other threads, and this same point was raised. I have a Sony RDR-GX7 DVD recorder which I use for this purpose. I use a 17" Sony 16:9 LCD monitor connected via component, and I feed firewire from my Mac running FCP to the DVD recorder. I have no way to tell if some MPEG conversion is taking place, but the results look phenomenal on the LCD panel; it's considerably cleaner looking than s-video. I can't see any hint of MPEG artifacts, but when I burn DVD's at the highest quality setting (1 hour per disk) I really can't see any difference between the original DV either. But the GX7 is one of the more expensive DVD recorders, so maybe the cheap ones don't do as good a job?

January 10th, 2004, 06:24 AM	#9
Andre De Clercq Major Player Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Belgium Posts: 804	The link posted by Gints is very interesting. A few remarks however: - the last picture with its color fringing in the multiburst path, shows why it is not allways adviseable to transport/process video in RGB format and it is better to convert into YUV and keep it until just before displaying. The problem with RGB is that all differential delays and amplitude/bandwidth differences show up in the luma channel where the eye is very sensitive for. That why pro's love YUV.. - there is often confusion w.r.t. "components"...also RGB belongs to the component world. - most of the time RGB signals inputted in consumer TV's are at least converted first to YUV (in order to be able to adjust saturation) and then again decoded into RGB for displaying. Some European TV brands even reencode the RGB signal again in the PAL format, decode and convert again into rgb for displaying. So, if you go for RGB first compaire to S-video interconnection