An Inexperienced Question at DVinfo.net

Mark Moore · December 24th, 2002, 08:29 PM

It has been suggested (on this board and others), in order to save the heads, etc. of your 'good' camcorder, that you should buy an inexpensive one as an editing deck (to rewind, etc.).

My question is: If I shoot raw footage on my (3CCD) GL-1, take that tape to my cheap (1CCD) SEARS camcorder to import into PREMIERE, edit and export back to the cheap SEARS camera, do I lose significant picture quality because I ran it through a 1CCD camera, or is the original 3CCD image quality maintained?

Did I explain that right? If there is no quality loss, then why spend several hundred dollars on a mini-DV deck (unless you can afford it!), when you can buy a 1CCD camera for a couple of hundred, that will do the same thing? Of course, if you do lose image quality, why use the 'cheap' camera?

Thanks for the advice and input. Oh, and happy holidays, all.

Matt Betea · December 24th, 2002, 09:23 PM

hi mark,
i'll try my best. using a cheaper camera. to use as a deck will not effect your footage at all. playback and recording to tape (from another source) have nothing to do with the ccd(s). so you can rest.

the reason why you see expensive dv decks and people using them is because those components are built to take the abuse a lot more than the camera. there are also some features i believe that are exclusive to the decks. i've heard too decks can usually do same tasks quicker (rewind, search/jog).

i think this is pretty on, but i can't be 100% sure seeing as i don't have a deck. i'm sure people that do can verify or correct the given info.

Edward Troxel · December 24th, 2002, 11:13 PM

The ONLY time you will see a difference between 3-CCD and 1-CCD cameras is when you actually record through the lens of the camera. When playing and recording via firewire to/from a computer, it is basically a file copy so you will see NO difference in an image recorded with an XL-1 whether is is played in an XL-1 or the cheapest MiniDV Camera you can find. When recording back from the computer, you will also see NO difference.

Mark Moore · December 25th, 2002, 01:55 AM

Thank you for the information. Then the suggestions of saving your camera by using a cheaper one for editing sounds like good advice.

I can't afford a mini-DV deck, so using a cheap camera sounds like a better option for me, saving wear and tear on the GL1.

Thanks.

Barend Onneweer · December 25th, 2002, 03:24 AM

The advantage of DV decks are often component video (high quality) outputs and inputs - for interchange of betacam material or the like, and for high-quality monitoring.

Also more elaborate audio signal monitoring with meters and knobs.

Most DV decks also support DVCAM which as a format has more time-code functionality and locked audio (and a higher tapespeed so less prone to drop-outs).

Apart from that the tape transports are built more solid, so the device will probably last a bit longer - and tape transport will be faster.

That said, if your budget doesn't allow for one, getting yourself the cheapest miniDV camera with digital I/O is a great idea to prevent unneccesary wear on the heads of your main camera.

Bar3nd

Nathan Gifford · December 25th, 2002, 07:31 AM

One other question since Mark has a GL-1, if you record in 4-track mode, will that be supported on the non-Canon deck?

Merry Christmas,

Mark Moore · December 25th, 2002, 02:55 PM

Good question, Nathan. I never thought about the sound issues. Could I lose sound quality using a cheaper camcorder for editing?

Edward Troxel · December 26th, 2002, 10:14 AM

4 track audio is a DV standard. It should pass through just fine. Works great on my deck.

Mark Moore · December 26th, 2002, 07:39 PM

Thanks for the info. A cheaper camera sounds like a better option for me than the expensive deck (at least for now!).

Tom Voigt · December 26th, 2002, 10:09 PM

Here's what's on my B&H wish list:

SR-VS30U Mini-DV/S-VHS VCR 4 Head PCM Digital Audio, Hi-Fi Stereo, Dual VCR, (Mini DVCAM Playback)

The SRVS30U Professional dual VCR incorporates the two most popular prosumer formats together in one unit, provides a complete high-performance solution for editing DV projects, mastering to S-VHS, or dubbing to or from either format. Easy integration with most NLE systems, convenient built-in editing features including automatic editing from DV to Super VHS/VHS, plus outstanding picture quality, PCM digital audio, robust tape transport mechanism. Now you can easily record and copy from DV to VHS/SVHS and visa versa. Simultaneous recording is also possible from the firewire input to both VHS/SVHS and DV.

December 24th, 2002, 08:29 PM	#1
Mark Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North Carolina Posts: 301	An Inexperienced Question It has been suggested (on this board and others), in order to save the heads, etc. of your 'good' camcorder, that you should buy an inexpensive one as an editing deck (to rewind, etc.). My question is: If I shoot raw footage on my (3CCD) GL-1, take that tape to my cheap (1CCD) SEARS camcorder to import into PREMIERE, edit and export back to the cheap SEARS camera, do I lose significant picture quality because I ran it through a 1CCD camera, or is the original 3CCD image quality maintained? Did I explain that right? If there is no quality loss, then why spend several hundred dollars on a mini-DV deck (unless you can afford it!), when you can buy a 1CCD camera for a couple of hundred, that will do the same thing? Of course, if you do lose image quality, why use the 'cheap' camera? Thanks for the advice and input. Oh, and happy holidays, all. __________________ Mark Moore Sugar Free Productions

December 24th, 2002, 09:23 PM	#2
Matt Betea Regular Crew Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: detroit, mi Posts: 187	hi mark, i'll try my best. using a cheaper camera. to use as a deck will not effect your footage at all. playback and recording to tape (from another source) have nothing to do with the ccd(s). so you can rest. the reason why you see expensive dv decks and people using them is because those components are built to take the abuse a lot more than the camera. there are also some features i believe that are exclusive to the decks. i've heard too decks can usually do same tasks quicker (rewind, search/jog). i think this is pretty on, but i can't be 100% sure seeing as i don't have a deck. i'm sure people that do can verify or correct the given info. __________________ Matrix metering is for girls.

December 25th, 2002, 01:55 AM	#4
Mark Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North Carolina Posts: 301	Thank you for the information. Then the suggestions of saving your camera by using a cheaper one for editing sounds like good advice. I can't afford a mini-DV deck, so using a cheap camera sounds like a better option for me, saving wear and tear on the GL1. Thanks. __________________ Mark Moore Sugar Free Productions

December 25th, 2002, 03:24 AM	#5
Barend Onneweer Regular Crew Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Netherlands Posts: 111	The advantage of DV decks are often component video (high quality) outputs and inputs - for interchange of betacam material or the like, and for high-quality monitoring. Also more elaborate audio signal monitoring with meters and knobs. Most DV decks also support DVCAM which as a format has more time-code functionality and locked audio (and a higher tapespeed so less prone to drop-outs). Apart from that the tape transports are built more solid, so the device will probably last a bit longer - and tape transport will be faster. That said, if your budget doesn't allow for one, getting yourself the cheapest miniDV camera with digital I/O is a great idea to prevent unneccesary wear on the heads of your main camera. Bar3nd __________________ www.raamw3rk.net digital storytelling and vfx

December 25th, 2002, 07:31 AM	#6
Nathan Gifford Wrangler Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Tickfaw, LA Posts: 1,217	Is 4-track preserved? One other question since Mark has a GL-1, if you record in 4-track mode, will that be supported on the non-Canon deck? Merry Christmas, __________________ Nathan Gifford Southern Cyclist Magazine & Productions For quick answers try our Search! To see me and Rob Lohman click here

December 24th, 2002, 11:13 PM	#3
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	The ONLY time you will see a difference between 3-CCD and 1-CCD cameras is when you actually record through the lens of the camera. When playing and recording via firewire to/from a computer, it is basically a file copy so you will see NO difference in an image recorded with an XL-1 whether is is played in an XL-1 or the cheapest MiniDV Camera you can find. When recording back from the computer, you will also see NO difference.

December 25th, 2002, 02:55 PM	#7
Mark Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North Carolina Posts: 301	Good question, Nathan. I never thought about the sound issues. Could I lose sound quality using a cheaper camcorder for editing? __________________ Mark Moore Sugar Free Productions

December 26th, 2002, 10:14 AM	#8
Edward Troxel Sponsor: JET DV Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern Illinois Posts: 7,953	4 track audio is a DV standard. It should pass through just fine. Works great on my deck.

December 26th, 2002, 07:39 PM	#9
Mark Moore Major Player Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: North Carolina Posts: 301	Thanks for the info. A cheaper camera sounds like a better option for me than the expensive deck (at least for now!). __________________ Mark Moore Sugar Free Productions

December 26th, 2002, 10:09 PM	#10
Tom Voigt Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 92	JVC Dual mini-DV, S-VHS deck $825 Here's what's on my B&H wish list: SR-VS30U Mini-DV/S-VHS VCR 4 Head PCM Digital Audio, Hi-Fi Stereo, Dual VCR, (Mini DVCAM Playback) The SRVS30U Professional dual VCR incorporates the two most popular prosumer formats together in one unit, provides a complete high-performance solution for editing DV projects, mastering to S-VHS, or dubbing to or from either format. Easy integration with most NLE systems, convenient built-in editing features including automatic editing from DV to Super VHS/VHS, plus outstanding picture quality, PCM digital audio, robust tape transport mechanism. Now you can easily record and copy from DV to VHS/SVHS and visa versa. Simultaneous recording is also possible from the firewire input to both VHS/SVHS and DV.