WOOHOO PC Blows doors off Dual MAC G4 at DVinfo.net

Bill Ravens · July 24th, 2002, 08:13 AM

In tests run by Digital Video Editing.com, both a single CPU PC and a duallie AMD PC blew the doors off of a MAC G4 duallie!!
See the story at: http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/Htm/DVEditHomeSet1.htm

The surprise is that a single Intel P4 PC tied a dual AMD system from Boxx.

Dan Holly · July 24th, 2002, 03:40 PM

Bill,
I have a slight slant on this subject since I worked for Intel for 13 years. In fact, I worked in and around the FAB's in Rio Rancho NM. just down the road a bit from you.....for 7+ years.

I will say this;
My current editing box runs a P4 1.8 with DDR RAM, and it's true that the P4 is optimized for video editing, so their comparison is correct. I have yet to test the 533 FSB chips, but I just upgraded my motherboard to support the new FSB in a future CPU upgrade.

I've run my own personal side by side tests to validate, since I have access to all systems you speak of. All of my tests are based on rendering. The single P4 wins hands down (not testing the P4 Xeon).

In conclusion, there are drawbacks to each and every system in one form or another. It all boils down to the old "Ford vs Chevy" wrestling match ;)

Rgds.,
Dan

George Gerez · July 25th, 2002, 09:17 AM

What about using those Intel ZEON CPUs. They have come down alot in price I wonder if what would be the best CPU to use in a DUAL CPU system (AMD, Pentium 4, or Zeon)

Any comments?

Bill Ravens · July 25th, 2002, 09:25 AM

In a duallie configuration, AMD still rules. But, that's only because there are no duallie mobo's based on the P4 533FSB CPU yet. Give it some time.

Comparison test articles show a single CPU is actually faster in some memory intensive applications because of the memory bandwidth utilization. A duallie system chokes the memory bandwidth. PC2700 or PC3000, if and when it becomes a reality will help alleviate this problem.

Dylan Couper · July 25th, 2002, 10:47 AM

Given equal CPUs, memory etc, how much faster are dual systems than single CPU systems? On average?
I'm just curious if the power gain justifies the extra cost.
Thanks

Bill Ravens · July 25th, 2002, 10:53 AM

In my experience, a duallie system doesn't offer anything in the way of performance improvement unless the software is multi-threaded. Vegas Video and TMPGENc utilize multiple processors, Premier, Avid, and some others do not. The real advantage in multi-processor systems is stability. It's possible to move the mouse without causing a system lock-up.

Rob Lohman · July 26th, 2002, 03:48 AM

bill... mouse is moved by a hardware triggered (IRQ) event and
then handled in ring 0 code (this code can do ANYTHING). Even
when everything else is locked beyond locking my mouse still
moves :P ... But, one advantage to multiprocessors can be if
your doing CPU intensive stuff that you have another CPU
available to do other things. Responsiveness may also increase.

You will benefit the most thought with applications that natively
support MP (multi processor) systems. I think it is much more
wise now-a-days to infest in the fastest proc. you can buy with
a large amount of memory and large capacity harddisks. That
will buy you more for the money i think.

Weren't there also new Intel processors (or coming) that are
more or less dual processors on one chip? This was some
virtual technique that increased the power even more. Windows
will actually think that your system has 2 processors. Although
this is not a truly MP system, it did increase performance by
a significant amount!.... don't know where I read an article
about it though

Bill Ravens · July 26th, 2002, 06:54 AM

Rob...

Yeah, it's called hyperthreading by M$. It's really designed to make multi-processing even better than the current state of the art, but, it won't be available until the 64bit architecture comes out, I think.

Paul Sedillo · July 26th, 2002, 09:49 AM

<<<-- Originally posted by RC Productions : Bill,
I have a slight slant on this subject since I worked for Intel for 13 years. In fact, I worked in and around the FAB's in Rio Rancho NM. just down the road a bit from you.....for 7+ years.

Dan -->>>

Dan,

I grew up in the area that you worked. Do you miss the New Mexico style Mexican food? My aunt has been working for Intel in Rio Rancho since they opened. She is a technical writer for one of the divisions.

It is cool to see somebody how is from my neck of the woods!

Dan Holly · July 26th, 2002, 01:17 PM

NM has some of the best food in the world ! Their "New Mexican" version of dishes is something you don't want to miss in your lifetime if you have the chance(tip for other readers).

To be honest, and hopefully not offend anyone since that is not my intention......

I don't miss NM one bit, but I do miss their food and their green chilies. It was by far the most boring place I've ever lived.

Northern NM is beautiful and has some great fishing and hunting if you are in to that type of thing.

I met my wife there, and she was born and raised in the Albuquerque area (so that is a plus). A small portion of her family still lives there, but most of them have since moved to Denver.

I have numerous friends still working and living around the the Rio Rancho campus, and I keep in touch with them on a frequent basis.

Bill Ravens · July 26th, 2002, 01:20 PM

Rio Raunchy is, indeed, a boring place.

Paul Sedillo · July 26th, 2002, 01:50 PM

<<<-- Originally posted by billravens : Rio Raunchy is, indeed, a boring place. -->>>

LOL no doubt about that! I actually lived in Corrales, which is just the opposite.

As for leaving Albuquerque, I can't say I miss the area...but I do miss my family. I agree regarding the comment about Northern New Mexico. Nothing like it on the planet. My goal is to someday buy property in Taos. Man I love that area. Plus I love to fresh water fishing.

Regarding the food, yes it is beyond description. The green and red chili is like heaven on earth. Makes me hungry just thinking about it.

Bill Ravens · July 29th, 2002, 07:37 AM

For those of you interested in Micro$oft's hyperthreading technology, there's some good articles over at www.2cpu.com. It looks like Intel will release a hyperthreading P4 next year.

Rik Sanchez · July 29th, 2002, 09:59 AM

you guys are making me homesick talking about chile. NM has the best chile on the planet. I grew up in El Paso and we would drive up to NM and go to one of the chile farms and pick our own chile, buy several large sacks and then roast them and
put them in the freezer and when it ran out we would go and get some more.

haven't had any since I was back home visiting my family in '98. What do you guys think about menudo? you guys are
lucky to live back in the states with all that great food nearby. my kingdom for menudo, green chile, and chorizo.

Bill Ravens · July 29th, 2002, 10:02 AM

Hatch rules!!!
menudo??? yikes!!! Breakfast of Champions

July 24th, 2002, 08:13 AM	#1
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	WOOHOO PC Blows doors off Dual MAC G4 In tests run by Digital Video Editing.com, both a single CPU PC and a duallie AMD PC blew the doors off of a MAC G4 duallie!! See the story at: http://www.digitalvideoediting.com/Htm/DVEditHomeSet1.htm The surprise is that a single Intel P4 PC tied a dual AMD system from Boxx.

July 24th, 2002, 03:40 PM	#2
Dan Holly Major Player Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 336	PC vs MAC Bill, I have a slight slant on this subject since I worked for Intel for 13 years. In fact, I worked in and around the FAB's in Rio Rancho NM. just down the road a bit from you.....for 7+ years. I will say this; My current editing box runs a P4 1.8 with DDR RAM, and it's true that the P4 is optimized for video editing, so their comparison is correct. I have yet to test the 533 FSB chips, but I just upgraded my motherboard to support the new FSB in a future CPU upgrade. I've run my own personal side by side tests to validate, since I have access to all systems you speak of. All of my tests are based on rendering. The single P4 wins hands down (not testing the P4 Xeon). In conclusion, there are drawbacks to each and every system in one form or another. It all boils down to the old "Ford vs Chevy" wrestling match ;) Rgds., Dan __________________ Dan Holly Anchorage, Alaska

July 25th, 2002, 09:17 AM	#3
George Gerez Regular Crew Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Miami, Florida Posts: 49	What about using those Intel ZEON CPUs. They have come down alot in price I wonder if what would be the best CPU to use in a DUAL CPU system (AMD, Pentium 4, or Zeon) Any comments? __________________ George Gerez Tamarac, FL (Broward County) (954)821-3866 gerez@bellsouth.net --- PC Based editor: Adobe Premier Pro, Canopus DV Storm Pro. SONY VX2000, Panasonic DVX100a

July 26th, 2002, 03:48 AM	#7
Rob Lohman RED Code Chef Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Holland Posts: 12,514	bill... mouse is moved by a hardware triggered (IRQ) event and then handled in ring 0 code (this code can do ANYTHING). Even when everything else is locked beyond locking my mouse still moves :P ... But, one advantage to multiprocessors can be if your doing CPU intensive stuff that you have another CPU available to do other things. Responsiveness may also increase. You will benefit the most thought with applications that natively support MP (multi processor) systems. I think it is much more wise now-a-days to infest in the fastest proc. you can buy with a large amount of memory and large capacity harddisks. That will buy you more for the money i think. Weren't there also new Intel processors (or coming) that are more or less dual processors on one chip? This was some virtual technique that increased the power even more. Windows will actually think that your system has 2 processors. Although this is not a truly MP system, it did increase performance by a significant amount!.... don't know where I read an article about it though __________________ Rob Lohman, visuar@iname.com DV Info Wrangler & RED Code Chef Join the DV Challenge \| Lady X Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Buy from the best: DVinfo.net sponsors

July 26th, 2002, 09:49 AM	#9
Paul Sedillo Major Player Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 607	Re: PC vs MAC <<<-- Originally posted by RC Productions : Bill, I have a slight slant on this subject since I worked for Intel for 13 years. In fact, I worked in and around the FAB's in Rio Rancho NM. just down the road a bit from you.....for 7+ years. Dan -->>> Dan, I grew up in the area that you worked. Do you miss the New Mexico style Mexican food? My aunt has been working for Intel in Rio Rancho since they opened. She is a technical writer for one of the divisions. It is cool to see somebody how is from my neck of the woods! __________________ Paul Sedillo Image::Studio http://www.image-studio.com Houston, Texas

July 25th, 2002, 09:25 AM	#4
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	In a duallie configuration, AMD still rules. But, that's only because there are no duallie mobo's based on the P4 533FSB CPU yet. Give it some time. Comparison test articles show a single CPU is actually faster in some memory intensive applications because of the memory bandwidth utilization. A duallie system chokes the memory bandwidth. PC2700 or PC3000, if and when it becomes a reality will help alleviate this problem.

July 25th, 2002, 10:47 AM	#5
Dylan Couper Wrangler Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia Posts: 8,314	Given equal CPUs, memory etc, how much faster are dual systems than single CPU systems? On average? I'm just curious if the power gain justifies the extra cost. Thanks

July 25th, 2002, 10:53 AM	#6
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	In my experience, a duallie system doesn't offer anything in the way of performance improvement unless the software is multi-threaded. Vegas Video and TMPGENc utilize multiple processors, Premier, Avid, and some others do not. The real advantage in multi-processor systems is stability. It's possible to move the mouse without causing a system lock-up.

July 26th, 2002, 06:54 AM	#8
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	Rob... Yeah, it's called hyperthreading by M$. It's really designed to make multi-processing even better than the current state of the art, but, it won't be available until the 64bit architecture comes out, I think.

July 26th, 2002, 01:17 PM	#10
Dan Holly Major Player Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Anchorage, Alaska Posts: 336	Rio Rancho NM has some of the best food in the world ! Their "New Mexican" version of dishes is something you don't want to miss in your lifetime if you have the chance(tip for other readers). To be honest, and hopefully not offend anyone since that is not my intention...... I don't miss NM one bit, but I do miss their food and their green chilies. It was by far the most boring place I've ever lived. Northern NM is beautiful and has some great fishing and hunting if you are in to that type of thing. I met my wife there, and she was born and raised in the Albuquerque area (so that is a plus). A small portion of her family still lives there, but most of them have since moved to Denver. I have numerous friends still working and living around the the Rio Rancho campus, and I keep in touch with them on a frequent basis. __________________ Dan Holly Anchorage, Alaska

July 26th, 2002, 01:20 PM	#11
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	Rio Raunchy is, indeed, a boring place.

July 26th, 2002, 01:50 PM	#12
Paul Sedillo Major Player Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 607	<<<-- Originally posted by billravens : Rio Raunchy is, indeed, a boring place. -->>> LOL no doubt about that! I actually lived in Corrales, which is just the opposite. As for leaving Albuquerque, I can't say I miss the area...but I do miss my family. I agree regarding the comment about Northern New Mexico. Nothing like it on the planet. My goal is to someday buy property in Taos. Man I love that area. Plus I love to fresh water fishing. Regarding the food, yes it is beyond description. The green and red chili is like heaven on earth. Makes me hungry just thinking about it. __________________ Paul Sedillo Image::Studio http://www.image-studio.com Houston, Texas

July 29th, 2002, 07:37 AM	#13
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	For those of you interested in Micro$oft's hyperthreading technology, there's some good articles over at www.2cpu.com. It looks like Intel will release a hyperthreading P4 next year.

July 29th, 2002, 09:59 AM	#14
Rik Sanchez ChorizoSmells Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Osaka, Japan Posts: 424	you guys are making me homesick talking about chile. NM has the best chile on the planet. I grew up in El Paso and we would drive up to NM and go to one of the chile farms and pick our own chile, buy several large sacks and then roast them and put them in the freezer and when it ran out we would go and get some more. haven't had any since I was back home visiting my family in '98. What do you guys think about menudo? you guys are lucky to live back in the states with all that great food nearby. my kingdom for menudo, green chile, and chorizo. __________________ ChorizoSmells Video Barrio Tamatsukuri, Osaka, JAPAN

July 29th, 2002, 10:02 AM	#15
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	Hatch rules!!! menudo??? yikes!!! Breakfast of Champions