Northwood P4 going away at DVinfo.net

Mike Rehmus · May 3rd, 2004, 09:03 PM

I believe Intel will phase out this design about June of this year. That, apparently, includes the 478-pin package.

Right now, it is as good for most uses as the newer processors that cost more.

So if you have a 478 motherboard with a slow chip, you might want to consider finding a good buy on the 3.2 or 3.4 GHz processors in the next month.

Right now I can buy the 3.2 800 FSB HT Intel Retail Pack for $289, the 3.4 for $400 and the Extreme for $1100!

The 3.2 seems the best price/performance.

BTW, I have no direct knowledge (Intel rarely calls me directly) of the impending demise of the 478 or the Northwood other than what I read on a few hardware sites.

Casey Visco · May 3rd, 2004, 10:24 PM

Actually I still think the P4 2.8ghz processors are the best price/performance ratio at around $170-$180. The performance gains from a .4ghz increase arent enough for me to shell out an extra $110 - $120 dollars for. But thats just my humble opinion ;) I build a lot of custom systems for the type of work that I do...so I try to save money where I can.

Zack Birlew · May 3rd, 2004, 10:30 PM

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, now...you're saying that the Northwood is being phased out? Not likely bud. There isn't going to be any other socket changes until Tejas comes out 2005/2006 =P. Unless you mean that the lower level Northwoods are being phased out (like 2.2-2.5 range) then I have no idea. You should be a tad more specific, man. Now that I think about it, perhaps you mean that Intel is making way with their Extreme Edition chips? If so, then coolness, because that will equal lower price P4EE's! =D Reply soon so I can find out whether I'm getting my hopes up or not!

Casey Visco · May 3rd, 2004, 10:37 PM

Jack, are you overclocking to hit the 4ghz mark? ;)

Zack Birlew · May 3rd, 2004, 10:40 PM

Yep, how'd you guess? =D

Watercooling is great, but, only get Danger Den, everything else pales in comparison.

Casey Visco · May 3rd, 2004, 10:58 PM

I've been seriously thinking about moving into water cooling some of my systems. I'm at a crossroads in terms of how to take care of the excessive noise from my computers. It's either watercool or spend thousands of dollars setting up a separate "server room" and running a fat pipe full of cabling into my editing room.

Panaflo fans, sure they are quieter than your average fan, but when you have 8 of them in one case like I do...!

Any recommended links on the Danger Den stuff, Jack?

Peter Moore · May 4th, 2004, 08:09 AM

If Northwood is being phased out, what is going to replace it? There are no fundamentally new chip designs around the corner. Maybe next year or the year after. I agree a new design is long overdue but where is it?

Oh about that watercooling system, can anyone post a link to where to buy something like this? I want something I can just plug in and not have to worry about - rather than some self-mod kit. I'd love to get my PC to 4.0. Right now it's at 3.520 and doing great, just on air cooling (Coolermaster Jet4) but I'm reluctant to bring it up any more.

Bill Ravens · May 4th, 2004, 10:09 AM

Northwood will be replaced by a newer chip design manufactured with 1 Mb L2 cache and using the 90nm process. Test reports I've read show no significant performance advantage to this design, as far as video processing is concerned. The reason for going to the 90nm process is because it's the next step in upping the CPU speed over 3.4 Mhz. I beleive the 90nm process also allows for the power consumption to go down, resulting in a cooler running chip.

Glenn Chan · May 4th, 2004, 11:12 AM

Quote:

I've been seriously thinking about moving into water cooling some of my systems. I'm at a crossroads in terms of how to take care of the excessive noise from my computers. It's either watercool or spend thousands of dollars setting up a separate "server room" and running a fat pipe full of cabling into my editing room.

Panaflo fans, sure they are quieter than your average fan, but when you have 8 of them in one case like I do...!

Casey, check out www.silentpcreview.com. It's got A LOT of information on quiet computers. Water cooling doesn't seem too popular there. Water cooling would definitely get rid of CPU fan noise, but then you have power supply and hard drive noise to contend with.

Probably the most economical thing to do is to get the Antec 3700BQE case (read the review and the review discussion for it) and mod the power supply fan with a quieter one or get another PSU. Hard drives... decouple them (so they don't transmit vibrations to the case) by suspending them or by mounting them on Sorbothane strips. For the CPU get a thermalright heatsink or the zalman aluminum+copper one (the thermalright should be better at higher temps). If that's not good enough then get long cables and move your computer away.

If you want to overclock while keeping your computer silent, then watercool would be worth looking at. Watercooling has high initial investment... but it shouldn't become obsolete that fast.

Zack Birlew · May 4th, 2004, 01:53 PM

Well, for watercooling stuff, I'd recommend Danger Den's official site or you can go to Frozencpu.com and buy the Danger Den stuff from them. Definitely get either MAZE4 waterblocks or get the "White Water" block (has three outlets instead of two). FrozenCPU has some more cool stuff, like UV reactive reservoirs and things like that. But here are my basic rules about watercooling:

1. Use 1/2 fittings only, this style is the best performing.

2. Get an Enheim pump (they are the best)

3. Use either distilled water or my own concotion which includes Antifreeze, UV water dye, and tap water (depends on location's quality of water, otherwise use distilled)

4. Get big radiators (I recommend the Danger Den Black Ice Xtreme 1 or 2, depending on your case size)

5. Leak test the setup BEFORE putting the computer parts in.

And that's about it, I don't know if you guys want to cut up your computers with Dremels but you can always buy a premodified case. Also, if you don't want to build your own watercooling setup, I highly recommend the Koolance EXOS system for those that want something easy to set up, silent, and with good performance. With the EXOS, all you have to do is apply the tubing, install the waterblocks, and set the thing on top of your case, simple as that. But if you get the EXOS, don't use my Antifreeze recipe, Koolance includes its own liquid for the EXOS. If you need any help, just go to the Futuremark.com forums, everybody is helpful there when it comes to H2O cooling.

Casey Visco · May 4th, 2004, 09:33 PM

Jack - thanks for the info. I'm very much a do-it-yourself, I designed and built for the most part my own systems as well as the workstations I use at work. And to boot, i'm a Lian-Li case junkie, so thats what I mainly use. Im no stranger to the dremel, we modified our cases as soon as we got them.

Funny you should mention frozencpu.com, they supplied quite a lot of the components I built into my workstations. I never really looked at their watercooling selection much though, since It's not an area of expertise for me, I went with heavy air cooling (this is for dual xeon workstations mind you) instead. But even with integrated fan controllers, to turn the fans down when not rendering, it's just too noisy.

I'm gonna go take a look at those other sites now, though...at least for my work computers, we're leaning more toward actually moving all of the processing equipment to another room...but I'll probably be doing a watercooling setup for my home systems.

Thanks for the links and the advice, I got some research to do now =)

Rob Belics · May 5th, 2004, 07:03 AM

Didn't the Prescott come out after Northwood? Intel introduced a new Prescott this week. I don't follow this like I used to.

The big emphasis now is on 64-bitters but that doesn't mean 32-bits is going away anytime soon.

Mike Rehmus · May 5th, 2004, 09:58 PM

Prescott is the new toy on the block. smaller traces so it can go faster someday.

I figure 64 bit that is useful to NLE is about 6-12 months away so I just bought a 3.2 GHz Northwood. Made quite a difference over the 2.4 it replaced for RT operation.

Did I see somewhere that they are talking about a 700+ pin package for the new processors?

Peter Moore · May 7th, 2004, 12:30 PM

Here's some new info:

http://money.cnn.com/2004/05/07/technology/intel.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes

It sounds like Intel will be scrapping the Pentium 4 thankfully and will finally come up with a new design next year. Although from the article it's hard for me to tell how this is different from having dual-processors, but I'm sure there's more to it. Sounds interesting at least.

Mike Rehmus · May 7th, 2004, 03:19 PM

Yes, and they are no longer going to spec the clock speed of the processor.

May 3rd, 2004, 09:03 PM	#1
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	Northwood P4 going away I believe Intel will phase out this design about June of this year. That, apparently, includes the 478-pin package. Right now, it is as good for most uses as the newer processors that cost more. So if you have a 478 motherboard with a slow chip, you might want to consider finding a good buy on the 3.2 or 3.4 GHz processors in the next month. Right now I can buy the 3.2 800 FSB HT Intel Retail Pack for $289, the 3.4 for $400 and the Extreme for $1100! The 3.2 seems the best price/performance. BTW, I have no direct knowledge (Intel rarely calls me directly) of the impending demise of the 478 or the Northwood other than what I read on a few hardware sites. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

May 3rd, 2004, 10:24 PM	#2
Casey Visco Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 280	Actually I still think the P4 2.8ghz processors are the best price/performance ratio at around $170-$180. The performance gains from a .4ghz increase arent enough for me to shell out an extra $110 - $120 dollars for. But thats just my humble opinion ;) I build a lot of custom systems for the type of work that I do...so I try to save money where I can. __________________ Casey Visco Glidecam Industries, Inc.

May 3rd, 2004, 10:30 PM	#3
Zack Birlew Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 613	Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, now...you're saying that the Northwood is being phased out? Not likely bud. There isn't going to be any other socket changes until Tejas comes out 2005/2006 =P. Unless you mean that the lower level Northwoods are being phased out (like 2.2-2.5 range) then I have no idea. You should be a tad more specific, man. Now that I think about it, perhaps you mean that Intel is making way with their Extreme Edition chips? If so, then coolness, because that will equal lower price P4EE's! =D Reply soon so I can find out whether I'm getting my hopes up or not! __________________ "Babs Do or Babs Do not, there is no try." - Zack Birlew www.BabsDoProductions.com

May 3rd, 2004, 10:37 PM	#4
Casey Visco Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 280	Jack, are you overclocking to hit the 4ghz mark? ;) __________________ Casey Visco Glidecam Industries, Inc.

May 3rd, 2004, 10:40 PM	#5
Zack Birlew Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 613	Yep, how'd you guess? =D Watercooling is great, but, only get Danger Den, everything else pales in comparison. __________________ "Babs Do or Babs Do not, there is no try." - Zack Birlew www.BabsDoProductions.com

May 3rd, 2004, 10:58 PM	#6
Casey Visco Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 280	I've been seriously thinking about moving into water cooling some of my systems. I'm at a crossroads in terms of how to take care of the excessive noise from my computers. It's either watercool or spend thousands of dollars setting up a separate "server room" and running a fat pipe full of cabling into my editing room. Panaflo fans, sure they are quieter than your average fan, but when you have 8 of them in one case like I do...! Any recommended links on the Danger Den stuff, Jack? __________________ Casey Visco Glidecam Industries, Inc.

May 4th, 2004, 08:09 AM	#7
Peter Moore Trustee Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Arlington VA Posts: 1,034	If Northwood is being phased out, what is going to replace it? There are no fundamentally new chip designs around the corner. Maybe next year or the year after. I agree a new design is long overdue but where is it? Oh about that watercooling system, can anyone post a link to where to buy something like this? I want something I can just plug in and not have to worry about - rather than some self-mod kit. I'd love to get my PC to 4.0. Right now it's at 3.520 and doing great, just on air cooling (Coolermaster Jet4) but I'm reluctant to bring it up any more.

May 4th, 2004, 10:09 AM	#8
Bill Ravens Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: santa fe, nm Posts: 3,264 Images: 10	Northwood will be replaced by a newer chip design manufactured with 1 Mb L2 cache and using the 90nm process. Test reports I've read show no significant performance advantage to this design, as far as video processing is concerned. The reason for going to the 90nm process is because it's the next step in upping the CPU speed over 3.4 Mhz. I beleive the 90nm process also allows for the power consumption to go down, resulting in a cooler running chip.

May 4th, 2004, 01:53 PM	#10
Zack Birlew Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Las Vegas, NV Posts: 613	Well, for watercooling stuff, I'd recommend Danger Den's official site or you can go to Frozencpu.com and buy the Danger Den stuff from them. Definitely get either MAZE4 waterblocks or get the "White Water" block (has three outlets instead of two). FrozenCPU has some more cool stuff, like UV reactive reservoirs and things like that. But here are my basic rules about watercooling: 1. Use 1/2 fittings only, this style is the best performing. 2. Get an Enheim pump (they are the best) 3. Use either distilled water or my own concotion which includes Antifreeze, UV water dye, and tap water (depends on location's quality of water, otherwise use distilled) 4. Get big radiators (I recommend the Danger Den Black Ice Xtreme 1 or 2, depending on your case size) 5. Leak test the setup BEFORE putting the computer parts in. And that's about it, I don't know if you guys want to cut up your computers with Dremels but you can always buy a premodified case. Also, if you don't want to build your own watercooling setup, I highly recommend the Koolance EXOS system for those that want something easy to set up, silent, and with good performance. With the EXOS, all you have to do is apply the tubing, install the waterblocks, and set the thing on top of your case, simple as that. But if you get the EXOS, don't use my Antifreeze recipe, Koolance includes its own liquid for the EXOS. If you need any help, just go to the Futuremark.com forums, everybody is helpful there when it comes to H2O cooling. __________________ "Babs Do or Babs Do not, there is no try." - Zack Birlew www.BabsDoProductions.com

May 4th, 2004, 09:33 PM	#11
Casey Visco Major Player Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Boston, MA Posts: 280	Jack - thanks for the info. I'm very much a do-it-yourself, I designed and built for the most part my own systems as well as the workstations I use at work. And to boot, i'm a Lian-Li case junkie, so thats what I mainly use. Im no stranger to the dremel, we modified our cases as soon as we got them. Funny you should mention frozencpu.com, they supplied quite a lot of the components I built into my workstations. I never really looked at their watercooling selection much though, since It's not an area of expertise for me, I went with heavy air cooling (this is for dual xeon workstations mind you) instead. But even with integrated fan controllers, to turn the fans down when not rendering, it's just too noisy. I'm gonna go take a look at those other sites now, though...at least for my work computers, we're leaning more toward actually moving all of the processing equipment to another room...but I'll probably be doing a watercooling setup for my home systems. Thanks for the links and the advice, I got some research to do now =) __________________ Casey Visco Glidecam Industries, Inc.

May 5th, 2004, 07:03 AM	#12
Rob Belics Major Player Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 581	Didn't the Prescott come out after Northwood? Intel introduced a new Prescott this week. I don't follow this like I used to. The big emphasis now is on 64-bitters but that doesn't mean 32-bits is going away anytime soon.

May 5th, 2004, 09:58 PM	#13
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	Prescott is the new toy on the block. smaller traces so it can go faster someday. I figure 64 bit that is useful to NLE is about 6-12 months away so I just bought a 3.2 GHz Northwood. Made quite a difference over the 2.4 it replaced for RT operation. Did I see somewhere that they are talking about a 700+ pin package for the new processors? __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!

May 7th, 2004, 12:30 PM	#14
Peter Moore Trustee Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Arlington VA Posts: 1,034	Here's some new info: http://money.cnn.com/2004/05/07/technology/intel.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes It sounds like Intel will be scrapping the Pentium 4 thankfully and will finally come up with a new design next year. Although from the article it's hard for me to tell how this is different from having dual-processors, but I'm sure there's more to it. Sounds interesting at least.

May 7th, 2004, 03:19 PM	#15
Mike Rehmus Wrangler Join Date: May 2002 Location: Vallejo, California Posts: 4,049	Yes, and they are no longer going to spec the clock speed of the processor. __________________ Mike Rehmus Hey, I can see the carrot at the end of the tunnel!