Including Time Code in frame at DVinfo.net

Rob Wilson · November 13th, 2003, 11:01 AM

I'm doing some work for attorneys. They have taped (VHS) interviews that need to have sections removed. Currently, they play the tapes on their office vcr's, log time codes from the vcr and then give me the tapes to edit. Problem being that the time code on vhs vcr's is not accurate enough for good editing. I'd like to inport the video into premiere, then add real time code into the video (overlay it on the existing video), export it back to vhs and let them log with REAL time code. Anyone know how to do that???

THANKS in advance for any info.

BTW, I'm working with them to replace the VHS with miniDV but budget constraints won't allow it now.

I'm editing using Premiere Pro and also have AE if that would help.
I use a DSR45 Deck for in and out of the computer and a JVC combo to dub dv to vhs.

Jeff Donald · November 13th, 2003, 11:33 AM

Are you using Mac or PC?

Rick Bravo · November 13th, 2003, 11:29 PM

Rob,

What kind of work are you doing for attorneys? (Depos, reenactments, interviews, etc.)

Is it really timecode, (burned in a window from the original source), control track or just resetting the counter to zero before playing back?

If they are zeroing their machines and taking notes then your are probably up the proverbial creek as the numbers hardly ever match from machine to machine, especially if the counter is mechanical, (although there are not that many around anymore), you may have better luck if the counter is electronic and counts off in minutes and seconds.

Also, if you add timecode after the fact, it is useless, (the timecode, not the content), for evidentiary purposes as opposed to timecode recorded on the original clip. If you need the timecode strictly for editing purposes, then it becomes a non-issue.

However, be prepared to be subpoenaed by the opposing attorney with regard to authenticating the tape being presented. One of the many questions that may be asked are, "what exactly did you exclude from your video, at who's direction, and what do you or your client have to hide by deleting the sections that you did?"

In Florida, we have rules of discovery where "everything" you have in evidence, whether used or not, must be disclosed to the opposing side.

No fun when you get summoned and have to testify in open court.

RB

Rob Wilson · November 13th, 2003, 11:48 PM

Rick,

Currently editing a tape made by the local PD of a interview. Done in the PD interview room (lots of echo) with consent of interviewee (now defendant). DA wants parts of it redacted. He used a zeroed out vhs like you mentioned. Not accurate enough to edit with for SURE. I've dubed to DV so have "real" time code associated with it now. Want to superimpose (onto the screen) that onto a VHS dub to give back to DA so he can identify accurate in/outs. I'll then edit accurately on my DV and dub it back to vhs. AND.. hopefully not end up in court myself but thanks for the warning.

Matthew de Jongh · November 14th, 2003, 01:12 AM

two things, i too have wondered how to put a timecode in the frame, not so much for legal reasons but just for the effect of showing a running time as part of the program, you see it a lot on tv where they do it in pseudo letterbox with the timecode running on the bottom in the black.

second, there are some great mini-dv cameras out there for $450-$500

matthew

Rick Bravo · November 14th, 2003, 07:55 AM

Rob and Matthew,

Depending on the camera you are using you should be able to call up the display screen using the camera's remote.

If that fails you can use a timecode reader. Take a look at this site from Horita.

http://www.horita.com/smptetimecode.htm#SMPTE%20LTC%20Time%20Code

Hope this helps,

RB

Jeff Donald · November 14th, 2003, 08:20 AM

Most NLE's have this feature also, which is why I asked what platform.

Matthew de Jongh · November 14th, 2003, 09:13 AM

sorry, i forgot to add that i'm using premiere pro...

matthew

Rob Wilson · November 14th, 2003, 10:21 AM

Jeff,

Sorry bout that, I went back and edited my original post to add that I'm using Premiere Pro. Thought editing would save space.

Matthew de Jongh · November 18th, 2003, 10:28 PM

so nobody knows how to do the visible timecode in premiere pro?

matthew

November 13th, 2003, 11:01 AM	#1
Rob Wilson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Posts: 473	Including Time Code in frame I'm doing some work for attorneys. They have taped (VHS) interviews that need to have sections removed. Currently, they play the tapes on their office vcr's, log time codes from the vcr and then give me the tapes to edit. Problem being that the time code on vhs vcr's is not accurate enough for good editing. I'd like to inport the video into premiere, then add real time code into the video (overlay it on the existing video), export it back to vhs and let them log with REAL time code. Anyone know how to do that??? THANKS in advance for any info. BTW, I'm working with them to replace the VHS with miniDV but budget constraints won't allow it now. I'm editing using Premiere Pro and also have AE if that would help. I use a DSR45 Deck for in and out of the computer and a JVC combo to dub dv to vhs.

November 13th, 2003, 11:33 AM	#2
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	Are you using Mac or PC? __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

November 13th, 2003, 11:29 PM	#3
Rick Bravo Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 574	Timecode...or not? Rob, What kind of work are you doing for attorneys? (Depos, reenactments, interviews, etc.) Is it really timecode, (burned in a window from the original source), control track or just resetting the counter to zero before playing back? If they are zeroing their machines and taking notes then your are probably up the proverbial creek as the numbers hardly ever match from machine to machine, especially if the counter is mechanical, (although there are not that many around anymore), you may have better luck if the counter is electronic and counts off in minutes and seconds. Also, if you add timecode after the fact, it is useless, (the timecode, not the content), for evidentiary purposes as opposed to timecode recorded on the original clip. If you need the timecode strictly for editing purposes, then it becomes a non-issue. However, be prepared to be subpoenaed by the opposing attorney with regard to authenticating the tape being presented. One of the many questions that may be asked are, "what exactly did you exclude from your video, at who's direction, and what do you or your client have to hide by deleting the sections that you did?" In Florida, we have rules of discovery where "everything" you have in evidence, whether used or not, must be disclosed to the opposing side. No fun when you get summoned and have to testify in open court. RB __________________ "The future ain't what it used to be." Yogi Berra. www.rbravo.com

November 14th, 2003, 07:55 AM	#6
Rick Bravo Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Miami, FL Posts: 574	Rob and Matthew, Depending on the camera you are using you should be able to call up the display screen using the camera's remote. If that fails you can use a timecode reader. Take a look at this site from Horita. http://www.horita.com/smptetimecode.htm#SMPTE%20LTC%20Time%20Code Hope this helps, RB __________________ "The future ain't what it used to be." Yogi Berra. www.rbravo.com

November 14th, 2003, 08:20 AM	#7
Jeff Donald Warden Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Clearwater, FL Posts: 8,287	Most NLE's have this feature also, which is why I asked what platform. __________________ Jeff Donald Carpe Diem Search DVinfo.net for quick answers \| Where to Buy? From the best in the business: DVinfo.net sponsors

November 13th, 2003, 11:48 PM	#4
Rob Wilson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Posts: 473	Rick, Currently editing a tape made by the local PD of a interview. Done in the PD interview room (lots of echo) with consent of interviewee (now defendant). DA wants parts of it redacted. He used a zeroed out vhs like you mentioned. Not accurate enough to edit with for SURE. I've dubed to DV so have "real" time code associated with it now. Want to superimpose (onto the screen) that onto a VHS dub to give back to DA so he can identify accurate in/outs. I'll then edit accurately on my DV and dub it back to vhs. AND.. hopefully not end up in court myself but thanks for the warning.

November 14th, 2003, 01:12 AM	#5
Matthew de Jongh Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: sounthern maine Posts: 344	two things, i too have wondered how to put a timecode in the frame, not so much for legal reasons but just for the effect of showing a running time as part of the program, you see it a lot on tv where they do it in pseudo letterbox with the timecode running on the bottom in the black. second, there are some great mini-dv cameras out there for $450-$500 matthew

November 14th, 2003, 09:13 AM	#8
Matthew de Jongh Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: sounthern maine Posts: 344	sorry, i forgot to add that i'm using premiere pro... matthew

November 14th, 2003, 10:21 AM	#9
Rob Wilson Major Player Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Flagstaff, AZ Posts: 473	Jeff, Sorry bout that, I went back and edited my original post to add that I'm using Premiere Pro. Thought editing would save space.

November 18th, 2003, 10:28 PM	#10
Matthew de Jongh Major Player Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: sounthern maine Posts: 344	so nobody knows how to do the visible timecode in premiere pro? matthew