POV camera for concert use

Tim Lewis · February 20th, 2014, 06:53 PM

Chris I was interested to read that you are using HF200's. I was going to suggest them perhaps as an alternative to the GoPro's. But, I didn't want to sound like I was on my favourite hobby horse.

As you must know, big batteries and big cards mean you won't run out before the end of a show. I really like the custom picture settings on them, because you can get quite a nice flat picture profile that cuts in well with bigger cameras, like my HD111.

Jim Andrada · February 20th, 2014, 09:52 PM

I've been thinking of a couple of the Canon (or similar) small camera as well. I think the GoPro is overpriced for what you get if the tiny size is not essential. I have two of them but would probably not get any more.

I just looked up the HJ200 on B&H and it said they were no longer available. Any thoughts on a similar cam?

Chris DeVoe · February 20th, 2014, 11:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Lewis

Chris I was interested to read that you are using HF200's. I was going to suggest them perhaps as an alternative to the GoPro's. But, I didn't want to sound like I was on my favourite hobby horse.

The main reason I use a GoPro around the drums, and keep them in the plastic case, is safety. I need cameras that can take the occasional drumstick hit by a hyperactive 8 year old.

Chris DeVoe · February 22nd, 2014, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Andrada

@Chris

My wife is a semi-retired concert pianist so I've gotten a lot of practice recording piano (and pianist) over the 24 years (today!) we've been married. And we're on the board of a new orchestra here in Tucson so I get to contribute all the A/V for the concerts. But I enjoy doing it.

I forgot to offer my congratulations!

My wife and I have been together for 32 years. She's the love of my life, second camera operator and most useful critic. We met because of music, both of us huge fans of Kate Bush, and I started shooting concerts by other artists we enjoy. It grew from one camera to eight, driven by my own obsessive nature.

Jim Andrada · February 23rd, 2014, 12:56 PM

Thanks much. Our orchestra will be hosting a piano soloist from Japan in a few months and she'll be staying with us. This gives me a while to experiment with how to record the concert. I've been thinking of getting a couple of the small camcorders like the Canons for the event. The GoPro's are OK, but for the money I think there are better choices when size & toughness aren't the overriding concerns.

My wife is also Japanese and we have two grand pianos, so should work out well. We met while I was working in Tokyo. We lived 200 miles apart, I didn't speak Japanese, she didn't speak English, but we both had a major interest in classical music as did the friends who introduced us. I had to learn Japanese as I was involved in contract negotiations between Japanese and US companies. My wife's recording assistance is limited to operating the clapper board and switching on the stage cameras and audio recorder while I get to slave away in the rear balcony. It's Tucson so even with A/C it gets pretty warm up there when it's 110 outside! Not to mention all the great exercise I get schlepping the gear up and down the narrow winding stairs. And all the fun getting the A/C sound out of the recording. Izotope RX is one of my best friends by now.

Chris DeVoe · April 16th, 2014, 06:02 PM

Looks like the folks at GoPro read this thread and have introduced their own Mic Stand Mount...

GoPro Mic Stand Mount | Mount your GoPro to a mic stand to capture footage during practice or performance.

...although I think the one I cobbled together is more rugged.

Hey GoPro! Send me a couple of Hero 3+ cameras and we'll call it even!

I used this new mount for a show, and it worked perfectly:

Jim Andrada · July 13th, 2014, 02:40 PM

Just a follow up to an earlier post. The pianist from Japan stayed with us for a week and we had the concert (Tchaikovsky Piano Concerto #1 and Symphony #5) on 6/21. Things went pretty well. Up in the balcony I had a BMCC as well as a JVC HM110 feeding an Atomos Ninja via a couple of Black Magic mini-converters (Component to SDI, SDI to HDMI.) Also had a Vixia 400H in the balcony with me. Only the JVC was "staffed" by me.

I bought the Vixias as used "refurbs" from B&H - they worked fine. I think the most expensive was $149.

I had another Vixia up close to the stage to get finger action and reflection of the hands in the piano, one more looking "through" the piano at the performer, and a GoPro at the back of the stage facing the audience

Everything except the JVC was locked off.

Had a few problems, such as me switching on the GoPro from my iPhone and my wife inadvertently switching it off from hers which I didn't catch until late in the game, as well as forgetting to start the Vixia in the balcony in time.

I "tried" to color match in Resolve - would give myself a C+ at best, but still better than mixing all the cams without any adjustment. Editing was multicam in Vegas 12, rendered as Cineform HD (Film Scan 1) and then compressed with Squeeze at a target bitrate of 30kb/s, Sound was cleaned up for sneeze and cough removal (as well as a late entry on a violin pizzicato) in Izotope RX3. The high bitrate made a big improvement in the YouTube video although I had to upload a 9+GB file which took more than a couple of minutes (actually a little more than 3 hours - not so bad)

Also discovered that the church had done some work on the balcony floor and every time I shifted my weight the floor would bounce and the camera would jiggle. Oh well...

Anyhow the final result was pretty well received despite a few imperfections. Here's the Concerto

Update - re the audio, it was a Schoeps M/S pair into a Sound Devices 702 in the balcony via about 200 ft of cable - fortunately I could lay the cable at the dress rehearsal and the church kindly let me leave it in place until the big day. Laying cable is a lot of work! The 702 fed a MOTU box that sent audio to all three balcony cams so I could sync with PluralEyes. It did a good job except on one track that I had to do the old fashioned way. The audio from the on stage cams was whatever they were able to record but being close to the action there wasn't much and they synced pretty well.

I used Neat Video and it did a really good job of getting rid of the video noise..

February 20th, 2014, 06:53 PM	#16
Tim Lewis Major Player Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Perth, Western Australia. Posts: 591	Re: POV camera for concert use Chris I was interested to read that you are using HF200's. I was going to suggest them perhaps as an alternative to the GoPro's. But, I didn't want to sound like I was on my favourite hobby horse. As you must know, big batteries and big cards mean you won't run out before the end of a show. I really like the custom picture settings on them, because you can get quite a nice flat picture profile that cuts in well with bigger cameras, like my HD111. __________________ Cheers Tim

February 20th, 2014, 09:52 PM	#17
Jim Andrada Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 2,211	Re: POV camera for concert use I've been thinking of a couple of the Canon (or similar) small camera as well. I think the GoPro is overpriced for what you get if the tiny size is not essential. I have two of them but would probably not get any more. I just looked up the HJ200 on B&H and it said they were no longer available. Any thoughts on a similar cam?

February 23rd, 2014, 12:56 PM	#20
Jim Andrada Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 2,211	Re: POV camera for concert use Thanks much. Our orchestra will be hosting a piano soloist from Japan in a few months and she'll be staying with us. This gives me a while to experiment with how to record the concert. I've been thinking of getting a couple of the small camcorders like the Canons for the event. The GoPro's are OK, but for the money I think there are better choices when size & toughness aren't the overriding concerns. My wife is also Japanese and we have two grand pianos, so should work out well. We met while I was working in Tokyo. We lived 200 miles apart, I didn't speak Japanese, she didn't speak English, but we both had a major interest in classical music as did the friends who introduced us. I had to learn Japanese as I was involved in contract negotiations between Japanese and US companies. My wife's recording assistance is limited to operating the clapper board and switching on the stage cameras and audio recorder while I get to slave away in the rear balcony. It's Tucson so even with A/C it gets pretty warm up there when it's 110 outside! Not to mention all the great exercise I get schlepping the gear up and down the narrow winding stairs. And all the fun getting the A/C sound out of the recording. Izotope RX is one of my best friends by now.

April 16th, 2014, 06:02 PM	#21
Chris DeVoe Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Kansas City, MO Posts: 148	Re: POV camera for concert use Looks like the folks at GoPro read this thread and have introduced their own Mic Stand Mount... GoPro Mic Stand Mount \| Mount your GoPro to a mic stand to capture footage during practice or performance. ...although I think the one I cobbled together is more rugged. Hey GoPro! Send me a couple of Hero 3+ cameras and we'll call it even! I used this new mount for a show, and it worked perfectly: Dirt - The Reverend Peyton's Big Damn Band - Reggie's Rock Club - YouTube

July 13th, 2014, 02:40 PM	#22
Jim Andrada Inner Circle Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Tucson AZ Posts: 2,211	Re: POV camera for concert use Just a follow up to an earlier post. The pianist from Japan stayed with us for a week and we had the concert (Tchaikovsky Piano Concerto #1 and Symphony #5) on 6/21. Things went pretty well. Up in the balcony I had a BMCC as well as a JVC HM110 feeding an Atomos Ninja via a couple of Black Magic mini-converters (Component to SDI, SDI to HDMI.) Also had a Vixia 400H in the balcony with me. Only the JVC was "staffed" by me. I bought the Vixias as used "refurbs" from B&H - they worked fine. I think the most expensive was $149. I had another Vixia up close to the stage to get finger action and reflection of the hands in the piano, one more looking "through" the piano at the performer, and a GoPro at the back of the stage facing the audience Everything except the JVC was locked off. Had a few problems, such as me switching on the GoPro from my iPhone and my wife inadvertently switching it off from hers which I didn't catch until late in the game, as well as forgetting to start the Vixia in the balcony in time. I "tried" to color match in Resolve - would give myself a C+ at best, but still better than mixing all the cams without any adjustment. Editing was multicam in Vegas 12, rendered as Cineform HD (Film Scan 1) and then compressed with Squeeze at a target bitrate of 30kb/s, Sound was cleaned up for sneeze and cough removal (as well as a late entry on a violin pizzicato) in Izotope RX3. The high bitrate made a big improvement in the YouTube video although I had to upload a 9+GB file which took more than a couple of minutes (actually a little more than 3 hours - not so bad) Also discovered that the church had done some work on the balcony floor and every time I shifted my weight the floor would bounce and the camera would jiggle. Oh well... Anyhow the final result was pretty well received despite a few imperfections. Here's the Concerto Tchaikovsky Piano Concerto No.1, Op. 23, Reiko Shimokawa/Tucson Repertory Orchestra - YouTube Update - re the audio, it was a Schoeps M/S pair into a Sound Devices 702 in the balcony via about 200 ft of cable - fortunately I could lay the cable at the dress rehearsal and the church kindly let me leave it in place until the big day. Laying cable is a lot of work! The 702 fed a MOTU box that sent audio to all three balcony cams so I could sync with PluralEyes. It did a good job except on one track that I had to do the old fashioned way. The audio from the on stage cams was whatever they were able to record but being close to the action there wasn't much and they synced pretty well. I used Neat Video and it did a really good job of getting rid of the video noise.. Last edited by Jim Andrada; July 13th, 2014 at 07:51 PM.