Best way to black a tape at DVinfo.net

Frank Maggi · January 10th, 2006, 10:21 AM

I'm an educator helping to train a group of elementary school teachers (http://www.eusd4kids.org/edtech/project_live.html) to create curriculum based videos with and for students. Those working in Final Cut Pro are having TC issues on capture. I've followed the plus/minus of stiping in the forums here, but for this group of (very) novice users, I think it's the right thing. My question:

Can you stripe a tape by recording on it in VTR mode (not camera), thereby bypassing the recording of ambient audio (for those who don't have FCP)?

For those who do have access to FCP, is doing the black/code through the Edit to Tape window the best way to accomplish that? Many thanks for any help you can provide.

Tom Hardwick · January 10th, 2006, 10:33 AM

You can only black a tape in the record mode. Replay mode (VCR) will simply read what's been written in the last record mode. To avoid recording ambient audio simply plug in an external mic that's switched off, or lower the manual rec levels.

But Frank - don't black. It's a waste of time and causes unnecessary head and tape wear. Nothing's gained.

tom.

Glenn Chan · January 11th, 2006, 05:32 PM

iMovie can capture over timecode breaks no problem. However:
A- iMovie clips need rendering to be played back in FCE or FCP.
B- iMovie is very buggy and will destroy your project if it's ~150+ clips/edits. At least some versions were like that. But for small projects it is very very easy to get into.

2- The latest versions of FCP can also capture over timecode breaks. However, re-capture can be extremely tricky with timecode breaks.

3- If you record over a tape with continuous anything beforehand, then you won't get TC breaks. *Some cameras like the DVX100 can be set to make a TC break in this case, but it's highly unlikely someone will intentionally do that.

4- If you ever lose timecode, you can use the "end search" function on most camcorder to pick up the last timecode.

If you know you have timecode breaks, dubbing the tape can generate new continuous timecode.

So if you know this, then don't bother blacking tapes.

Brandon Whiteside · February 1st, 2006, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom Hardwick

You can only black a tape in the record mode. Replay mode (VCR) will simply read what's been written in the last record mode. To avoid recording ambient audio simply plug in an external mic that's switched off, or lower the manual rec levels.

But Frank - don't black. It's a waste of time and causes unnecessary head and tape wear. Nothing's gained.

tom.

Why wouldnt you black a tape? tape wear with one run? howabout when you edit its a pain in the ass if the timecode doesnt match up or jumps to 00 because the tape was reviewed in the camera. i would say generate a black video in your editor and stretch it for an hour and export that to tape. now you have blanked and coded tape with no audio

Nothing is lost

Paul Doherty · February 2nd, 2006, 02:49 AM

As Tom points out it is extra work for your machine = more wear and tear.

Also four years ago I followed a discussion on this subject involving people with far more technical knowledge than me and they agreed it was a waste of time. Here's a section which seems to contain a good reason not to black a tape.

"Blacking a DV tape is pointless. There is no 'running' synchronisation with the underlying timecode while a new recording is being made. This means that the latest timecode could be somewhat adrift of the underlying blacked timecode - so if you create a gap, there will be a discontinuity at that point, and beyond, when replayed. This can disturb some capture programs, just as badly as if the timecode had reset to zero. These timecode glitches are notoriously difficult to locate - whereas a drop to zero is obvious, and can be overcome by recapturing a new section from that point (annoying, but easy to do)".

I avoid timecode breaks by always recording a "surplus" 15 seconds at the end of asession. Then if I review the footage in camera I can safely repark it in the middle of that 15 seconds, secure in the knowledge that I won't get a timecode break.

Tom Hardwick · February 2nd, 2006, 03:02 AM

Thanks Paul. It's just so easy to push the 'photo' button and record 7 seconds of still to tape, then you can rewind to review safe in the knowledge that you can stop anywhere within that 7 seconds and you'll have no timecode breaks when you continue recording.

It's no secret that hours kills cameras. Blacking tape literally halves the lifespan of your heads, it's as simple as that.

tom.

Gareth Watkins · February 2nd, 2006, 03:03 AM

the 'End Search' function works very nicely on the two sony models I have...
never had a timecode lost...

cheers
Gareth

Steve House · February 3rd, 2006, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brandon Whiteside

Why wouldnt you black a tape? tape wear with one run? howabout when you edit its a pain in the ass if the timecode doesnt match up or jumps to 00 because the tape was reviewed in the camera. i would say generate a black video in your editor and stretch it for an hour and export that to tape. now you have blanked and coded tape with no audio

Nothing is lost

But you have to do that for every tape (you always use fresh tape, don't you?) increasing the rate of head wear by 30% -- 3 passes - black, shoot, capture - versus 2 - shoot and capture - for every tape you use.

Tom Hardwick · February 3rd, 2006, 08:11 AM

As I use a VCR for capture, blacking quite literally doubles head wear, as well as capstan bearing wear, take-up clutch wear, pinch roller wear and drive motor wear.

January 10th, 2006, 10:21 AM	#1
Frank Maggi New Boot Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Valley Center, CA Posts: 14	Best way to black a tape I'm an educator helping to train a group of elementary school teachers (http://www.eusd4kids.org/edtech/project_live.html) to create curriculum based videos with and for students. Those working in Final Cut Pro are having TC issues on capture. I've followed the plus/minus of stiping in the forums here, but for this group of (very) novice users, I think it's the right thing. My question: Can you stripe a tape by recording on it in VTR mode (not camera), thereby bypassing the recording of ambient audio (for those who don't have FCP)? For those who do have access to FCP, is doing the black/code through the Edit to Tape window the best way to accomplish that? Many thanks for any help you can provide.

February 2nd, 2006, 02:49 AM	#5
Paul Doherty Regular Crew Join Date: May 2003 Location: Sherburn, England Posts: 136	Why wouldn't you black a tape As Tom points out it is extra work for your machine = more wear and tear. Also four years ago I followed a discussion on this subject involving people with far more technical knowledge than me and they agreed it was a waste of time. Here's a section which seems to contain a good reason not to black a tape. "Blacking a DV tape is pointless. There is no 'running' synchronisation with the underlying timecode while a new recording is being made. This means that the latest timecode could be somewhat adrift of the underlying blacked timecode - so if you create a gap, there will be a discontinuity at that point, and beyond, when replayed. This can disturb some capture programs, just as badly as if the timecode had reset to zero. These timecode glitches are notoriously difficult to locate - whereas a drop to zero is obvious, and can be overcome by recapturing a new section from that point (annoying, but easy to do)". I avoid timecode breaks by always recording a "surplus" 15 seconds at the end of asession. Then if I review the footage in camera I can safely repark it in the middle of that 15 seconds, secure in the knowledge that I won't get a timecode break.

January 10th, 2006, 10:33 AM	#2
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	You can only black a tape in the record mode. Replay mode (VCR) will simply read what's been written in the last record mode. To avoid recording ambient audio simply plug in an external mic that's switched off, or lower the manual rec levels. But Frank - don't black. It's a waste of time and causes unnecessary head and tape wear. Nothing's gained. tom.

January 11th, 2006, 05:32 PM	#3
Glenn Chan Inner Circle Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Toronto, Canada Posts: 4,750	iMovie can capture over timecode breaks no problem. However: A- iMovie clips need rendering to be played back in FCE or FCP. B- iMovie is very buggy and will destroy your project if it's ~150+ clips/edits. At least some versions were like that. But for small projects it is very very easy to get into. 2- The latest versions of FCP can also capture over timecode breaks. However, re-capture can be extremely tricky with timecode breaks. 3- If you record over a tape with continuous anything beforehand, then you won't get TC breaks. *Some cameras like the DVX100 can be set to make a TC break in this case, but it's highly unlikely someone will intentionally do that. 4- If you ever lose timecode, you can use the "end search" function on most camcorder to pick up the last timecode. If you know you have timecode breaks, dubbing the tape can generate new continuous timecode. So if you know this, then don't bother blacking tapes.

February 2nd, 2006, 03:02 AM	#6
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	Thanks Paul. It's just so easy to push the 'photo' button and record 7 seconds of still to tape, then you can rewind to review safe in the knowledge that you can stop anywhere within that 7 seconds and you'll have no timecode breaks when you continue recording. It's no secret that hours kills cameras. Blacking tape literally halves the lifespan of your heads, it's as simple as that. tom.

February 2nd, 2006, 03:03 AM	#7
Gareth Watkins Major Player Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: France Posts: 578	the 'End Search' function works very nicely on the two sony models I have... never had a timecode lost... cheers Gareth

February 3rd, 2006, 08:11 AM	#9
Tom Hardwick Inner Circle Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Billericay, England UK Posts: 4,711	As I use a VCR for capture, blacking quite literally doubles head wear, as well as capstan bearing wear, take-up clutch wear, pinch roller wear and drive motor wear.