Sony HVR M15 image problems at DVinfo.net

Graham Thomas · January 30th, 2013, 05:46 PM

Hi all. Newbie here.
I have been using a Sony HVR M15 to capture from a Sony HDR FX7.
The camera is set to output 1080i through iLink and the M15 is also set to receive this.
I am recording at 50i on the deck and all the indicators show all is well.
The problem is when I try to import into imovie the image quality is about equivalent to composite!
Imovie is set to import at full quality and I am not having any issues with timecode or deck control.
Does anyone have any ideas as to why the image quality is so poor?
I ensured that the iLink cables were connected while the camera and deck were unpowered and did the same with Mac Pro that I am using. I am also using brand new Sony HDV tapes.
I am just about at my wits end so any advice would be gratefully received.
Thanks

Pedanes Bol · January 30th, 2013, 05:50 PM

If you are judging the image quality by looking at the preview during import that's how it looks. But the actual imported video should be fine.

Graham Thomas · January 31st, 2013, 01:20 AM

Thanks for that.
Sadly, it's the same poor quality when the imported video is viewed.
Not just in the import preview window but in the event on playback.
Still puzzled!

Graham Thomas · January 31st, 2013, 11:16 AM

A further update.
I have checked the output into a monitor and I am getting 1080i on the analogue component outputs.
I have tried importing into Final Cut Pro and the same issue occurs with imported video.
I can now only assume that there is an issue with the ilink output.
I have tried a new ilink to firewire 800 cable and still the same.
The strange thing is that both imovie and Final Cut control the deck fine.
I think I am just going to use a Blackmagic Intensity and use the component outputs of deck and see how that imports.
Still looking for any other ideas anyone may have though so please feel free to comment.

Tom Wills · February 1st, 2013, 01:32 AM

Funny, I just happen to have used one of these decks at my old job, and I think I know the problem you're having. Check page 51 of the manual - I bet you've got the iLink downconversion turned on.

Under the In/Out Rec menu, go to iLink set, and then go to "Off" under Down Convert. Then, it'll spit out HDV over the Firewire port. If Down Convert is on, you're going to get SD DVCAM out of the port, which will, as you found, look pretty bad, at least in comparison to the original HDV.

Hope that helps.

Graham Thomas · February 1st, 2013, 03:30 AM

Hi and thanks.
I checked the iLink setting and it is off.
I list below the In/Out Rec settings
HDV/DV SEL HDV
REC MODE (Grayed out but when you scroll to it it shows DV SP)
VIDEO OUT When executed shows COMPONENT 1080i/576i
iLINK SET OFF
COLOR BAR OFF
BARS TYPE TYPE 1
DV BARS 16:9
EE/PB SEL EE
480i LEVEL. SMPTE

Should I have anything else set differently?

Adam Gold · February 3rd, 2013, 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham Thomas

I have been using a Sony HVR M15 to capture from a Sony HDR FX7.
The camera is set to output 1080i through iLink and the M15 is also set to receive this.
I am recording at 50i on the deck

Wait, what? Are you dubbing from the cam to the deck, that is, making a copy of a tape to another tape on the deck, then capturing from the second tape to FCP or iMovie on a computer? Could be the downconversion is happening at the cam. Make sure all those settings you have confirmed on the deck are the same on the FX7 and you are not down converting there -- make sure i.Link CONV is OFF on the FX7 as well.

Why aren't you just popping the tape you shot on the FX7 into the deck and capturing from that? Why is the deck "receiving" anything? The deck should only be sending, not receiving.

Just capture directly into your NLE straight from the original tape, using either the FX7 or the M15, making sure there is no downconversion in either playback unit, and make sure all the settings match in your NLE. I know this sounds patronizing and condescending, but your original post makes it sound as if you are making a completely unnecessary dub.

Graham Thomas · February 3rd, 2013, 03:48 AM

No Adam, that's not correct.
I am using the ilink out of the FX7 into the M15 to capture live footage. I am not taping with the FX7 just using it as a HD camera.
The only recording is taking place on the M15.
The output of the FX7 is set to 1080i and the tape from the M15 has recorded HD footage as I can play it back through the component outputs and my Sony TV indicates that it is a 1080i input and the quality of the playback is great. It's only when I try to import the footage into either imovie or FCP that it appears rubbish!
Thanks for your input tho.

Pedanes Bol · February 3rd, 2013, 09:33 AM

I don't have M15 but I have another Sony deck. At the I/O settings below, I import HDV footage to iMovie without any problems.

HDV/DV SEL --> AUTO
DV REC MODE --> SP
iLINK CONV --> OFF
A/V -> DV OUT --> OFF

You may want to check the actual imported MOV file in QuickTime inspector to see whether the format shows AIC 1920x1080 resolution.

Graham Thomas · February 3rd, 2013, 03:15 PM

Thanks Pedanes,
I tried your suggestions but, sadly, it has made no difference.
I already had the M15 set on HDV as I read on another forum that the auto setting can confuse the NLE you use.
I'm going to try shooting HD on tape on the FX7 and importing that into imovie or FCP and see what happens there. If that's OK I'll try and import the same tape from the M15 and see what happens.

Pedanes Bol · February 3rd, 2013, 04:48 PM

What is the file extension of the file you imported via iMovie? If it is .MOV then check the resolution as I suggested earlier. If it is .dv then you need to find out why your M15 deck is outputting DV instead of HDV.

Adam Gold · February 3rd, 2013, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graham Thomas

I am using the ilink out of the FX7 into the M15 to capture live footage. I am not taping with the FX7 just using it as a HD camera.
The only recording is taking place on the M15.

Ah, okay got it.

Why?

Graham Thomas · February 4th, 2013, 04:43 PM

The reason I'm taping on the M15 and not the FX7 is because I'm filming a research project and sessions are typically over three hours.
I can't enter the room where the research is taking place during the filming so I am unable to change tapes.

Adam Gold · February 5th, 2013, 12:22 AM

It all makes sense to me now.

The most common reason for this type of thing is a settings mismatch in your NLE. Not saying that's what's happening here, only that it's the usual reason. Can you post a screen grab of all your settings in the Mac?

January 30th, 2013, 05:46 PM	#1
Graham Thomas New Boot Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: UK Posts: 7	Sony HVR M15 image problems Hi all. Newbie here. I have been using a Sony HVR M15 to capture from a Sony HDR FX7. The camera is set to output 1080i through iLink and the M15 is also set to receive this. I am recording at 50i on the deck and all the indicators show all is well. The problem is when I try to import into imovie the image quality is about equivalent to composite! Imovie is set to import at full quality and I am not having any issues with timecode or deck control. Does anyone have any ideas as to why the image quality is so poor? I ensured that the iLink cables were connected while the camera and deck were unpowered and did the same with Mac Pro that I am using. I am also using brand new Sony HDV tapes. I am just about at my wits end so any advice would be gratefully received. Thanks

January 30th, 2013, 05:50 PM	#2
Pedanes Bol Regular Crew Join Date: May 2007 Location: Boston MA Posts: 167	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems If you are judging the image quality by looking at the preview during import that's how it looks. But the actual imported video should be fine.

January 31st, 2013, 01:20 AM	#3
Graham Thomas New Boot Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: UK Posts: 7	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems Thanks for that. Sadly, it's the same poor quality when the imported video is viewed. Not just in the import preview window but in the event on playback. Still puzzled!

January 31st, 2013, 11:16 AM	#4
Graham Thomas New Boot Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: UK Posts: 7	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems A further update. I have checked the output into a monitor and I am getting 1080i on the analogue component outputs. I have tried importing into Final Cut Pro and the same issue occurs with imported video. I can now only assume that there is an issue with the ilink output. I have tried a new ilink to firewire 800 cable and still the same. The strange thing is that both imovie and Final Cut control the deck fine. I think I am just going to use a Blackmagic Intensity and use the component outputs of deck and see how that imports. Still looking for any other ideas anyone may have though so please feel free to comment.

February 1st, 2013, 01:32 AM	#5
Tom Wills Major Player Join Date: May 2005 Location: Philadelphia, PA Posts: 326	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems Funny, I just happen to have used one of these decks at my old job, and I think I know the problem you're having. Check page 51 of the manual - I bet you've got the iLink downconversion turned on. Under the In/Out Rec menu, go to iLink set, and then go to "Off" under Down Convert. Then, it'll spit out HDV over the Firewire port. If Down Convert is on, you're going to get SD DVCAM out of the port, which will, as you found, look pretty bad, at least in comparison to the original HDV. Hope that helps.

February 1st, 2013, 03:30 AM	#6
Graham Thomas New Boot Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: UK Posts: 7	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems Hi and thanks. I checked the iLink setting and it is off. I list below the In/Out Rec settings HDV/DV SEL HDV REC MODE (Grayed out but when you scroll to it it shows DV SP) VIDEO OUT When executed shows COMPONENT 1080i/576i iLINK SET OFF COLOR BAR OFF BARS TYPE TYPE 1 DV BARS 16:9 EE/PB SEL EE 480i LEVEL. SMPTE Should I have anything else set differently?

February 3rd, 2013, 03:48 AM	#8
Graham Thomas New Boot Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: UK Posts: 7	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems No Adam, that's not correct. I am using the ilink out of the FX7 into the M15 to capture live footage. I am not taping with the FX7 just using it as a HD camera. The only recording is taking place on the M15. The output of the FX7 is set to 1080i and the tape from the M15 has recorded HD footage as I can play it back through the component outputs and my Sony TV indicates that it is a 1080i input and the quality of the playback is great. It's only when I try to import the footage into either imovie or FCP that it appears rubbish! Thanks for your input tho.

February 3rd, 2013, 09:33 AM	#9
Pedanes Bol Regular Crew Join Date: May 2007 Location: Boston MA Posts: 167	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems I don't have M15 but I have another Sony deck. At the I/O settings below, I import HDV footage to iMovie without any problems. HDV/DV SEL --> AUTO DV REC MODE --> SP iLINK CONV --> OFF A/V -> DV OUT --> OFF You may want to check the actual imported MOV file in QuickTime inspector to see whether the format shows AIC 1920x1080 resolution.

February 3rd, 2013, 03:15 PM	#10
Graham Thomas New Boot Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: UK Posts: 7	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems Thanks Pedanes, I tried your suggestions but, sadly, it has made no difference. I already had the M15 set on HDV as I read on another forum that the auto setting can confuse the NLE you use. I'm going to try shooting HD on tape on the FX7 and importing that into imovie or FCP and see what happens there. If that's OK I'll try and import the same tape from the M15 and see what happens.

February 3rd, 2013, 04:48 PM	#11
Pedanes Bol Regular Crew Join Date: May 2007 Location: Boston MA Posts: 167	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems What is the file extension of the file you imported via iMovie? If it is .MOV then check the resolution as I suggested earlier. If it is .dv then you need to find out why your M15 deck is outputting DV instead of HDV.

February 4th, 2013, 04:43 PM	#13
Graham Thomas New Boot Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: UK Posts: 7	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems The reason I'm taping on the M15 and not the FX7 is because I'm filming a research project and sessions are typically over three hours. I can't enter the room where the research is taking place during the filming so I am unable to change tapes.

February 5th, 2013, 12:22 AM	#14
Adam Gold Inner Circle Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Woodinville, WA USA Posts: 3,467	Re: Sony HVR M15 image problems It all makes sense to me now. The most common reason for this type of thing is a settings mismatch in your NLE. Not saying that's what's happening here, only that it's the usual reason. Can you post a screen grab of all your settings in the Mac? __________________ "It can only be attributable to human error... This sort of thing has cropped up before, and it has always been due to human error."