BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I buy? at DVinfo.net

Alessandro Machi · October 21st, 2012, 05:59 PM

I want to maintain the exact image I have my audio and color corrected betacam sp video master. I would like to go out analog component (R-Y, B-Y, Y) and go through a box that converts the betacam sp videotape to 720P HD, 16 x 9, then from that same box, be able to output into a Mac Mini and upload to my computer as a 720P HD 16 x 9 file.

Is this possible? What box do I need? Are there choices?

Thanks in advance.

Alessandro Machi · October 21st, 2012, 06:01 PM

I left the word "on" out of my prior post, I guess there is no edit function? It's been a while since my last post.

William Hohauser · October 22nd, 2012, 03:45 AM

Any "box" that can capture in ProRes or uncompressed will do. AJA, Matrox, Blackmagic all have various devices that you should be able to rent locally but if it's just one or two tapes, it might make more sense to bring the master to a production house and have them transfer it to a file for you. This will save you a lot of headaches especially if you are working with a MacMini.

Alessandro Machi · October 22nd, 2012, 11:47 AM

Yes, it seems like what I want, which I thought would be simple, is not so simple.

My goal is to uprez the betacam sp signal to HD, but not uncompressed. Then send the compressed HD signal into my mac mini.

I could probably fill up a mac mini's hard drive with one long betacam sp master tape if I am going in uncompressed. It seems to me that the thunderbolt should have input compression settings, no?

William Hohauser · October 22nd, 2012, 03:51 PM

No. Thuderbolt is a data port and not able to convert things, that's up to your software and computer.

Alessandro Machi · October 22nd, 2012, 06:24 PM

I am trying to avoid software conversions and uncompressed signals since the edit masters are fine exactly as they are and I won't have ample hard drive space. Apparently the Black Magic Teranex 2d is exactly what I need, although it costs 1,895.00, but probably worth it if one can afford it.

The idea is, the betacam sp signal is uprezzed to Hd and also then compressed, probably in Apple Hi-Res, which compresses the image by 8-1 with excellent results, then that would be imported into the computer to save hard drive space.

William Hohauser · October 22nd, 2012, 08:01 PM

Just take the tape to a pro video house and ask for a ProResHQ file of it. You will have what you need and can focus on other things.

Alessandro Machi · October 22nd, 2012, 09:35 PM

Yes, but I could have situations where this comes up regularly and since these are archived tapes, the costs will add up quickly versus the initial return they might generate.

Rental would be an option, maybe.

Any box cheaper than that one. Although the Teranex 2d does seem to do a lot for the money.

William Hohauser · October 23rd, 2012, 03:28 AM

The Intensity Shuttle with Thumderbolt might be just what you need and it's a very reasonable price. Hardware up-conversion is nice but the software we have now can do as good a job.

Shaun Roemich · October 23rd, 2012, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alessandro Machi

Although the Teranex 2d does seem to do a lot for the money.

That is an UNDERSTATEMENT. Until BlackMagic Design bought Teranex, the boxes were upwards of $80,000. WITHOUT Thunderbolt connectivity...

It may be overkill for what you need but the things are MONSTERS at that price...

Trying to find a business model to buy two of them...

Shaun Roemich · October 23rd, 2012, 08:47 AM

Back to your original post:

EXACT image from BetaSP?

Realize you VERY likely have a 4:3 BetaSP master. (Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the colour and organic softness of well shot SP...)

So you need to make a decision around whether to crop or pillerbox when going to HD.

As well, the colour space changes from SD to HD.

AND you are taking an interlaced image and converting to Progressive scan.

You WON'T get an EXACT image.

What you are looking for is a high quality up-res.

Options are available. The Teranex is certainly where I would spend my money if I were buying a solution.

William is right in suggesting taking your masters to a post house set up to do this sort of thing. ESPECIALLY if broadcast compliance is important...

Alessandro Machi · October 23rd, 2012, 01:57 PM

I remember seeing Betacam Sp images from around 1993 that looked absolutely spectacular. Organic softness is an interesting way to describe it. I would suggest the one reason HD looks "sharper" is simply because the monitors are brighter than CRT monitors.

I love CRT monitors, there's something to be said for the use of space to send those beams through. Just like I love film, it's actually got layers to it.

But I digress. Both are good transfer suggestions up above. I am going to start with my Black Magic Video Recorder H.264, and then work my way up to the hard box H.264 that comes with media express software, all for under 500.00, or wait until I have the funds to get the Teranex 2d.

My one goal of not using up a lot of hard drive space can primarily be achieved by compressing the image as it is going into the computer, so for now, the Video Recorder H.264 should suffice, I think.

William Hohauser · October 24th, 2012, 02:49 AM

H264 is the opposite from what you have been describing up to now. It's fine for viewing on a computer and sending files over the Internet but for quality? Not the best at all. To go from the Teranex to h.264 is a very big jump.

Alessandro Machi · October 24th, 2012, 03:59 AM

I don't have a thunderbolt version mac mini, so what options do I actually have at this point. Doesn't the Teranex 2d need a thunderbolt connection?

October 21st, 2012, 05:59 PM	#1
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I buy? I want to maintain the exact image I have my audio and color corrected betacam sp video master. I would like to go out analog component (R-Y, B-Y, Y) and go through a box that converts the betacam sp videotape to 720P HD, 16 x 9, then from that same box, be able to output into a Mac Mini and upload to my computer as a 720P HD 16 x 9 file. Is this possible? What box do I need? Are there choices? Thanks in advance.

October 21st, 2012, 06:01 PM	#2
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I I left the word "on" out of my prior post, I guess there is no edit function? It's been a while since my last post.

October 22nd, 2012, 03:45 AM	#3
William Hohauser Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 2,650	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I Any "box" that can capture in ProRes or uncompressed will do. AJA, Matrox, Blackmagic all have various devices that you should be able to rent locally but if it's just one or two tapes, it might make more sense to bring the master to a production house and have them transfer it to a file for you. This will save you a lot of headaches especially if you are working with a MacMini. __________________ William Hohauser - New York City Producer/Edit/Camera/Animation

October 22nd, 2012, 11:47 AM	#4
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I Yes, it seems like what I want, which I thought would be simple, is not so simple. My goal is to uprez the betacam sp signal to HD, but not uncompressed. Then send the compressed HD signal into my mac mini. I could probably fill up a mac mini's hard drive with one long betacam sp master tape if I am going in uncompressed. It seems to me that the thunderbolt should have input compression settings, no?

October 22nd, 2012, 03:51 PM	#5
William Hohauser Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 2,650	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I No. Thuderbolt is a data port and not able to convert things, that's up to your software and computer. __________________ William Hohauser - New York City Producer/Edit/Camera/Animation Last edited by William Hohauser; October 22nd, 2012 at 07:59 PM.

October 22nd, 2012, 06:24 PM	#6
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I I am trying to avoid software conversions and uncompressed signals since the edit masters are fine exactly as they are and I won't have ample hard drive space. Apparently the Black Magic Teranex 2d is exactly what I need, although it costs 1,895.00, but probably worth it if one can afford it. The idea is, the betacam sp signal is uprezzed to Hd and also then compressed, probably in Apple Hi-Res, which compresses the image by 8-1 with excellent results, then that would be imported into the computer to save hard drive space.

October 22nd, 2012, 08:01 PM	#7
William Hohauser Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 2,650	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I Just take the tape to a pro video house and ask for a ProResHQ file of it. You will have what you need and can focus on other things. __________________ William Hohauser - New York City Producer/Edit/Camera/Animation

October 22nd, 2012, 09:35 PM	#8
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I Yes, but I could have situations where this comes up regularly and since these are archived tapes, the costs will add up quickly versus the initial return they might generate. Rental would be an option, maybe. Any box cheaper than that one. Although the Teranex 2d does seem to do a lot for the money.

October 23rd, 2012, 03:28 AM	#9
William Hohauser Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 2,650	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I The Intensity Shuttle with Thumderbolt might be just what you need and it's a very reasonable price. Hardware up-conversion is nice but the software we have now can do as good a job. __________________ William Hohauser - New York City Producer/Edit/Camera/Animation

October 23rd, 2012, 08:47 AM	#11
Shaun Roemich Inner Circle Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Vancouver, British Columbia (formerly Winnipeg, Manitoba) Canada Posts: 4,088	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I Back to your original post: EXACT image from BetaSP? Realize you VERY likely have a 4:3 BetaSP master. (Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the colour and organic softness of well shot SP...) So you need to make a decision around whether to crop or pillerbox when going to HD. As well, the colour space changes from SD to HD. AND you are taking an interlaced image and converting to Progressive scan. You WON'T get an EXACT image. What you are looking for is a high quality up-res. Options are available. The Teranex is certainly where I would spend my money if I were buying a solution. William is right in suggesting taking your masters to a post house set up to do this sort of thing. ESPECIALLY if broadcast compliance is important... __________________ Shaun C. Roemich Road Dog Media - Vancouver, BC - Videographer - Webcaster www.roaddogmedia.ca Blog: http://roaddogmedia.wordpress.com/

October 23rd, 2012, 01:57 PM	#12
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I I remember seeing Betacam Sp images from around 1993 that looked absolutely spectacular. Organic softness is an interesting way to describe it. I would suggest the one reason HD looks "sharper" is simply because the monitors are brighter than CRT monitors. I love CRT monitors, there's something to be said for the use of space to send those beams through. Just like I love film, it's actually got layers to it. But I digress. Both are good transfer suggestions up above. I am going to start with my Black Magic Video Recorder H.264, and then work my way up to the hard box H.264 that comes with media express software, all for under 500.00, or wait until I have the funds to get the Teranex 2d. My one goal of not using up a lot of hard drive space can primarily be achieved by compressing the image as it is going into the computer, so for now, the Video Recorder H.264 should suffice, I think.

October 24th, 2012, 02:49 AM	#13
William Hohauser Inner Circle Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 2,650	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I H264 is the opposite from what you have been describing up to now. It's fine for viewing on a computer and sending files over the Internet but for quality? Not the best at all. To go from the Teranex to h.264 is a very big jump. __________________ William Hohauser - New York City Producer/Edit/Camera/Animation

October 24th, 2012, 03:59 AM	#14
Alessandro Machi Major Player Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Los Angeles, Ca USA Posts: 553	Re: BetacamSP Edited Master Tape Transferred directly to 720P HD 16x9, what Box do I I don't have a thunderbolt version mac mini, so what options do I actually have at this point. Doesn't the Teranex 2d need a thunderbolt connection?