Mini Dv Tape Lifespan at DVinfo.net

Tony Marino · July 18th, 2005, 07:53 PM

Does anyone know the average lifespan of mini dv tapes? I want to make some copies of important tapes and store them, but don't know how often I should make another copy.

Thanks,
Tony

Dan Diaconu · July 18th, 2005, 09:00 PM

Tony,
One way is to burn DVD in AVI format (and keep a DVD player working)
I can not comment for mini DV as I only used them for 5 years (and they are all fine), but I can tell you for Hi8. I have tapes from 1991 (14 years) and they are all as the day I have shoot them. Not a drop out, nothing. I hope this helps.

Wesley Wong · July 19th, 2005, 03:26 AM

I disagree.

A properly kept miniDV tape (in dry box storage for humid countries) last longer than a laser 'burnt' DVD - which is susceptible to Dvd rot ~ the surface of the dvd corroding and thus preventing the contents from being recognised.

Ash Greyson · July 19th, 2005, 10:26 AM

DV will last longer than DVD-R... I have been shooting since 1996 on DV and all my original tapes still work. I have made a back-up of all of them and keep them stored in a cool dry place.

ash =o)

Phil Hamilton · December 5th, 2005, 11:53 AM

I use Mindidv to write my projects back to. I also archive all associated footage before rendering and after rendering to DVD.

Question - where can I find some definitive information regarding the best archiving workflow for my digital assets? I use MiniDV and DVD. Which brands are best? What about DVD+R,-R,+RW, etc.?

Thoughts or comments would be appreciated....phil

Ash Greyson · December 5th, 2005, 03:02 PM

Ahhhhh... and there's the rub with digital acquisition. What becomes of archiving? Tape is by far and away the best solution now. Burnable media will always have a shorter life unless they can figure a way not to use dye. Solid state media is just way too expensive and too small for now.

Best bet? Keep your DV tapes and back your HDDs up to DLTs

ash =o)

Phil Hamilton · December 5th, 2005, 04:10 PM

[QUOTE=Ash Greyson]Ahhhhh... and there's the rub with digital acquisition. What becomes of archiving? Tape is by far and away the best solution now. Burnable media will always have a shorter life unless they can figure a way not to use dye. Solid state media is just way too expensive and too small for now.

Best bet? Keep your DV tapes and back your HDDs up to DLTs
QUOTE]

Is there a document which compares the life of DVD media? What is meant by short life? I don't have a DLT drive but have always backed up to MiniDV as one method. What I'm reading is that DVD isn't the best way to go? Does this mean that all the DVD movies I've purchased over the years will start degrading soon? What is soon? 25 years? 2 years? tks ph

Duane Smith · December 5th, 2005, 07:51 PM

Phil, I think you're missing a very important distinction here between home-made 'burnt' discs and retail 'replicated' discs:

BURNT (aka 'duplicated') DVDs made with blank DVD-R, +R, -RW, +RW discs will most likely degrade fairly quickly because the digital data is 'etched' into a dye layer with a weak laser...

...whereas GLASS-MASTERED (aka 'replicated') DVDs made at a disc manufacturing facility (meaning the retail DVD movies you've purchased over the years) should *NOT* suffer the same 'quick' degradedation because the digital data is stamped in a hydrolic mold and then bonded to a reflective layer with a spin-coated liquid acrylic.

In other words, all DVDs are not created equal. 8-)

Phil Hamilton · December 6th, 2005, 11:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duane Smith

BURNT (aka 'duplicated') DVDs made with blank DVD-R, +R, -RW, +RW discs will most likely degrade fairly quickly because the digital data is 'etched' into a dye layer with a weak laser...
. 8-)

Thank your for the clarification. I did not know that but it makes sense. Is there a standard as to how long DVDs burnt at home will last? what does it mean "degrade fairly quickly"? tks.

Doug Boze · December 10th, 2005, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ash Greyson

Best bet? Keep your DV tapes and back your HDDs up to DLTs

Damn straight! DLTs are as close to eternity as you can get. They're just so blasted slow...

Ash Greyson · December 11th, 2005, 01:11 AM

Until there is solid state media, tape is the best archival solution. DVD-R lifespan varies wildly on how you store them. The media makers like to quote 100 years but that is pure crap and based on a disc staying in sterile lab controlled conditions, even then that is only for their top flight flagship archival quality media. Most media you walk into a store and buy is rated at 20 - 30 years but in real life situations, cut that in at least half.

Taiyo Yuden media is widely considered the best media with the best dye.

ash =o)

PS another issue about going to DVD is that you have to recompress your already compressed DV footage so you are not preserving it in the best manner

Theo Mason · December 12th, 2005, 04:22 PM

I am running into DVDs made by local producers that have failed after about a year. I have fixed a few by reauthoring the disks, although I was unable to get rid of all the artifacts caused by degradation of the DVDs. I also was unable to determine brand names on any of the failures.

I believe there are some Burner/DVD Blanks combos that make a barely readable DVD and are apt to fail after a very short lifespan.

I keep all my important archives on the original DV tapes and hope for the best, although the cost of hard drive space has been coming down so drastically I am considering a redundant hard drive archive system for long term storage.

Reguards,

Ash Greyson · December 13th, 2005, 12:22 AM

Most unbranded media is pure junk and can fail in a matter of months.

ash =o)

Doug Boze · December 13th, 2005, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ash Greyson

PS another issue about going to DVD is that you have to recompress your already compressed DV footage so you are not preserving it in the best manner

Unless, of course, you are recording a data DVD. But, as I have discovered, those are extremely unreliable. I once backed up an entire project onto DVD-Rs as data, even going to the trouble of a bit-for-bit verification which, perversely, they passed. Net practical result? Each disc was only partially readable, i.e., the directory would be readable, but only part of the files were accessable.

Another knock against DVD is the feeble storage capacity. It takes four DVDs to equal an hour of DV. Brings back joyful memories of those halcyon days of yesteryear when we backed up our PCs with floppy discs. Say, there's an idea for video archiving... <G>

I think the most attractive method for archiving, both from the ease-of-use factor and the reliability issue is removeable harddrives. They are about the cheapest way to go, too.

Jamie le Moreno · December 13th, 2005, 04:29 PM

The reasaon why most of you guys dvd's live a short life is 'cause you don't handle them right. I see people throwing their cds/dvds and then they complain the discs won't play anymore .. I keep my own cds/dvds totaly scratch free, then they will last like 30 years like they supposed to ..

July 18th, 2005, 07:53 PM	#1
Tony Marino Regular Crew Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: St. Louis, MO Posts: 55	Mini Dv Tape Lifespan Does anyone know the average lifespan of mini dv tapes? I want to make some copies of important tapes and store them, but don't know how often I should make another copy. Thanks, Tony

July 19th, 2005, 03:26 AM	#3
Wesley Wong Regular Crew Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 143	I disagree. A properly kept miniDV tape (in dry box storage for humid countries) last longer than a laser 'burnt' DVD - which is susceptible to Dvd rot ~ the surface of the dvd corroding and thus preventing the contents from being recognised. __________________ Do more, learn more

December 5th, 2005, 11:53 AM	#5
Phil Hamilton Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 150	Archiving capabality with MiniDV I use Mindidv to write my projects back to. I also archive all associated footage before rendering and after rendering to DVD. Question - where can I find some definitive information regarding the best archiving workflow for my digital assets? I use MiniDV and DVD. Which brands are best? What about DVD+R,-R,+RW, etc.? Thoughts or comments would be appreciated....phil __________________ Phil Hamilton hamiltonp@sbcglobal.net Dallas, Texas " I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! ..."

December 5th, 2005, 04:10 PM	#7
Phil Hamilton Regular Crew Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 150	[QUOTE=Ash Greyson]Ahhhhh... and there's the rub with digital acquisition. What becomes of archiving? Tape is by far and away the best solution now. Burnable media will always have a shorter life unless they can figure a way not to use dye. Solid state media is just way too expensive and too small for now. Best bet? Keep your DV tapes and back your HDDs up to DLTs QUOTE] Is there a document which compares the life of DVD media? What is meant by short life? I don't have a DLT drive but have always backed up to MiniDV as one method. What I'm reading is that DVD isn't the best way to go? Does this mean that all the DVD movies I've purchased over the years will start degrading soon? What is soon? 25 years? 2 years? tks ph __________________ Phil Hamilton hamiltonp@sbcglobal.net Dallas, Texas " I'm shocked, shocked to find that gambling is going on in here! ..."

December 12th, 2005, 04:22 PM	#12
Theo Mason New Boot Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Billings, Montana Posts: 10	I am running into DVDs made by local producers that have failed after about a year. I have fixed a few by reauthoring the disks, although I was unable to get rid of all the artifacts caused by degradation of the DVDs. I also was unable to determine brand names on any of the failures. I believe there are some Burner/DVD Blanks combos that make a barely readable DVD and are apt to fail after a very short lifespan. I keep all my important archives on the original DV tapes and hope for the best, although the cost of hard drive space has been coming down so drastically I am considering a redundant hard drive archive system for long term storage. Reguards, __________________ Theo Mason My Photo & Video Webs: www.risingsunwholesale.com www.joelovelamps.com www.risingsunretail.com

July 18th, 2005, 09:00 PM	#2
Dan Diaconu Major Player Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 804	Tony, One way is to burn DVD in AVI format (and keep a DVD player working) I can not comment for mini DV as I only used them for 5 years (and they are all fine), but I can tell you for Hi8. I have tapes from 1991 (14 years) and they are all as the day I have shoot them. Not a drop out, nothing. I hope this helps.

July 19th, 2005, 10:26 AM	#4
Ash Greyson Trustee Join Date: May 2003 Location: Tulsa, OK Posts: 1,689	DV will last longer than DVD-R... I have been shooting since 1996 on DV and all my original tapes still work. I have made a back-up of all of them and keep them stored in a cool dry place. ash =o)

December 5th, 2005, 03:02 PM	#6
Ash Greyson Trustee Join Date: May 2003 Location: Tulsa, OK Posts: 1,689	Ahhhhh... and there's the rub with digital acquisition. What becomes of archiving? Tape is by far and away the best solution now. Burnable media will always have a shorter life unless they can figure a way not to use dye. Solid state media is just way too expensive and too small for now. Best bet? Keep your DV tapes and back your HDDs up to DLTs ash =o)

December 5th, 2005, 07:51 PM	#8
Duane Smith Major Player Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 234	Phil, I think you're missing a very important distinction here between home-made 'burnt' discs and retail 'replicated' discs: BURNT (aka 'duplicated') DVDs made with blank DVD-R, +R, -RW, +RW discs will most likely degrade fairly quickly because the digital data is 'etched' into a dye layer with a weak laser... ...whereas GLASS-MASTERED (aka 'replicated') DVDs made at a disc manufacturing facility (meaning the retail DVD movies you've purchased over the years) should NOT suffer the same 'quick' degradedation because the digital data is stamped in a hydrolic mold and then bonded to a reflective layer with a spin-coated liquid acrylic. In other words, all DVDs are not created equal. 8-)

December 11th, 2005, 01:11 AM	#11
Ash Greyson Trustee Join Date: May 2003 Location: Tulsa, OK Posts: 1,689	Until there is solid state media, tape is the best archival solution. DVD-R lifespan varies wildly on how you store them. The media makers like to quote 100 years but that is pure crap and based on a disc staying in sterile lab controlled conditions, even then that is only for their top flight flagship archival quality media. Most media you walk into a store and buy is rated at 20 - 30 years but in real life situations, cut that in at least half. Taiyo Yuden media is widely considered the best media with the best dye. ash =o) PS another issue about going to DVD is that you have to recompress your already compressed DV footage so you are not preserving it in the best manner

December 13th, 2005, 12:22 AM	#13
Ash Greyson Trustee Join Date: May 2003 Location: Tulsa, OK Posts: 1,689	Most unbranded media is pure junk and can fail in a matter of months. ash =o)

December 13th, 2005, 04:29 PM	#15
Jamie le Moreno New Boot Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Amsterdam, the Netherlands Posts: 5	The reasaon why most of you guys dvd's live a short life is 'cause you don't handle them right. I see people throwing their cds/dvds and then they complain the discs won't play anymore .. I keep my own cds/dvds totaly scratch free, then they will last like 30 years like they supposed to .. __________________ http://img331.imageshack.us/img331/4...pvgs4007fx.png